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Shaqattaq
07-05-2013, 01:50 PM
by Drew Korfe

While the dev team has been hard at work to deliver you the best MMO TCG imaginable, I wanted to take a moment to talk about one of the things my team has been up to, and that's a little thing called Gen Con.

http://hextcg.com/hex-at-gen-con/

Captain_Obvious
07-05-2013, 01:58 PM
How many machines will be available? Could it get too packed to even play a game or two?

OutlandishMatt
07-05-2013, 02:07 PM
I cannot wait for the forums to explode from the 16,000+ Kickstarter backers that cannot/will not attend Gen Con. Honestly, if they are exclusive to Gen Con 2013, I can see fans becoming jaded and having a legitimate reason to if Mercenaries and Sleeves aren't tradeable.

theghost32
07-05-2013, 02:12 PM
will there be other ways to get ozawa for the ones wont be there

Tiuvath
07-05-2013, 02:15 PM
I am a KS backer and I dont care about nontradeable sleeves or PVE Mercs.

Every company hands out goodies and specials, its part and parcel of the industry. You cant really get around that. Aslong as there are no exclusive cards(not talking about alternate art) handed out on such events I dont care too much.

Do I like it? not necessarily since I cant go to any of these CONs. I do however accept it as part of the business.

Tiuvath
07-05-2013, 02:17 PM
will there be other ways to get ozawa for the ones wont be there

Ozawa is part of the regular set 1(pvp). I dont know if that is alternate art or if they simply changed the art (its still in development after all). As the rarity is red and not orange I guess its just an an art change (good thing too since I like that art way better than the old one)

MastrFett
07-05-2013, 02:18 PM
Yup. Was just reading a whole thread about how most people want the con exclusives to be available to people who can't make it. I'd pay for something like Blizzard does for digital tickets that will get me the exclusives.

Lordduck
07-05-2013, 02:19 PM
my biggest question would be how much later than this con the alpha would start? because if it is already in progress there would not be much reason for any kickstarters to play there as they could already play from home

MastrFett
07-05-2013, 02:22 PM
my biggest question would be how much later than this con the alpha would start? because if it is already in progress there would not be much reason for any kickstarters to play there as they could already play from home

I was thinking the same thing. Hopefully it will be soon after, because I will be insanely jealous of the people who get to play at the Con. Would be great if alpha came out right as the con ended.

Stok3d
07-05-2013, 02:47 PM
I do hope they have quite a many machines! I can see us playing musical chairs there if not.

Q: If we bring our own laptop, could we play on it in your tournie and alleviate the fear of just standing around watching?

Taun
07-05-2013, 05:09 PM
I'm pretty sure that card for Ozawa is Alternate Art. I really wish they'd switch the pictures though. I honestly hate the original. It looks like someone just pasted a wolf's head on a person's body. No attempt to meld the two. I like the AA much better. To bad I'm nowhere near Gen Con. :(

Dracatis
07-05-2013, 05:23 PM
*sigh* Ozawa is like the main card I want and there is no chance I can make it to the con. I might consider digital tickets myself just because it is Ozawa(and that alt art looks really nice).

wurtil
07-05-2013, 05:38 PM
Please please please let us pay that same $10 to have access to a livestream as well as the Con-exclusive Merc and starter deck. I get that AA cards won't be available anywhere but to Con attendees, but I can get the same functionality from the non-AA cards so that is fine. Not being able to get the functionality of the GenCon Merc by any way but going to GenCon would be a huge bummer for those like me who look to be collecting Mercs due to how cool each one seems to be.

WhytePanther
07-05-2013, 06:06 PM
I don't think the implication is that the starter received from Gen Con is exclusive, just a coupon for one of the four starters that will normally be purchasable in the shop. The exclusives do bother me a bit, especially after the whole t-shirt thing, but promoting the game is still important at this point. The alt-arts will be tradeable, and they are just alt-arts. The sleeves aren't a big deal either. The Merc however is one of those things that change the way the game is played, and it would be nice if there were some way for those of us who have been there from the beginning to get our hands on it. Gen Con has never really been on my radar, and it's now far too late for vacation to be arranged. Maybe the same Merc gets used for other cons in the same year, but I missed out on the Pax Prime tickets this year...

schild
07-05-2013, 06:32 PM
This is an absolutely terrible idea. Giving away cards for location-based events in a Digital CCG is absurd. Of course, you could easily quiet everyone by saying King Backers and above all get copies of this sort of thing for life. But it would still be a terrible damned idea. There are great reasons for making a digital CCG, and not having to do gimmicky trash like this is one of them.

Take a look around and see how many non-comicon attendees like WOTC's black on black Planeswalker SDCC exclusive. Then sit in a corner and think about what you're doing.

Edit: Basically, what I'm saying is I would obviously love to pay $10 and play Hex all weekend. But I'm not going to a convention for support of a DIGITAL MMOCGG. DIGITAL. MASSIVELY. MULTIPLAYER. ONLINE. /slap

mainstager
07-05-2013, 07:26 PM
You could always

*gasp*

trade for it. :eek:

jaxsonbatemanhex
07-05-2013, 07:29 PM
If you've been following the forums in recent months, you'll know that there's a huge section of the playerbase (perhaps even the majority) that would like to have access to these cards, but cannot attend certain conventions simply due to logistical reasons (for example, I live in Australia and am not rich - it's not feasible for me to come to America just for a convention to snag some Hex exclusives).

