PDA

View Full Version : Pp and gk accounts on craigslist



Fuzii
05-31-2013, 06:03 PM
Cryptozoic I am not sure what action can be taken but I found this and thought I would share.

http://waco.craigslist.org/vgm/3824856457.html

Hope you can ban people like this, if not oh well.

Black_Omega
05-31-2013, 06:04 PM
Don't think anyone is biting though. This guy posted on CL last week I think and someone had posted to the forum.

CZE should e-mail him, get his info and force him out. He is ruining it for us all!!

Fuzii
05-31-2013, 06:07 PM
I would hope, well in a perfect world they could get his ip from craigslist then match it against his ks account and ban all accounts associated with that IP address.

RanaDunes
05-31-2013, 06:28 PM
The problem with Kickstarter is that you can just lock-down any number of pledge tiers since you're not going to pay anything anyway which would lead to c***blocking the limited tiers from legitimate backers.

How can this guy sell what he doesn't even own yet. He wants to guarantee a sale before kickstarter ends, it's 100% profit without risk. People like these will bail just 1 hour before the project is due if they don't find buyers. Which is a shame because all what he's doing is blocking these tiers from everyone else.

This guy deserves the Douche Bag of the Month Award.

Qorsair
05-31-2013, 06:30 PM
The problem with Kickstarter is that you can just lock-down any number of pledge tiers since you're not going to pay anything anyway which would lead to c***blocking the limited tiers from legitimate backers.

How can this guy sell what he doesn't even own yet. He wants to guarantee a sale before kickstarter ends, it's 100% profit without risk. People like these will bail just 1 hour before the project is due if they don't find buyers. Which is a shame because all what he's doing is blocking these tiers from everyone else.

This guy deserves the Douche Bag of the Month Award.

Note to self: Be ready to pounce on a GK for the wife 1 hour before Kickstart is over.

Tyrfang
05-31-2013, 06:36 PM
I read that as "Be ready to pounce on the wife for a GK 1 hour before Kickstart is over." and did a double-take.

Mishulo
06-01-2013, 02:38 AM
I read that as "Be ready to pounce on the wife for a GK 1 hour before Kickstart is over." and did a double-take.

you're not the only one, sadly!

WSzaboPeter
06-01-2013, 02:55 AM
This is like selling WoW accounts on ebay. They can only exist because people buy them. If none would buy things like that would end the goldfarmer/accountselling/powerlevelling business. Unfortunately there are buyer. And the buyers are the biggest issue in this case.

Thanisse
06-01-2013, 06:31 AM
and I still can't understand who would be stupid enough to buy ...
at least in wow , and league of legends ... you get your account back ... meaning if you "sell it" you can always hose the guy who bought it .

an aquaintance of mine does that a lot with his wow and league accounts ... and I hate it a lot ...
why don't the companies do SOMETHING against this ?
it's beyond me -__-

OysterPrime
06-01-2013, 06:40 AM
I definitely hate to see this kind of stuff, and it's pretty despicable. I wish there was a way they could be punished, because someone who wants to play should have got that spot and not had to pay extra(unless they wanted to.)

And I know it's easy for me to say since I got the tier I wanted, but I agree with Thanisse. It is risky to buy these listings since it is too easy to get scammed. In addition, the scalpers will continue to scalp as long as they are encouraged by people buying from them.

Thanisse
06-01-2013, 06:47 AM
the issue is , you have no guarantee you recieve your Pro account , and even if you would recieve it , there's no guarantee the guy who sold it to you can't take it back . not sure how the kickstarter accounts are made since I didn't get to pledge yet ... but if they are tied to the account that payed for them , it will be easy to recouperate them once the game goes to beta .

also this stuff would be easilly avoided with not limiting stuff in the first place .
I would personally buy a collector now over a proplayer with the 1 year free draft bonus , and I am sure that without limiting proplayer and GK they would have gotten a lot more money , there are a LOT of people who actually want those tiers , and they can't get them , partially due to speculators who tied up 2-3 accounts to re-sell after the game goes live ...
that guy of mine thought about doing that as well -___-
hence my aversion for these "people"

nicosharp
06-01-2013, 07:29 AM
This shit so reminds me of some of my co-workers when it comes to free food. This is hilarious btw, so I will break it down:

A meeting or event ends, and food is left over. (CZE is ready to reveal Hex)
This is where the sadness of human nature begins.

