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Mysidia
05-27-2013, 05:50 PM
One of the cards that mtg players often look for are the dual lands.
One land able to produce 2 types of mana.

Still in pre alpha... i doubt we will see these cards anytime soon... but when it actually do happen, what do you think will be it impact?

wallofomens
05-27-2013, 05:57 PM
There has already been a discussion about that. There is what looks like a dual resource on one of the kickstarter images(I think the auction house one).

As I've said before, I hope they keep duals at a rather low power level and at common/uncommon.

Genocidal
05-27-2013, 05:59 PM
With threshold and resources not being tied the way they are in Magic, there will have to be bigger drawbacks to multi-colored resources than in Magic. If I had to guess, I would assume that the first set that comes out will be modal (choose one of two threshold and add that) and deal a damage or two. Being digital I think there's a lot of room for creativity in this space, however. For example, making a random card in your deck have a debuff of some sort, or removing a card from the game at random, or giving your opponent some sort of advantage, be it card, creature, or otherwise.

RECHiD
05-27-2013, 06:07 PM
Name: That which is needed.
Type: Resource

When you play this, choose a resource type other than the one you have the most of (tied in resources, pick any). This becomes a resource of that type.

wallofomens
05-27-2013, 06:11 PM
Name: That which is needed.
Type: Resource

When you play this, choose a resource type other than the one you have the most of (tied in resources, pick any). This becomes a resource of that type.

Too good. Where is the drawback?

IndigoShade
05-27-2013, 06:12 PM
Too good. Where is the drawback?

Kickstarter only, of course! ;)

RECHiD
05-27-2013, 06:20 PM
My first pass is not going to be perfectly balanced, it's just to get the ball rolling.

Lochar
05-27-2013, 06:27 PM
Basic Action
Convert one threshold you control into another. This is considered your resource placement for the turn.

MrCwis
05-27-2013, 06:31 PM
dual resources will most likely make you choose one threshold to take and will probably not give you a resource point or maybe not charge your champion. By making basic resources charge your champion Hex has added another dimension to resources that in turn gives them more space to design draw backs for multicolor resources.

wallofomens
05-27-2013, 06:42 PM
dual resources will most likely make you choose one threshold to take and will probably not give you a resource point or maybe not charge your champion. By making basic resources charge your champion Hex has added another dimension to resources that in turn gives them more space to design draw backs for multicolor resources.

But not adding a single charge to your champion is an extremely small drawback. Maybe we will see fixing in some other form instead of dual reosurces, I wouldn't mind that. Maybe something like:

Bag of Gems
Artifact
Cost: 1
-------------
2, Sacrifice this card: Add one threshold of any shard type. Lose two life. Draw a card

Something like that?

TheDiv
05-27-2013, 06:42 PM
Too good. Where is the drawback?

Rather than it being a 1/1 like other resource cards. You could make it a -X/1 to lower your available mana for the rest of the turn where X could be something like the number of threshold of the type you have the most of.

Example:

You have 4 Blood and 2 Wild threshold. At this stage of the game you have 6 mana.
You play "That which is needed" and it becomes a Wild Threshold.
Your total mana becomes 7 but you lose 4 (the amount of Blood threshold you have) for the rest of this turn.
This'll leave you with only 3 mana left this turn.

wallofomens
05-27-2013, 07:02 PM
Rather than it being a 1/1 like other resource cards. You could make it a -X/1 to lower your available mana for the rest of the turn where X could be something like the number of threshold of the type you have the most of.

Example:

You have 4 Blood and 2 Wild threshold. At this stage of the game you have 6 mana.
You play "That which is needed" and it becomes a Wild Threshold.
Your total mana becomes 7 but you lose 4 (the amount of Blood threshold you have) for the rest of this turn.
This'll leave you with only 3 mana left this turn.

I can see something like this working. But can be easily avoided by just playing your spell before playing the -X/1 resource.

Fireblast
05-27-2013, 11:58 PM
We already "know" that there will be a resource that does :
Choose any threshold
Add [0/1] (equivalent of coming into play tapped)
Charge your champion

I hope there'll be dual lands without drawbacks

~

wallofomens
05-28-2013, 12:05 AM
We already "know" that there will be a resource that does :
Choose any threshold
Add [0/1] (equivalent of coming into play tapped)
Charge your champion

I hope there'll be dual lands without drawbacks

~

Uh, what do you mean by "know"?

jai151
05-28-2013, 04:13 AM
Uh, what do you mean by "know"?

It was spoiled by an unofficial but trustworthy source

Lochar
05-28-2013, 04:40 AM
It was spoiled by an unofficial but trustworthy source

As long as it wasn't Yasi.

jai151
05-28-2013, 05:06 AM
As long as it wasn't Yasi.