A few promising ideas were touted in previous threads; personally, I'm a fan of the pay-for-live-stream-and-get-access-to-exclusives option. I'm more than willing to do that, and I believe Blizzard started doing it for WoW when the community started getting irked about Blizzcon exclusives not being feasibly obtainable by the wider community (the 'third party' option can't really be trusted; CZE has no control over the price which means absolute gouging on the basis of rarity - if CZE allows first party access to these exclusives not only do they control the price, but they also get all the funds).

schild
07-05-2013, 07:55 PM
Obviously they should allow people to pay for a digital goody bag and have an online Gen-Con tournament later or something. Frankly, when I would've had time to make plans for Gencon I didn't even know Hex existed - which makes this double stupid.

Prism
07-05-2013, 07:58 PM
Pretty lame. If you pledged $35+ you should be able to play online during that time and get the same rewards... I don't want to cross the border to go to this ONLINE ONLY TCG event that I helped fund, why don't I get access? Goes against a lot of their supposed theories of why an online-only TCG is good. WHY have things that aren't accessible online???

lamaros
07-05-2013, 08:16 PM
As I have said in the other thread: exclusives tide to physical location events that a vast majority of Hex players cannot attend are absurdly stupid and entirely contrary to the idea of a Digital game.

Cory: you already had the backlash after the tshirt card debacle, yet you continue to try and push through ideas that are contrary to the reason so many people are interested in this game to begin with.

Stop, listen, and take a second and think. This is not the game experience that people want and you are pursuing it the wrong way.

Do promo cards, do events, but do not lock out your players and customers through physical access restrictions. Make this a properly DIGITAL experience.

Gridian
07-05-2013, 08:31 PM
I too cannot possibly attend there. And like the others I too would gladly pay for a digital ticket and the ingame goodies.

Though: Something tells me that that must have been part of the plan from the get-go. So far Cory and Cryptozoic have shown remarkable common sense, so I urge myself and everyone else to patience. Let's wait for an official word on the digital part of the con! :-)

Selix
07-05-2013, 08:45 PM
Does anyone know how long this event runs? Like does it go all night (so I can come after work) or only from say 9 AM to 5 PM daily?

OutlandishMatt
07-05-2013, 08:59 PM
How about the alpha gets released prior to this and everyone that logs in while GenCon is going on, gets the promos?!?!?! BRILLIANT! You're welcome, Internet!

Roy_G
07-05-2013, 10:31 PM
Hex is a digital TCG.I think it not a good way giving digital good only to those who can get to a certain location while all of those that can't get there in case they are busy or in a different continent can't get there.

Plus it was mentioned on update 30:

We've taken in a lot of your feedback. Should we reach the next stretch goal and HEX Con happens, all convention promotional cards, sleeves, mercenaries and the like will be deposited into each Kickstarter backer's HEX account. We want to assure you that everybody will be able to gear-up and sleeve all the goodies from this campaign whether or not they will be able to attend. So, should we hit the 2.5 million dollar Stretch Goal, you'll be receiving a lovely care package courtesy of your friends here at Cryptozoic with lots of goodies.

This is a convention that probably a lot of backers will not be able to attend.So there should
be a chance to get it even if people are not able to get there.It's the same reasoning.

Sethala
07-05-2013, 11:26 PM
Do you know where in GenCon you'll be set up for the league? Dealer hall, electronic games room, or somewhere else? I'd like to drop by as soon as possible and not worry too much about having to track you down once I'm there.

As for the people complaining about not getting promos: On the one hand, I agree that not getting something that affects gameplay, such as a mercenary that's not available anywhere else, sucks. Doubly so for an online game that should be available anywhere. But, it also detracts from those that are able to go to a convention and spend time meeting up with the guys running the booth if they can't get something cool and unique to commemorate it, and I don't think "just paying $10 and getting a free starter and promos" is quite enough. However, my overall thoughts are that any unique promos should be cosmetic only. Nothing that affects the game, but extra alternate art cards or something similar is an excellent idea. (I will say that HexCon is a bit different because it was a stretch goal we were all going for and all hoping to achieve, so missing out on something that you helped create sucks, so I definitely think it was a good idea to give all backers the digital cards from HexCon, but other conventions aren't something that's directly tied to the kickstarter in the same way, so I don't think the same rules should apply.)

OutlandishMatt
07-05-2013, 11:31 PM
Do you know where in GenCon you'll be set up for the league? Dealer hall, electronic games room, or somewhere else? I'd like to drop by as soon as possible and not worry too much about having to track you down once I'm there.

Event
https://www.gencon.com/events/51187

Map of GenCon - (whoops, just Exhibitor map)
http://gallery.mailchimp.com/2f77d2f8c77398c0b064223ba/files/Exhibitors_with_web_links_revised_6.11.pdf

Sethala
07-06-2013, 12:18 AM
Ah, didn't realize there was an event for it already. Looks good, I'll have to sign up for it.