The first people that know about the food being there, run in and take a little. (CZE followers, friends of Crypto)

Then the food is generally relocated to a communal area. (Kickstarter officially launches)

The vultures that hover around the communal area, see the food coming and pounce. (Early KS backers)

Then a message goes out to the department about the food being available in the communal area. (PennyArcade/advertisement/etc.)

This is where it gets dicey, people we don't even know end up coming for the food, and some people now have tupperware. These people don't care about the food, they want some, and will probably feed their family tonight with it. They just see the food as a way to save money (profiting by multiple pledges on kickstarter).

Some of them ninja into the communal areas, while others boldly over grab in front of everyone (people vocally boasting to have multiple pledges in PP and GK, vs. people that have a bunch and trying to sell them quietly on the side.)

At this same time some people are just excited to see the food, and come in with friends, offer to split, and thank the individuals for letting them know about the food. (General community of excited fans)

Then there are those people that sometimes take another persons lunch from the fridge(and you never see them). (Auto-refreshers - :p)

I want to make a hidden camera show on this dynamic, as it is the most hilarious thing... Sadly it points out that human nature often rears its ugly head in any situation that allows someone to profit.

Ashenor
06-01-2013, 08:03 AM
"The vultures that hover around the communal area, see the food coming and pounce. (Early KS backers)"

I don't know i would go as far to say all Early KS backers are vultures..

A lot of early backers bought into the game and the idea the Cory gave us before it went mainstream. Now people get upset when they come in 3 weeks later and the "food" is gone that they want. In that time most of us have been working on building a community, answering questions for the new people and spreading the game around as much as we can. Calling all early KS's vultures is pretty disrespectful imho.

People are always going to try to work the system to make a profit. The same people reserve multiple collector edition of games, and it's the same zero risk. You have 10 collector editions you don't sell them, you take them back to the store for a full refund. Same with ps3's being sold for over $1500 on craigslist on launch day.

nicosharp
06-01-2013, 08:20 AM
"The vultures that hover around the communal area, see the food coming and pounce. (Early KS backers)"

I don't know i would go as far to say all Early KS backers are vultures..

A lot of early backers bought into the game and the idea the Cory gave us before it went mainstream. Now people get upset when they come in 3 weeks later and the "food" is gone that they want. In that time most of us have been working on building a community, answering questions for the new people and spreading the game around as much as we can. Calling all early KS's vultures is pretty disrespectful imho.

People are always going to try to work the system to make a profit. The same people reserve multiple collector edition of games, and it's the same zero risk. You have 10 collector editions you don't sell them, you take them back to the store for a full refund. Same with ps3's being sold for over $1500 on craigslist on launch day.

I think you misinterpret my feelings about vultures.
They are the first to spot something, and the first to get at the good stuff.
Then the flies come and nibble.
It's really the maggots you need to worry about, as they will consume everything down to the bone, ruining the leftovers upon arrival. (Dem' bitches with the tupperware.)

PS - I am a Vulture - Vultures are important to signal something to the rest of the ecosystem.

NaryaDL0re
06-01-2013, 08:22 AM
the most dangerous thing is the obvious scam part of this.
There is no reason what so ever (or reasonable way) to guarantee
both sides get what they want.

And every "proof" of the poster can easily be photoshopped.
(Like showing the email account that bought the PP and selling
the account password. Even that entire pic can be fake)

Fireblast
06-01-2013, 08:52 AM
During geekallstars podcast, Cory said CZE will keep its hands off "out of game trading".
A good way of showing it would be to ignore that thread.

