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ZacPhoenix
07-02-2013, 06:10 PM
I've been playing the new Magic: Duels of the Planeswalkers 2014 (great game, check it out) and was pleasantly surprised to see some of the really powerful creature cards had animations when you zoomed into them. Nothing too complex, just some simple movements/tweens, but it really added to the effect.

And Duels doesn't implement this, but I also really like the idea of individual cards or whole types if not individual cards (like "Zombie" or "Human" cards) having a sound effect when they are summoned. Imagine when you play Murder, you hear a dagger being pulled out of its sheath and a stabbing noise, or wings flapping, screeching and flames when you summon a Dragon troop.

I think it would really add a whole new layer of polish to the game.

What do you guys think?

Skirovik
07-02-2013, 06:20 PM
I actually like this idea. Provided you can turn it on and off and change the volume specifically.

Shadowelf
07-02-2013, 06:27 PM
I actually like this idea. Provided you can turn it on and off and change the volume specifically.

Yeap same here i wouldn't mind, but the option to switch it off is a must especially later on when it will turn old or when i need to concentrate more

Hatts
07-02-2013, 06:32 PM
The following stretch goals may be of interest:

660k 5 more game boards, each new game board will include exciting animation and effects
790k Increased unique sound and particle effects to more cards

I'm not sure if the particle effects are animations on the card or occur when they are used.

ZacPhoenix
07-02-2013, 06:46 PM
Nice catch Hatts, I'd completely forgotten about that stretch goal. Particle effects to me sounds like those magical flashes when cards are summoned, but maybe I'm wrong.

Hatts
07-02-2013, 07:20 PM
No, I think you are right about the particle effects. Still, nice to know there will be unique sounds. Animations would be neat if they were subtle and rare, perhaps as AA? Too much and it becomes annoying.

Doxy
07-03-2013, 07:13 AM
Im pretty sure something like animated cards will come, but not at release.
Id rather see them focusing on content first and eye candy later.
Although i do love my candies =]

Dralon
07-03-2013, 07:28 AM
Yep I would love some animations on select cards like magic 2014 implemented. Something not needed at launch obviously, but at some point.

Stok3d
07-03-2013, 07:41 AM
Here's my personal thought on this...

I believe CZE is doing their best to get the game out and trying to get ahead a bit with designing the entire block. Once Hex officially launches and our playerbase grows leaps and bounds, CZE will get an idea of what their revenue is. I would guesstimate that by Block 2, that Hex will have reinvested money in a graphical / animation department and spruce up some eye candy for us. We may even get a taste of this sooner.

I would say that AA Exclusives would be an obvious choice to test the waters on some animations. Realize though that it's a LOT more involved to go from paying an artist X amount of money to come up with a single frame picture to then getting someone to take that picture and making it move around. Animation is not necessary, could chew up bandwidth, and may bring the min requirements for devices up to play the game. Of course having the ability to toggle on/off would solve the device reqs.

I like the thought of some of our guys moving about. First off, animate our Champions. I want my guy doing different things like the SC2 Race guys move about at the bottom of your screen. I believe that to be a nice touch.

Xintia
07-03-2013, 08:00 AM
If they want to add all these kind of graphical "frills," the question then becomes how scalable the engine/interface will be. CZE already said they designed the game with tablets in mind, and that was one of the stretch goals. Too many "bells and whistles" and things could really get clunky on mobile platforms, or even some desktops. Not everyone is rocking the latest ATI or nVidia chipsets. So if they do include such things, they would need to be highly customizable in terms of turning specific effects on and off for an optimal play experience.

Hatts
07-03-2013, 08:35 AM
I would say that AA Exclusives would be an obvious choice to test the waters on some animations. Realize though that it's a LOT more involved to go from paying an artist X amount of money to come up with a single frame picture to then getting someone to take that picture and making it move around. Animation is not necessary, could chew up bandwidth, and may bring the min requirements for devices up to play the game. Of course having the ability to toggle on/off would solve the device reqs.


I think you are making a mountain out of a mole hill here. You aren't downloading all the art assets every time you play, they are installed with the client. Animated GIF's aren't that much larger than a regular GIF's (not that this is how they will be implemented.) If a device can handle the graphics on the game board, it can handle a few pixels on a card changing. Minor animations don't take a significant amount of effort to implement.



I like the thought of some of our guys moving about. First off, animate our Champions. I want my guy doing different things like the SC2 Race guys move about at the bottom of your screen. I believe that to be a nice touch.

It's my feeling this will come with the different game boards, but that's just a guess.