Any idea how late the computers will be running? I tend to have free time sometime after midnight most of the time...

Mercadian
07-06-2013, 12:33 AM
How about the alpha gets released prior to this and everyone that logs in while GenCon is going on, gets the promos?!?!?! BRILLIANT! You're welcome, Internet!

This would be a fantastic.

Hatchet
07-06-2013, 12:47 AM
The last time something like this was set-up at GenCon (by SOE) it was in the TCG hall with 32 systems. Given the normal set-up I would put a pretty good bet that it will be there again. I am really looking forward to this since there can be hours of downtime between events.

My only question is can the armbands be ordered through the ticket system and picked up at will call or will you need to exchange generics for armbands?

benczi
07-06-2013, 01:53 AM
I have just 1 thing to say: have fun @ gencon :).

Prism
07-06-2013, 03:59 AM
Plus it was mentioned on update 30:
We've taken in a lot of your feedback. Should we reach the next stretch goal and HEX Con happens, all convention promotional cards, sleeves, mercenaries and the like will be deposited into each Kickstarter backer's HEX account. We want to assure you that everybody will be able to gear-up and sleeve all the goodies from this campaign whether or not they will be able to attend. So, should we hit the 2.5 million dollar Stretch Goal, you'll be receiving a lovely care package courtesy of your friends here at Cryptozoic with lots of goodies.

Is this quote saying that we're all being silly and backers get the promos and sleeves regardless of attendance?

Phearbot
07-06-2013, 04:30 AM
I like the "collect all" idea.
My english is not the best so I can't even explain how disappoint I am.
So basically Cory you really want to make exclusive digital reawards for phisical events.
We, as community (the majority), already told you about this shitty idea of phisical events promos w/o the possibility to get those promo in some digital way.
Give us Internet Tickets and let us play a bit, have fun and improve our collection of sleeves/merch/aa and stuff like that.
Sorry again for my bad english.

Chiany
07-06-2013, 04:41 AM
I like the "collect all" idea.
My english is not the best so I can't even explain how disappoint I am.
So basically Cory you really want to make exclusive digital reawards for phisical events.
We, as community (the majority), already told you about this shitty idea of phisical events promos w/o the possibility to get those promo in some digital way.
Give us Internet Tickets and let us play a bit, have fun and improve our collection of sleeves/merch/aa and stuff like that.
Sorry again for my bad english.

Watch your language abit, no need to be rude.

Bossett
07-06-2013, 05:34 AM
I have a major concern that a lot of us got into Hex because it was a digital TCG - and CZE has twice now gone ahead and linked a card or reward to physical attendance (even though there was a HexCon backpeddle).

I don't see any reason why, in a digital game, there needs to be this connection to a physical event that so many people just cannot attend. Blizzard sells digital tickets to Blizzcon; why can't CZE add in a digital 'attendance' of some sort so those of us that will never, ever be able to make a con in the northern hemisphere can at least buy into a shot?

Gorgol
07-06-2013, 05:37 AM
You all look at thsi the wrong way. The promos aren't meant for people who are already interested in the game, they're meant as a way of promoting and getting new people into it. This is the point behind them. CZE already have us, but a majority of 'Con goers won't know or have been already interested. By having goods for physical events, these new people will be more enticed into potentially playing.

Chiany
07-06-2013, 05:45 AM
You all look at thsi the wrong way. The promos aren't meant for people who are already interested in the game, they're meant as a way of promoting and getting new people into it. This is the point behind them. CZE already have us, but a majority of 'Con goers won't know or have been already interested. By having goods for physical events, these new people will be more enticed into potentially playing.

Nobody has a problem with them giving goodies, but they do with it if they are con exclusive, game altering cards, like a new Mercenary.

Gorgol
07-06-2013, 05:50 AM
Nobody has a problem with them giving goodies, but they do with it if they are con exclusive, game altering cards, like a new Mercenary.
What better way though to show off how this game is different from every other TCG and the like out there than Mercenaries? Maybe equipment, but it doesn't have the overall impact as a first impression item that mercenaries have.

Ditsch
07-06-2013, 05:50 AM
Yeah the mercenary is really bad as it's game altering, but for me also the AA card is bad as i can't get it, and i specially did pledge a collector to get all the AA cards now i feel like being back stabbed from them. Not happy :(

Gorgol
07-06-2013, 06:01 AM
Yeah the mercenary is really bad as it's game altering, but for me also the AA card is bad as i can't get it, and i specially did pledge a collector to get all the AA cards now i feel like being back stabbed from them. Not happy :(

Are you also being "backstabbed" because during the campaign it will be IMPOSSIBLE (Cory's words) to have all PvE cards on one account?

31:00-32:00 in.
Edit: http://thegeekallstars.libsyn.com/episode-54-interview-with-cryptozoic-s-cory-jones
for some reason the other link doesn't work anymore.

Bossett
07-06-2013, 06:08 AM
You all look at thsi the wrong way. The promos aren't meant for people who are already interested in the game, they're meant as a way of promoting and getting new people into it. This is the point behind them. CZE already have us, but a majority of 'Con goers won't know or have been already interested. By having goods for physical events, these new people will be more enticed into potentially playing.