~

Derium
06-01-2013, 10:17 AM
During geekallstars podcast, Cory said CZE will keep its hands off "out of game trading".
A good way of showing it would be to ignore that thread.

~

having them ignore RMT is the smart way to go about it. If they decide to police it, it's a pain. If they decide to embrace it, people get pissed. By ignoring it, then it can only exist to the extent that the players want it to.

Besides, even if they took a stance for/against it, RMT will happen in 100% of all online games. period.

Corpselocker
06-01-2013, 11:06 AM
Corpse "The Vulture" Locker

averagedog
06-01-2013, 11:20 AM
Not everyone lives a sheltered life or has strong mormale basic principles ingrained into them. While I dislike the practice of selling accounts before they could reach potential or even selling accounts that they do not actually own, its not like I will go after them unless they are literally taking away actual revenue from the game and its creators itself.

zWolf
06-01-2013, 11:36 AM
Ok, I want to play 'devils advocate' here - A) I'm totally Legit, and haven't tried to sell anything, or buy anything on a 'black / grey market' thing.

1st. I have not yet 'dug' very deep, so I imagine that it's easy to find, but could some one link to the doc. that states that you can not re-sell the digital assets?

2nd. how is there such a difference of opinion here, than there is at a game shop where cards from Trading Card Game's are bought and sold all the time - or on e-bay? what is the difference of selling 'real' cards like happens ALL the time with trading card games, (remember SCRY or what ever that magazine was that used to have the current prices of the cards in it?) and this 'digital venue' that is attempting to bring the trading card game to the digital space?

I really don't understand, the difference of 'culture' here and I'm SURE that you are going to have tons of folks that are fans of 'real space' trading card games, where shop owners, and players alike re-sell valuable cards to each try to replicate this experience in games such as these.

I know that MTGO has quite a bit of activity on E-bay with folks buying or selling sets all the time, I imagine that it's in the EULA somewhere with that game that your not supposed to do that too - but it's really not policed much. I wonder what the attitude of Cryptic will be with the secondary market that is sure to blossom around their game.

Also, I really am curious as to the reason behind the 'outrage' at this going on in a digital space, where I assume that the same people that are outraged at that, probably think it's totally fine to do with a 'non digital' trading card game - if there are some of you reading this, please give me some insight into how you can really feel that way.

thanks for participating in this discussion, I'd like to keep this civil, and I really would like to get to the bottom of how the 'culture' of Trading Card Game's and the secondary market is so different when it comes to 'real' cards and 'digital' cards.

Thank you.

Wade / zWolf

nicosharp
06-01-2013, 11:47 AM
Wade, the way you wrote that is a bit bizarre tbh.
To summarize, you want to know what is wrong with having a secondary market?

Answer: Nothing

The ethical problem here has nothing to do with the secondary market for hex trading cards. The "Ethical" problem is that someone is trying to sell something they do not even own yet. Something provided for free. Something they put no effort or time, or money into obtaining.

It is only an ethical problem, and in a society with so many shit people, especially on the internet, it doesn't matter what people think of it. It's going to happen.

Fireblast
06-01-2013, 11:56 AM
The announcement says : delivery in september.
So basically he's pre-selling his accounts.

It's fine to me, and as I said, CZE non-official (cause they can't be official about it) stance is : "do whatever you want, we'll be blindfolded".
That's why that thread HAS to be ignored by CZE.

There are people who have no ethics to make profit, it's nothing new, as someone already said : no buyers, no sellers.

~

zWolf
06-01-2013, 11:58 AM
During geekallstars podcast, Cory said CZE will keep its hands off "out of game trading".
A good way of showing it would be to ignore that thread.

~

See, this is more in keeping with how traditional TCG's are handled, the company makes a good game, and a secondary market develops around it - the company is happy making the profits that they do, and the collectors are happy as their collection grows in value - either recouped, or stored in boxes in a closet never to see 'actual' recompense heh - but still there is some internal satisfaction knowing that you have that 'black lotus' that some one would pay ton's of cash for.