I said trustworthy, not troll

Khazrakh
05-28-2013, 05:20 AM
I said trustworthy, not troll

How dare you!? :p

WWKnight
05-28-2013, 05:21 AM
Kickstarter only, of course! ;)

You win the internets sir.

Fomies
05-28-2013, 06:41 AM
There are lots of ways they can go.

Bag of broken gems that gives any one of diamond, ruby or sapphire but no increase in mana.
A resource card that give either blood or wild but removes a threshold the other choice to play up the opposing nature of these two.

MrCwis
05-28-2013, 07:30 AM
the Ascendant Brilliance card in the auction house photo, has 1/1 which I assume means add one resource, so it doesn't come in tapped. Then "if you have diamond or sapphire." followed by texted that is blocked but I'd assume would be do something if you have a diamond, then "sapphire charge your champion" It doesn't look like it'll add a threshold but perhaps it will charge your champion twice if you have both a diamond and sapphire threshold.

We still don't understand the champions charge powers and may be under estimating how strong they are.

Turtlewing
05-28-2013, 08:22 AM
Basic resources do four things:

add a resource this turn
add a maximum resource every turn
add a threshold
charge your champion

Nonbasic resources could easily be made by doubling up one of those things and removing another. For example:

This resource grants 1 Wild and 1 Blood threshold, but does not charge your champion when it enters play.

or

This resource grants 2 maximum resources, but does not grant threshold.

If that's too overpowered the logical extension is to make all nonbasic resource cards not grant resources the urn they come into play.

Mushroom_C1oud
05-28-2013, 08:53 AM
http://hex.potion-of-wit.com/img/cards/RitualistOfTheSpringLitter-215x300.png (http://hex.potion-of-wit.com/cards.php?c=17)

Notice how you get one resource for each Shin'hare :cool:

papalorax
05-28-2013, 10:11 AM
Basic resources do four things:

add a resource this turn
add a maximum resource every turn
add a threshold
charge your champion

Nonbasic resources could easily be made by doubling up one of those things and removing another. For example:

This resource grants 1 Wild and 1 Blood threshold, but does not charge your champion when it enters play.

or

This resource grants 2 maximum resources, but does not grant threshold.

If that's too overpowered the logical extension is to make all nonbasic resource cards not grant resources the urn they come into play.

just have it cost 1 to cancel the resource it gives you that turn.

other then that you nailed it...just play around with those things, put restrictions, costs, requirements on the cards. you got it figured out.

Fomies
06-11-2013, 11:58 PM
A digital TCG has options for dual lands that could never exist in the real world. Like racial specific one that can only go into deck with most of the troops are of the correct race but give all the needed thresholds common to that race. Or one that picks to random non-resource cards from your deck and give you as many different thresholds as they have colors (player would be sad if it picked two artifacts). How about a resource that gave you what ever threshold you had the least amount of but giving you a choice in the case of a tie.

XaosII
06-12-2013, 12:10 AM
I sincerely hope the strongest duals are either 2 charges and no thresholds, or two thresholds and no charges. Dual lands in Magic, as will mostl likely be in Hex as well, are some of the most boring cards, yet relatively expensive, because they feel required for competitive play.

Good duals is a situation where none of the players actually wins.

funktion
06-12-2013, 01:07 AM
I sincerely hope the strongest duals are either 2 charges and no thresholds, or two thresholds and no charges. Dual lands in Magic, as will mostl likely be in Hex as well, are some of the most boring cards, yet relatively expensive, because they feel required for competitive play.

Good duals is a situation where none of the players actually wins.

I disagree with this on every possible level...

Zarien
06-12-2013, 02:09 AM
I hope there are dual resources. For some reason I thought I read somewhere on this forum that were wouldn't be dual resources in the first set or two though.

funktion
06-12-2013, 02:18 AM
I hope there are dual resources. For some reason I thought I read somewhere on this forum that were wouldn't be dual resources in the first set or two though.

It's possible that ascendant brilliance is a "trollish" spoiler in that it will be set 2 or something, but that just seems rude on cryptozoic's side.

Fireblast
06-12-2013, 02:50 AM
We already know there will be non basic resources.
What else than "dual lands" seems more intuitive for a new game?

~

Icepick
06-12-2013, 03:59 AM
I don't think that non-basic resources need to be especially punishing to use - just balancing them against other resources as suggested above would be fine. Since they aren't basic resources, they will almost certainly be limited to the same 4-per-deck limit as all other cards anyway.

Spartoi
06-12-2013, 04:42 AM
We've also seen mechanics in the live-stream where gaining threshold != gaining resources. Why not have a resource type that gives you threshold in 1 of 2 shards, but does not affect your resource pool in any way? It's only benefit, therefore, is reaching a higher threshold in a shard you are getting hosed in, but puts you a resource behind on the curve.

Fireblast
06-12-2013, 05:08 AM
A non basic resource that gives 2 different threshold with no drawback would be good.
At least in PvE if it's seemed too potent in PvP.

~