There's no reason for these to be *exclusive* goods.

CZE is saying to us, the people who are already fans "Well, you're in, so no use bothering with enticements anymore." If they're doing it intentionally or not, it doesn't matter, they're setting what some of us feel is a terrible precedent. I get it, it likely makes good business sense, but it's only just shy of being outright fan-hostile.

The Blizzcon model has worked really well, and they've already shown that they're happy with twitch and the like - I just don't get why they would tie a digital item to a real life, exclusive event.

nickon
07-06-2013, 06:25 AM
As a lot of people responding here, I share the same opinion. It's kind of sad that (pre-release of HEX even) CZE is thinking of connecting exclusive digital HEX goodies to a physical event only a small percent of their customer base can attend. If I would be living down the street, like any other HEX player I wouldnt bother for a second to cough up this $10 for getting my share.I hope CZE will come to their senses and come up with offering an alternative for all (future) HEX players around the world.

self1sch
07-06-2013, 07:11 AM
I hope I'm gonna get the chance to buy one AA-Ozawa off the AH. Just the thought that there is an AA-card which I don't own, makes me sick :D

Would be interesting, how many Ozawas will be given out by CZE...

Ditsch
07-06-2013, 07:32 AM
Are you also being "backstabbed" because during the campaign it will be IMPOSSIBLE (Cory's words) to have all PvE cards on one account?
http://thegeekallstars.libsyn.com/ep...c-s-cory-jones

31:00-32:00 in.

@Gorgol I highly doubt Cory is right about that, even if he thinks like that he will be proven wrong by the reality and how much people will grind PVE cards so i have no worries there. Well that's only my view but i heard those it's impossible to get stuff theories a million times in mmo's and each time people did prove them wrong, so i will go by my experience from those. And even if i can't get some of them myself i could use AH as people will sell them for a cheap price as you could always grind them.

@self1sch I hope i don't have to use the AH to get AA-Ozawa as it also makes me sick to not have it haha. :)

tusic
07-06-2013, 08:09 AM
As has been said a few times here: these items being given away aren't rewards for those who already have stake in the game: they're for the general con goer who is seeing Hex for the first time and is a way to entice them to sign up for the game (and get them to buy new cards in the future). This isn't Cryptozoic "stabbing you in the back." It's Crypto demoing their new game and garnering interest.

Also, although this is a digital game, there are going to be exclusives. Learn to deal with it. Do you guys honestly think there will never be a limited time promotion with an exclusive card or two? What about the top 5% of those who do the PVP competitively and get cards from that? Those cards won't be available to everyone, just those who earn them. What about those who are the best raiders? I'm sure there will be cards exclusive to those who beat all the top raids that everyone won't have access to.

Yes, it's a digital game, but that doesn't mean you get everything that's created for the game.

Oh, and stop bringing up Blizzard. They didn't let people buy the stream of Blizzcon to get the exclusive stuff, they did it to make more money, that's all.

mainstager
07-06-2013, 10:02 AM
So much QQ. It hurts my soul.

Cecil578
07-06-2013, 10:04 AM
Well, if you make an event, in 1 specific country, on 1 continent... ofc there will be QQ. I personally live in Europe, and even if I wanted to go to the Con.. I couldnt afford it. If there was an equivelant stand in a Con in europe and other continents.. np's from my side.

tusic
07-06-2013, 10:09 AM
I'm sure there will be more events at different conventions and gaming events all over the world eventually. This just happens to be the first publicly playable version at a con and people are going a little bit crazy with the outrage about it.

Cecil578
07-06-2013, 10:16 AM
Will most likely not be the same rewards tho..

TheMadHatter
07-06-2013, 10:22 AM
You all look at thsi the wrong way. The promos aren't meant for people who are already interested in the game, they're meant as a way of promoting and getting new people into it. This is the point behind them. CZE already have us, but a majority of 'Con goers won't know or have been already interested. By having goods for physical events, these new people will be more enticed into potentially playing.

If you need to alienate your core followers in order to draw in new people, your entire community will FOREVER SUFFER from internal division. I would be deeply personally disappointed in Hex as a game if they continue on this path. Hex is only the best until someone makes something better. Any time you draw in people though cheep, impulse-payoffs rather than though having a superior product (drafting/gameplay, storyline, economy), you lower the value of your game and community that follows it.

I would rather play a game with people who joined became they believe it is worth playing, than a game with people who join because they got a handout. People who bought hex accounts for friends should get these perks, not people who are passing by. I hope everyone loves Hex...but if CZE can't sell Hex with live gameplay and a smile, it is a weak product.

TheMadHatter
07-06-2013, 10:36 AM
I would like to note that if exclusive content is viewed as valuable... Having location-based promos will dramatically decrease the potential value of cards that could be given to say, the top 1000 ranked drafters in the past year. Giving exclusive content is not only fun and exciting, it is a clear declaration of where your interests lie and what direction the community will grow in. By pumping promos out though physical events, Hex as a game will have economic incentives that shift it towards a physically based game/community. Cards are a resource, and playing a card just for fun is generally a misplay. I am deeply concerned over the economic value of this TCG if this continues. I wonder if CZE has an economist employed who has studied online economies (TF2, DOTA2, WOW, etc), because there is a lot going on here and it seems like nobody is regulating it.