Anyway, I just find it interesting that there is such an 'outrage' on re-selling digital cards from a Trading Card Game, when that was a big part of the fun for lot's of people when those games were played at game shops.

- oh, and, I'll just add, that having read the whole thread now, instead of just the first few posts, it looks like most people were more concerned about the fact that some one may be 'scamming' just holding GK's and trying to sell the 'right' to them before the KS campaign even ended... I guess I just understood it wrong, I was thinking more of 'after' the kick starter is over, and say some one won't be able to play, are they going to be selling their GK accounts? the PP's will be popular too. I wonder what the policy will be around seling of accounts, (Akin to selling your whole collection, in the 'real space'.) I wonder how 'aggressive' that cryptic is going to be about policing that. I wonder if they even SHOULD police that -is there going to be harm in it? it seems that if some one is going to stop playing, that is an end to revenue to them, where as, if the account goes to some one that is then going to be active in the community, that would be an income generator for Cryptic.

anyway, food for thought.

BlindMan
06-01-2013, 12:08 PM
I can't speak for everyone on this, but for me, here is the problem:

They didn't pay for anything.

If they pay in $500 and then a few months later decide to sell their account, so be it. They still dropped their own money to back the Kickstarter, even if not everyone likes the reason.

However, what they are doing now is like standing in line to buy something, and then trying to sell their place in line. They have no intention to buy the item. They are just taking advantage of the line. That's like scalping tickets, but with NO RISK. They can just walk away at the last minute and pay nothing. If they bought the account and then sold it, they are making money, but some money is guaranteed to the project. Pre-scalping an account guarantees no money, and they are just clogging up the line and making regular customers pay to make them move.

Genocidal
06-01-2013, 12:10 PM
Pretty much what BlindMan said. I don't think anyone has an issue with someone pledging at a tier to give the game a legitimate shot, and then deciding it isn't for them, or having real life issues come up where there need to sell the account. The issue has nothing to do with resale of cards on the secondary market, which is expected, accepted, and preferred in some cases when you're looking for a specific card and don't want to bust a ton of packs to get it.

ShaolinRaven
06-01-2013, 12:12 PM
Ok, I want to play 'devils advocate' here - A) I'm totally Legit, and haven't tried to sell anything, or buy anything on a 'black / grey market' thing.

1st. I have not yet 'dug' very deep, so I imagine that it's easy to find, but could some one link to the doc. that states that you can not re-sell the digital assets?

2nd. how is there such a difference of opinion here, than there is at a game shop where cards from Trading Card Game's are bought and sold all the time - or on e-bay? what is the difference of selling 'real' cards like happens ALL the time with trading card games, (remember SCRY or what ever that magazine was that used to have the current prices of the cards in it?) and this 'digital venue' that is attempting to bring the trading card game to the digital space?

I really don't understand, the difference of 'culture' here and I'm SURE that you are going to have tons of folks that are fans of 'real space' trading card games, where shop owners, and players alike re-sell valuable cards to each try to replicate this experience in games such as these.

I know that MTGO has quite a bit of activity on E-bay with folks buying or selling sets all the time, I imagine that it's in the EULA somewhere with that game that your not supposed to do that too - but it's really not policed much. I wonder what the attitude of Cryptic will be with the secondary market that is sure to blossom around their game.

Also, I really am curious as to the reason behind the 'outrage' at this going on in a digital space, where I assume that the same people that are outraged at that, probably think it's totally fine to do with a 'non digital' trading card game - if there are some of you reading this, please give me some insight into how you can really feel that way.

thanks for participating in this discussion, I'd like to keep this civil, and I really would like to get to the bottom of how the 'culture' of Trading Card Game's and the secondary market is so different when it comes to 'real' cards and 'digital' cards.

Thank you.