Hatts
07-03-2013, 08:41 AM
If they want to add all these kind of graphical "frills," the question then becomes how scalable the engine/interface will be. CZE already said they designed the game with tablets in mind, and that was one of the stretch goals. Too many "bells and whistles" and things could really get clunky on mobile platforms, or even some desktops. Not everyone is rocking the latest ATI or nVidia chipsets. So if they do include such things, they would need to be highly customizable in terms of turning specific effects on and off for an optimal play experience.

This just isn't true. We aren't talking about a complex 3D environment, we're talking a largely static 2D environment* with a few particle effects and animations. This will not stress any recent tablet or any desktop/laptop with built in graphics that was bought in the last 5 years.

* Since it's being done in Unity, it's most likely a 3d environment, but from a fixed perspective, which greatly simplifies the calculations involved and the stress it will put on the GPU. This is effectively a 2D environment except for shadow / lighting computations on the particle effects.

Zarien
07-03-2013, 08:52 AM
I think having this would be cool with an option to turn it on and off. Maybe have the increased effects off by default for tablets to reduce issues there.

Stok3d
07-03-2013, 10:40 AM
I think you are making a mountain out of a mole hill here. You aren't downloading all the art assets every time you play, they are installed with the client. Animated GIF's aren't that much larger than a regular GIF's (not that this is how they will be implemented.) If a device can handle the graphics on the game board, it can handle a few pixels on a card changing. Minor animations don't take a significant amount of effort to implement.

I disagree and stand next to my statement. I believe animations would be a very significant undertaking and the effort from simply creating a picture to that of creating movement is multi-fold more time consuming and expensive. Also, I don't know what effect doing this would have on the multitude of platforms CZE is trying to include? Playing a raid with 3 Players vs 1 AI could easily have 50x animated cards/tokens on a board. That will create added stress. It's at least something to consider as our current hardware reqs will be very low. Toggling Animations on/off has Hardware Req difference a Mute topic.

I am all for animation. I just think that animating every card would likely require CZE to at least double the size of their current team. New sets come out every 4 months with 250-350x cards. That's a tremendous undertaking in my eyes. Any Graphic guys able to step in with this and provide some legitimate insight? I'm just guesstimating.

Mr.Funsocks
07-03-2013, 10:42 AM
Any half-decent PC will be able to handle whatever they throw at it. But they'll be toggleable as well.

My guess would be most of the animation and flash would have be disabled on the mobile client though.

DjiN
07-03-2013, 11:18 AM
I'm a motion designer and I can tell you that it isn't as much work as you think. We are not talking about complex animations like animating body parts doing specific natural movements (which can be quite tidious). Adding some feeling of depth through some parallax movement between for and background is done in an blink of an eye. For eye candy like glows or some moving particles theres plug ins that are fast and efficient. I assume after you established a solid workflow you can do 2-3 cards a day with some simple animations that adds a lot of atmosphere already. Since you will have full access to the photoshop documents of the artists the workflow will be very efficient as well. Sure you can spend tons of time animating every single hair of a bunny ear or every single leaf of a tree, but if at all that level detail would be reserved for some very special promo cards.

Also we are talking about pre-rendered animations here, no real time stuff. They won't be heavy on the machine at all and even tablets or smartphones will handle it smoothly if integrated correctly into the graphic pipeline.

Hatts
07-03-2013, 11:42 AM
I disagree and stand next to my statement. I believe animations would be a very significant undertaking and the effort from simply creating a picture to that of creating movement is multi-fold more time consuming and expensive. Also, I don't know what effect doing this would have on the multitude of platforms CZE is trying to include? Playing a raid with 3 Players vs 1 AI could easily have 50x animated cards/tokens on a board. That will create added stress. It's at least something to consider as our current hardware reqs will be very low. Toggling Animations on/off has Hardware Req difference a Mute topic.


Sorry Stok3d, you're talking from a position of ignorance, you admit it in the middle of the quoted paragraph. I think you'll just have to take my word (also see Djin's comment) that static animation on cards is not the graphical burden you believe it to be. As for needing to double the size of the team, no one is suggesting every card be animated, and animating a static image isn't close to the same effort as it is to animate a 3D model. We aren't talking complex animations either, simple things like glowing eyes, blowing trees, glinting swords, dripping blood are simple to produce. Judging by the stretch goals they probably added 1 more person to their graphics staff to assist in these types of things.

Dralon
07-03-2013, 01:33 PM
The simple animation on the magic 2014 cards is simple and engaging and looks great on the iPad as well as PC without affecting performance whatsoever.

Mr.Funsocks
07-03-2013, 02:22 PM
The simple animation on the magic 2014 cards is simple and engaging and looks great on the iPad as well as PC without affecting performance whatsoever.

I wouldn't say it doesn't effect performance. It tends to chug pretty hard on my tablet, tablets are still really really weak. But on PC, that kind of stuff is child's play.