Gorgol
07-06-2013, 10:48 AM
@Gorgol I highly doubt Cory is right about that, even if he thinks like that he will be proven wrong by the reality and how much people will grind PVE cards so i have no worries there. Well that's only my view but i heard those it's impossible to get stuff theories a million times in mmo's and each time people did prove them wrong, so i will go by my experience from those. And even if i can't get some of them myself i could use AH as people will sell them for a cheap price as you could always grind them.

@self1sch I hope i don't have to use the AH to get AA-Ozawa as it also makes me sick to not have it haha. :)
To me this says you didn't even listen to it. When you pick one it locks you out of the other permanently. There is no grind. It is untradeable. And every year is a brand new set of two to pick ONE from.
Edit: http://thegeekallstars.libsyn.com/episode-54-interview-with-cryptozoic-s-cory-jones
for some reason the other link doesn't work anymore. 31:30 is where he mentions why its impossible.
49:20 is when he starts into the conversation about promotional items.
This interview was at the end of May, plenty before KS ended.

Ditsch
07-06-2013, 11:34 AM
@Gorgol the info i got (all the time) is that the only non tradeable stuff would be the perks from the 250 Dollar tiers and sleeves and mercs not a single time someone said a pve card would be untradable.

Chosing one winnable champion card and locking out the other and not making it tradable is a quite dumb thing i would be really surprised if they would do that but yeah if they choose to do it the game just totally lost me pve wise and i will completly ignore it as i never can get everything and focus on pvp.

Still thank you for the info. So i can be happy i didn't pledge for a pve perk i would be so upset now lol.

tusic
07-06-2013, 12:07 PM
Crazy double post...

tusic
07-06-2013, 12:24 PM
If you need to alienate your core followers in order to draw in new people, your entire community will FOREVER SUFFER from internal division. I would be deeply personally disappointed in Hex as a game if they continue on this path. Hex is only the best until someone makes something better. Any time you draw in people though cheep, impulse-payoffs rather than though having a superior product (drafting/gameplay, storyline, economy), you lower the value of your game and community that follows it.

I would rather play a game with people who joined became they believe it is worth playing, than a game with people who join because they got a handout. People who bought hex accounts for friends should get these perks, not people who are passing by. I hope everyone loves Hex...but if CZE can't sell Hex with live gameplay and a smile, it is a weak product.

The 15,000 who Kickstartered Hex are hopefully 1% of those who will play the game and see it at conventions. I don't think CZE is worried about alienating us too much. When the game hits its stride and really gets going, the few of you who are really complaining will be even less of a minority.

This is how a game gets promoted these days: exclusives and giveaways to draw people in to generate more revenue later. Look at any FTP game and it's the same thing.

Cecil578
07-06-2013, 01:56 PM
$10 will get you a wristband to play all weekend long and a code redeemable in-game for a yet-to-be-revealed Mercenary and one free starter deck. (+ the AA card)

Make that thing avaliable via only donation (10$ to get it ofc'') so ppl have a chance to get it whereever in the world they are.

iscariotrex
07-06-2013, 02:51 PM
Look guys, I don't know what world you guys live in. Probably too much in your own head-space. There are plenty of things in the real world that I like but will never have a hope of owning. I don't wish that those things didn't exist. I don't hold open animosity towards those people who get to own them. I don't hold animosity for the companies that make the things that I will never have. To do any of those things is to be incredibly selfish.

These promos will be a tiny % of all that is available in this game. Very small subsets of people will have them. None of the promos will be game breaking or necessary. You will completely be able to enjoy most of the game and, if you get to have hours of fun playing this game, that should be enough for you people.

This game is going to be amazing. I sincerely hope I'll be able to find so cool, hardcore, non-petty individuals to play through some raids with.

OutlandishMatt
07-06-2013, 03:55 PM
I don't wish that those things didn't exist.

I don't think anyone is wanting it to not exist as much as they want it to exist at more than one venue, 1000s of miles away, for just a few days. I could guarantee there would be a lot less hostility if they were to announce something that I have suggested where you could login during these conventions and get the same promotional items. My biggest thing is seeing something given away that I want for a game that has "Trading" in the title but can't trade for. EVERYTHING that I can use in the game should be tradable.

Prism
07-06-2013, 04:07 PM
Starting to regret backing this game $500... If this is the type of stupid design choices they make I'm not sure if I want to be a part of it

Bossett
07-06-2013, 04:19 PM
Look guys, I don't know what world you guys live in. Probably too much in your own head-space. There are plenty of things in the real world that I like but will never have a hope of owning. I don't wish that those things didn't exist. I don't hold open animosity towards those people who get to own them. I don't hold animosity for the companies that make the things that I will never have. To do any of those things is to be incredibly selfish.

The problem isn't that there are things we can't own; at least for me. The problem is that Hex is attractive largely because it's a digital TCG, and they actually used the examples of people that can't get to game shops, etc. as a selling point.