Wade / zWolf

The issue is less with cards and more with accounts.

For example, also as devil's advocate, lets say your looking to buy a Hex account that has Set 1 because Set 1 has rotated out or become heavily sought after for a lot of cards. I decide to get my friend to set up an Ebay account to sell my account off. You buy my account off Ebay. Then I turn around and claim to be hacked, I get my account back, my friend and I split your money, and you're left out of cash and an account.

Even without that set up someone could hack an account, sell it, and the original owner reports it and gets the account back so the hacker gets your money but you don't get anything.

Selling and trading cards is fine, it is when accounts and who has legitimate claims to an account that starts getting tricky.

I've never sold or bought an account either, and I don't have a problem with the concept of it, just the shadiness of the transactions since most of them are done on a secondary market and you don't know if the account you're buying is being sold by a hacker or the actual owner.

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 12:12 PM
The guy linked in this thread is specificaly selling them in september... He is paying for them himself.

nicosharp
06-01-2013, 12:13 PM
I can't speak for everyone on this, but for me, here is the problem:

They didn't pay for anything.

If they pay in $500 and then a few months later decide to sell their account, so be it. They still dropped their own money to back the Kickstarter, even if not everyone likes the reason.

However, what they are doing now is like standing in line to buy something, and then trying to sell their place in line. They have no intention to buy the item. They are just taking advantage of the line. That's like scalping tickets, but with NO RISK. They can just walk away at the last minute and pay nothing. If they bought the account and then sold it, they are making money, but some money is guaranteed to the project. Pre-scalping an account guarantees no money, and they are just clogging up the line and making regular customers pay to make them move.

You just made me think of what was on the news yesterday. People with specific disabled passes are allowed to jump lines at disneyland. They are selling their services as a tour guide to families of up to 4. They just let those people line jump with them, which is basically what the family is paying for. Disneyland is pretty outraged, as it was something they wanted to do to allow disabled individuals accessibility and enjoyment. Of course anything offered as a nice gesture can be abused and profited from.. even if it is simply line jumping.

Who is worst though. The tour guide, or the family paying for them. Another ethical problem.


The guy linked in this thread is specificaly selling them in september... He is paying for them himself.
It does not really matter, if he gets paid for it, technically it is the same thing. If it was a post made after the kickstarter, It wouldn't be as scoffed.

zWolf
06-01-2013, 12:14 PM
The ethical problem here has nothing to do with the secondary market for hex trading cards. The "Ethical" problem is that someone is trying to sell something they do not even own yet. Something provided for free. Something they put no effort or time, or money into obtaining.





I can't speak for everyone on this, but for me, here is the problem:

They didn't pay for anything.

If they pay in $500 and then a few months later decide to sell their account, so be it. They still dropped their own money to back the Kickstarter, even if not everyone likes the reason.

Ok, ya, it looks like I mostly 'mis understood' the perceived issue here, it seems like I actually see things similarly to many of you - I was just thinking that the 'GK account' was talking about after KS, when he actually 'owned' it and the cards.

It seems that most of the ' he should be hung and quartered' comments were assuming that it was going to either be a 'scam' or, that he'd pull out his KS promise if no one bit before the end of the project. My assumptions were incorrect.

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 12:15 PM
Couldn't the hacker just take all the cards, transfer them around, flip them on the AH and the same situation be true? Couldn't someone steal your magic collection and sell them? I'd rather they just not return accounts, and make it more like physical property. You'll likely just not get it back. Get an authenticator, and don't give it to someone else.

jai151
06-01-2013, 12:16 PM
You just made me think of what was on the news yesterday. People with specific disabled passes are allowed to jump lines at disneyland. They are selling their services as a tour guide to families of up to 4. They just let those people line jump with them, which is basically what the family is paying for. Disneyland is pretty outraged, as it was something they wanted to do to allow disabled individuals accessibility and enjoyment. Of course anything offered as a nice can be abused and profited from.. even if it is simply line jumping.