Then, they turn around and make getting to a physical location a requirement if you really want to try collect the lot.

That seems remarkably two-faced to me. If they added the card in as exclusive if you also bought a $120 live stream ticket, that would be fine. If they added it as a 0.1% chance random drop from primal boosters, that would be fine. The thing driving all this QQ for me: the fact that a game sold on the basis that it's all digital, 'taking advantage of the format', catering to people that can't get out to events is now going distinctly physical, rolling in disadvantages of the old format and locking it down to people in who can attend an event in the US.

Nthanel
07-06-2013, 04:21 PM
I dont understand what the problem is. Its a CCG people. Its not very collectable if EVERYONE can have everything. That's part of the challenge and fun. And has seen though other type of video games and CCGs and even some board games they release special stuff to entice people who HAVEN'T heard of the game to play ( as well as people who can afford to go to all these types of events.) I mean really. Get over your selves. They are a business. They need to do what they need to do to attract new people to make this gave a HUGE success! Bottom line deal with it and play, or dont and just leave and stop bitching.

Ditsch
07-06-2013, 04:42 PM
Starting to regret backing this game $500... If this is the type of stupid design choices they make I'm not sure if I want to be a part of it

Yeah true i feel the same if this is the road they are going down then i am really not sure if i want to be part of it, i did quit all physical tcg's where they made such choices and i had the feeling this wouldn't go down like the others at least on how they reacted sensible about such things when the kickstarter was on. :(

Bossett
07-06-2013, 04:43 PM
I dont understand what the problem is. Its a CCG people. Its not very collectable if EVERYONE can have everything. That's part of the challenge and fun. And has seen though other type of video games and CCGs and even some board games they release special stuff to entice people who HAVEN'T heard of the game to play ( as well as people who can afford to go to all these types of events.) I mean really. Get over your selves. They are a business. They need to do what they need to do to attract new people to make this gave a HUGE success! Bottom line deal with it and play, or dont and just leave and stop bitching.

This game is pre-release.

If we want CZE to not make things physically exclusive, tied to attendance at an event in a particular geographical area, etc. - now is the time we have to tell them.

It's a digital collectible game, and CZE has made a big deal of that. They're now deliberately tying in physical attendance at an exclusive event, which goes against the ideas that CZE themselves said they were against (you surely heard the "it's late and you can't get to a card shop..." line?).

I don't care that the card is exclusive; that's not a big deal to me. I care that it's exclusive because they're pulling in ideas from physical TCGs that they themselves said they were against, and used as a selling point!

Gorgol
07-06-2013, 04:59 PM
Starting to regret backing this game $500... If this is the type of stupid design choices they make I'm not sure if I want to be a part of it

Regret it all you want but their intentions was made over a week before the KS even ended. I already linked the interview where this was all stated and it was back from the end of May.

Sutekh
07-06-2013, 07:24 PM
All of this is moot if they are able to make the exclusive cards available to those not attending the physical events somehow. If I were attending such an event I would not feel that the items I receive are in any way less valuable if they can also be obtained otherwise. I really hope they do this, because as countless others have said, I too do not like the idea of having to physically be places in order to collect stuff from a DIGITAL game.

Good news is if they do sell these cards/items/mercs online I only see a win-win situation for everyone, so why wouldn't they?

iscariotrex
07-06-2013, 09:01 PM
Okay, chiming in yet again to call bullshit on a couple things.

1)CZE said they wanted to really take advantage of the digital space, and now they betray all of us by making event exclusives tied to a physical venue. When CZE talked about wanting to take advantage of the digital nature of this game, they were referring to how the cards operate mechanically. This is your double back, your socketed cards, and anything else that wouldn't be easily replicable by physical cards. They are pushing the digital nature of the design space and haven't gone back on anything they have said.

2)CZE said that "it's late and you can't get to a cardshop..."line. Nice use of an almost indecipherable quote to try and prove what exactly? But let me work my magic. I saw that interview with Cory. He was talking about how he has kind of aged out of tcg's in that he doesn't feel comfortable hanging out with teenagers at a card shop. Also referencing in there the convenience of being able to fit a digital game into his life and schedule, when he can hop online and play a few rounds to kill some time. It had absolutely nothing to do with conventions or promos.

If you are already begining to regret your investment, try to sell it off. BTW could you find someone who isn't such a whiny pussy to replace you?

IndigoShade
07-06-2013, 09:19 PM
If they do have content that's exclusive to physical events, I do feel that it would go against one of the big selling points of the game (it not being restricted by the things that a physical TCG is), it's not really a deal breaker for me. However, one thing people seem be glossing over is the fact that this article never uses the word exclusive or explicitly states that anything available at Gen Con won't be available anywhere/anytime else.

Rycajo
07-06-2013, 10:24 PM
However, one thing people seem be glossing over is the fact that this article never uses the word exclusive or explicitly states that anything available at Gen Con won't be available anywhere/anytime else.

Good point.

As early game backers, we should let CZE know when we dislike something. But, we can do it in a civil manner without finger pointing and overly dramatic ultimatums.

Stok3d
07-06-2013, 11:36 PM
I really can't believe what I'm reading in the community response posts.

1) The AA card is tradable. Just pick it up on the AH. What's the problem?
2) The Merc comes on a scratch off card. If you want to be a completionist, buy it off ebay.

Let me dive in to what going to this convention means for those living in the US outside say outside a 1.5 hour radius (which is >99% of everyone). I'll just compare cost to get the Convention Items.

1)My Cost = >$500 (I'm driving, but pay Hotel, food, gas, tickets to convention, and Missed Work)
2)Ebay Cost = ~$40 (40,000 Unique ppl went to GenCon last year. Those that don't play hex will likely drop the swag bag on ebay. Shouldn't be very difficult to get one.

So where is the issue? If you want the cheapest way to get the goodies, buy it off ebay for a song and dance. You can still get the Hex Bag Swag if you don't go. Again, AA tradable on AH and the scratch off Merc sellable in the secondary market. Going to this event will cost you a LOT more for the in game stuff. I am actually saddened to read all the whining in this thread.


Read the below guys. And by the love of god stop with the tantrums. Cory has a good thing going here, let it play out.

I thought maybe I should chime in and give you the scoop on how these work:

Promo AA Cards: Tradable in game, like any other card
Sleeves: not tradable (if you have a sleeve you earned it not bought it)
Promo Mercenaries: Tradable outside game (they will come on a cool oversized card with a scratch off code)

So there it is, I thought it was a reasonable way to handle event promos, it’s something I am passionate about. Cryptozoic live events are an important part of what we do (and I personally love them), I really want to have something exciting at these events. Maybe I’m spoiled by WOW loot cards but the energy that fun desirable promos create is amazing and important.

Let me be the first to say "THANKS CZE" for representing Hex at one of the best gaming conventions in the world. Growing this community is vital and getting everyone there excited for this game there will of course help keep the momentum going post Beta. I also appreciate getting our hands on the product and providing those who are lucky enough to make it a goodie bag. This goodie bag will keep HEX on other's minds who never heard of the game and create immediate and continued hype on secondary markets. This is VERY healthy for the game.

Nthanel
07-07-2013, 01:05 PM
This ^

Ginaz
07-07-2013, 02:17 PM
I really can't believe what I'm reading in the community response posts.

1) The AA card is tradable. Just pick it up on the AH. What's the problem?
2) The Merc comes on a scratch off card. If you want to be a completionist, buy it off ebay.

Let me dive in to what going to this convention means for those living in the US outside say outside a 1.5 hour radius (which is >99% of everyone). I'll just compare cost to get the Convention Items.

1)My Cost = >$500 (I'm driving, but pay Hotel, food, gas, tickets to convention, and Missed Work)
2)Ebay Cost = ~$40 (40,000 Unique ppl went to GenCon last year. Those that don't play hex will likely drop the swag bag on ebay. Shouldn't be very difficult to get one.

So where is the issue? If you want the cheapest way to get the goodies, buy it off ebay for a song and dance. You can still get the Hex Bag Swag if you don't go. Again, AA tradable on AH and the scratch off Merc sellable in the secondary market. Going to this event will cost you a LOT more for the in game stuff. I am actually saddened to read all the whining in this thread.


Read the below guys. And by the love of god stop with the tantrums. Cory has a good thing going here, let it play out.


Let me be the first to say "THANKS CZE" for representing Hex at one of the best gaming conventions in the world. Growing this community is vital and getting everyone there excited for this game there will of course help keep the momentum going post Beta. I also appreciate getting our hands on the product and providing those who are lucky enough to make it a goodie bag. This goodie bag will keep HEX on other's minds who never heard of the game and create immediate and continued hype on secondary markets. This is VERY healthy for the game.

Copy pasting your posts I see?
http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=24425&page=39&p=269646#post269646
No matter how many times you post it it boils down to "I'm getting mine so I don't want anything to change". I wonder how much you'll be selling your goodies for?

Ginaz
07-07-2013, 02:26 PM
If you need to alienate your core followers in order to draw in new people, your entire community will FOREVER SUFFER from internal division.

Anyone remember when soe did this with swg and the nge? They were willing to risk alienating and losing the customers they had for the potential customers they might have. Remember how well that worked out?

Velorath
07-07-2013, 02:44 PM
Regret it all you want but their intentions was made over a week before the KS even ended. I already linked the interview where this was all stated and it was back from the end of May.

You mean that somewhat contradictory answer where he also said he didn't want people to feel like they had to buy something outside the game to get something in the game, which essentially they'd be doing even for the people that can actually make it to the Con? He also never once mentions AA cards in that bit and the only thing he does say about cards is that he doesn't want to disenfranchise players who want to collect all the cards.

Aside from that, Cory though packaging cards with merchandise was a good idea also, but due to feedback from other people on the team, he brought it to the community first and then decided not to do it (this was only a couple days before that podcast was recorded). He also listened to community feedback about the planned exclusives for HexCon also.

Despite obviously being passionate about Con exclusives, there's no reason to think that he wouldn't appreciate community feedback on this matter as well, which makes it particularly offensive for people like Stok3d to try to shut down the conversation by trying to dismiss people's valid concerns as "whining" and "tantrums". Condescending attitudes and trying to stifle discussion and debate don't do the community an good.