Who is worst though. The tour guide, or the family paying for them. Another ethical problem.

Unfortunately, it just goes to show that no matter our circumstances, greed is human nature =/

Stok3d
06-01-2013, 12:18 PM
Selling Cards is fine. Anyone that buys an account can always have it taken away from them. It's the oldest scam in the books. One phone call and the guy can always get it back and will have everything that remains on the account.

The same goes for idiots who download "The New Hex Bot". Yep, it's a keylogger and you're going to lose every card you own. It's no one's fault but your own--don't call CZE whining that you were hacked. Cory said he has "Zero tolerance for ppl trying to GAME the system". Your cards are gone and you're likely to just get your account terminated.

BlindMan
06-01-2013, 12:20 PM
I admit the language the guy uses is a bit ambiguous. He does say, "I am currently looking for those interested to buy when the game begins Sep 2013." But he also says, "I have accounts holding bids on 1 grand king and 4 pvp tiers." Not, "I am buying 5 accounts at these tiers." Holding bids sounds like he is trying to secure buyers before he loses the chance to bail.

And regardless of the language used, he doesn't have the accounts and hasn't paid for them yet. So he is pre-selling them. And he can still bail on them.

Genocidal
06-01-2013, 12:21 PM
Couldn't the hacker just take all the cards, transfer them around, flip them on the AH and the same situation be true? Couldn't someone steal your magic collection and sell them? I'd rather they just not return accounts, and make it more like physical property. You'll likely just not get it back. Get an authenticator, and don't give it to someone else.

This is a terrible idea unless you want to be actively hostile towards your community, which is not the best way to build a game up from the ground. No one can be perfectly secure, and while you can mitigate risk you can't completely remove it. Plenty of cases of accounts being compromised aren't the fault of the victim, do you want to tell someone that because your security failed they're screwed? That's a quick way to go out of business.

zWolf
06-01-2013, 12:23 PM
The issue is less with cards and more with accounts.

For example, also as devil's advocate, lets say your looking to buy a Hex account that has Set 1 because Set 1 has rotated out or become heavily sought after for a lot of cards. I decide to get my friend to set up an Ebay account to sell my account off. You buy my account off Ebay. Then I turn around and claim to be hacked, I get my account back, my friend and I split your money, and you're left out of cash and an account.

Even without that set up someone could hack an account, sell it, and the original owner reports it and gets the account back so the hacker gets your money but you don't get anything.

Selling and trading cards is fine, it is when accounts and who has legitimate claims to an account that starts getting tricky.

I've never sold or bought an account either, and I don't have a problem with the concept of it, just the shadiness of the transactions since most of them are done on a secondary market and you don't know if the account you're buying is being sold by a hacker or the actual owner.

That's an interesting point, though, the 'set 1' argument wouldn't really motivate an 'account purchace' right? I mean, you'd just sell the set and trade in game - (in theory.) ...

the only motivation I could see of selling an account, over individual cards, (or sets of cards,) would be for the account benefits, like the 'life time' and '1 year free draft' account benny's that are being offered.

The 'account selling' could be averted, if these items were made to be 'trade-able' then your just back to the whole 'do I trust this guy to actually give me the product I paid for on e-bay' thing that we deal with already. right?

with out those 'benefits' being associated to items that you can trade, you are going to see folks trying to sell their accounts, and others that are trying to buy them. (in my opinion.) and ya, then you come up against the whole 'I can re-claim that account after I sold it to you, scam.'

Over all though, it looks like I was seeing 'outrage' where there really wasn't any - it looks like most of the posters were mostly mad assuming that this craigs list seller was trying to get money before the kick starter was even finished. Something I completely understand.

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 12:29 PM
This is a terrible idea unless you want to be actively hostile towards your community, which is not the best way to build a game up from the ground. No one can be perfectly secure, and while you can mitigate risk you can't completely remove it. Plenty of cases of accounts being compromised aren't the fault of the victim, do you want to tell someone that because your security failed they're screwed? That's a quick way to go out of business.

I've never even heard of anyone with an authenticator attached to their account getting hacked. Even if I know your password unless I get my hands on your physical code generating item it does me no good. Authenticators will be released at launch. Everyone really should get one.

How do you suggest dealing with someone getting access to anothers account and selling the cards on the AH? Taking them away from everyone that bought them?

jai151
06-01-2013, 12:38 PM
I've never even heard of anyone with an authenticator attached to their account getting hacked. Even if I know your password unless I get my hands on your physical code generating item it does me no good. Authenticators will be released at launch. Everyone really should get one.

There were some cases of this happening in WoW with a man in the middle attack. Basically they modified the launcher to send the code to them and return a servers down message, never touching the login servers. Then the person receiving the details had a few seconds to log in authenticated.

Now how they got the modified launcher onto people's systems is in question, but I'd assume through trying to download a bot/trainer

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 12:43 PM
There were some cases of this happening in WoW with a man in the middle attack. Basically they modified the launcher to send the code to them and return a servers down message, never touching the login servers. Then the person receiving the details had a few seconds to log in authenticated.

Now how they got the modified launcher onto people's systems is in question, but I'd assume through trying to download a bot/trainer

That's a fair point. I'm not actually against it. Though I admit that I have spent a lot of money on my pledges that I justified by saying if I am really just not getting my monies worth out of it I will just sell them. So I'm not against selling accounts. On the other hand I never have been, I think people should be able to profit out of their time. If they spend 5 years playing wow, and can sell their account to cash out, they should be able to if they want. =/ So I'd like to find a medium ground, I guess.

I think people will always roll the dice on buying digital goods on a secondary market. It's not a good solution to take it away, or to have people losing their money by people calling to get their accounts back. But I have no idea how to fix it.

Fireblast
06-01-2013, 12:45 PM
About account theft, all the cards are unique and they know who owns them and what happens to them.
They could reconstitute what happened in case of account's thievery.

Back to topic, what the guy is doing is greedy and stupid but legit from a black market stand point

~

Tyrfang
06-01-2013, 12:48 PM
Black markets, by definition, are not legit.

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 12:53 PM
Black markets, by definition, are not legit.

Who is talking about black markets?


About account theft, all the cards are unique and they know who owns them and what happens to them.
They could reconstitute what happened in case of account's thievery.

Back to topic, what the guy is doing is greedy and stupid but legit from a black market stand point

~

So people that legitimately bought the cards on hex's auction house will lose all the cards they bought because someone was hacked then? That's the solution we're going for?

BlindMan
06-01-2013, 01:09 PM
When he says "reconstitute what happened" I believe the implication is that you could reverse the transactions. So if you bought cards off the AH you would get your currency back. Not ideal, but it's not exactly just "losing all the cards" either.

Fireblast
06-01-2013, 01:16 PM
When he says "reconstitute what happened" I believe the implication is that you could reverse the transactions. So if you bought cards off the AH you would get your currency back. Not ideal, but it's not exactly just "losing all the cards" either.

Yup, and if you noticed you've been hacked 3 months after it happened, screw you :D
If you notice the day after, they can reverse everything (not sure about crafting tho).

~

Gwaer
06-01-2013, 01:19 PM
Yup, and if you noticed you've been hacked 3 months after it happened, screw you :D
If you notice the day after, they can reverse everything (not sure about crafting tho).

~

They have been pretty adamant that once you get a card it is yours they will never take it away or alter it. This would be going back on that... But I am at a loss for a better solution, so I dunno.


Yup, and if you noticed you've been hacked 3 months after it happened, screw you :D
If you notice the day after, they can reverse everything (not sure about crafting tho).

~

They have been pretty adamant that once you get a card it is yours they will never take it away or alter it. This would be going back on that... But I am at a loss for a better solution, so I dunno.

(also, by the time they get around to getting people to keep up with all he reports of hacks, and investigate everything that went down, to make sure you didn't just sell stuff and realize you sold it too slow, it might be weeks.... Yea this is sounding worse the longer i think about it.)

Yubinshan
06-01-2013, 01:37 PM
I only found out about Hex two days ago, and would gladly buy a GK pack for $550.

The problem is not necessarily that this guy is selling a limited, commodity, but that the commodity is artificially limited in the first place.

Yubin

jai151
06-01-2013, 01:46 PM
I only found out about Hex two days ago, and would gladly buy a GK pack for $550.

The problem is not necessarily that this guy is selling a limited, commodity, but that the commodity is artificially limited in the first place.

Yubin

There is nothing artificial about the limit.

zWolf
06-01-2013, 01:57 PM
Now how they got the modified launcher onto people's systems is in question, but I'd assume through trying to download a bot/trainer

... or maybe an add on, or perhaps just a wrong click on a web site, or a bait and switch e-mail link, or.. or... or... it's really lame to assume that every one that get's hacked is a cheater pants. That is just not the case.

jai151
06-01-2013, 01:59 PM
... or maybe an add on, or perhaps just a wrong click on a web site, or a bait and switch e-mail link, or.. or... or... it's really lame to assume that every one that get's hacked is a cheater pants. That is just not the case.

It's a code modification to launcher.exe. It would be incredibly difficult to pull that off in any way OTHER than directly replacing launcher.exe.

zWolf
06-01-2013, 02:06 PM
It's a code modification to launcher.exe. It would be incredibly difficult to pull that off in any way OTHER than directly replacing launcher.exe.

k, I guess. I do know that I was hacked in Guild wars, at least once.. maybe twice - and really had done nothing illegitimate - I was also quite careful, they claimed that perhaps a hacker had my account password from me using the same one on another game or web site, and I couldn't really well argue against that - (personally I think the Guild War Account Hacks were an inside job, but that's one man's opinion.) anyway, ya, I came off a bit strong, but, I guess I'd not absolutely assume that anyone that got hacked was automatically the one to blame...

The hacker is the main problem here. sometimes there really are just victims.

I'm a huge proponent of authentication, and have them on anything that will let me. I'm happy that Cryptic is going that route as well. I really didn't even know that till this thread.

(also, Jai151, personal apology to you, as I think my post seemed a bit hostile.. I probably owe one to Gwar too, as I said something about his Signature in another thread heh, but that one really was just funny to me, no offence to either of you.)

jai151
06-01-2013, 02:10 PM
k, I guess. I do know that I was hacked in Guild wars, at least once.. maybe twice - and really had done nothing illegitimate - I was also quite careful, they claimed that perhaps a hacker had my account password from me using the same one on another game or web site, and I couldn't really well argue against that - (personally I think the Guild War Account Hacks were an inside job, but that's one man's opinion.) anyway, ya, I came off a bit strong, but, I guess I'd not absolutely assume that anyone that got hacked was automatically the one to blame...

The hacker is the main problem here. sometimes there really are just victims.

I'm a huge proponent of authentication, and have them on anything that will let me. I'm happy that Cryptic is going that route as well. I really didn't even know that till this thread.

(also, Jai151, personal apology to you, as I think my post seemed a bit hostile.. I probably owe one to Gwar too, as I said something about his Signature in another thread heh, but that one really was just funny to me, no offence to either of you.)

No worries man. Trust me, I know it's not normally a cheater, I had my WoW account hacked once when I quit the game and removed the authenticator, and I keep getting emails about someone in Beijing trying to log into the GW2 account I haven't played since about a month after the game launched. And in neither of those cases had I done anything even questionable, I'm just assuming they were brute forced.

I was really talking just to that one specific scenario.

Tyrfang
06-01-2013, 02:11 PM
The earliest account hackings for most games tend to be just people bombarding them with password lists from cracked websites, because people used the same username and pw.