Stok3d
07-07-2013, 03:16 PM
Despite obviously being passionate about Con exclusives, there's no reason to think that he wouldn't appreciate community feedback on this matter as well, which makes it particularly offensive for people like Stok3d to try to shut down the conversation

CZE is rooted in these particular inserts with the WoW TCG. Why would this be any different with Hex? It has been highly successful for the game and the company. Reading the quote, I believe the combative efforts to "change things" from many in this thread are simply serving to stir up unnecessary animosity in the game. With his statement of being "passionate on this topic" is a nice way of stating that Cory is sticking to his guns on this particular detail. While not everyone sees the big picture he's trying to achieve, I for one agree with and support his judgement.



So there it is, I thought it was a reasonable way to handle event promos, it’s something I am passionate about. Cryptozoic live events are an important part of what we do (and I personally love them), I really want to have something exciting at these events. Maybe I’m spoiled by WOW loot cards but the energy that fun desirable promos create is amazing and important.

Velorath
07-07-2013, 03:42 PM
CZE is rooted in these particular inserts with the WoW TCG. Why would this be any different with Hex?

Well for one thing in that exact same interview Gorgol keeps mentioning, the interviewer brings up the loot cards in the WoW TCG and asks Cory if that's something they'd do for Hex (the specific example used is inserting loot cards in some of Crypto's other products), and Cory specifically mentions that it's something they would not do for Hex. So yeah, "but they did it for the WoW TCG" is pretty clearly not something that can automatically be justified for Hex.

Beyond that, while I've seen tons of people arguing that these sort of promotions aren't bad, I've yet to really see anyone put forth a convincing reason that they're good. Cory's enthusiasm isn't a reason in and of itself as he's already stated that sometimes he needs to be reigned in by other people on the team who can explain why something he thinks is a great idea might backfire. Then there's the vague talk about promoting the game to new players, but I haven't seen any explanation as to why a) they think a significant number of random passers-by would pay the $10 entry fee, and b) why an exclusive merc, sleeves, and possibly an AA card and maybe some other prizes if they do well enough would provide more incentive for them to play the game at release as opposed to just relying on the gameplay to convince them, and maybe rewarding them with boosters/free drafts.

Lastly, I can't really see what my motive would be to stir up unnecessary animosity for this game given that I dropped a good chunk of money into it already and for the most part have been pretty happy with what I've seen of the game and how CZE has interacted with the community.

Mugaaz
07-08-2013, 07:48 AM
Not a fan of give aways for cons in a digital game. If you're going to be a digital game, then be one. Stuff like the MTG equivalent of GP / FNM promos need to be given away for digital play, not coming to a con.

Kslidz
07-08-2013, 09:30 AM
wow this is insane. Is evyone in this thread 5 years old? like seriously, I had no idea there was a kickstarter so I got slacker backer.


So is that not fair, cause I was not personally able to reach the kickstarter? NO it is perfectly fine I did not know was not able to know but that is my own shortcomings. Just cause you didn't know or have thousands of dollars to go to the con does not make anything that happend unfair. Its business, calm down and stop acting like you are 5.

Vomitlord
07-08-2013, 11:46 AM
wow this is insane. Is evyone in this thread 5 years old? like seriously, I had no idea there was a kickstarter so I got slacker backer.


So is that not fair, cause I was not personally able to reach the kickstarter? NO it is perfectly fine I did not know was not able to know but that is my own shortcomings. Just cause you didn't know or have thousands of dollars to go to the con does not make anything that happend unfair. Its business, calm down and stop acting like you are 5.

Exactly right. Some people on these forums need to take a step back and stop being so selfish. We have exclusive cards and mercenaries so why can't other people get them?

I will probably never go to a hex physical event but I certainly don't begrudge anyone who goes getting goodies.

If I hadn't stumbled on the kickstarter I would obviously think of it as a missed opportunity but I wouldn't throw myself off a cliff.

Get some perspective people.

Rydavim
07-08-2013, 01:56 PM
Yes, it sucks that there are things you can't get. I'm sure the people who missed the KS are even more jealous than many of you. This is a gaming company. They're going to have a presence at gaming conventions. It's how you spread the word and expand the player base, which is good for everyone. Goodies are a pretty standard thing for booths to use to create buzz. Comes with the territory.

I won't be able to go to Gen Con. But I'm glad they are rewarding the people who can go and support this great game. For those of you who are lucky enough to be attending, please show the world the best face of our community, and not the ugly selfishness in parts of this thread. And have fun!

Sanik
07-08-2013, 02:40 PM
Some quick points I'd like to address that may not have been clear from the article:

1) We will have a booth in the convention hall with a playable Hex demo and a separate league setup in the TCG tournament hall.

2) We will have 32 stations set up in the tournament hall where players can earn the convention rewards.

Ginaz
07-08-2013, 02:42 PM
wow this is insane. Is evyone in this thread 5 years old? like seriously, I had no idea there was a kickstarter so I got slacker backer.


So is that not fair, cause I was not personally able to reach the kickstarter? NO it is perfectly fine I did not know was not able to know but that is my own shortcomings. Just cause you didn't know or have thousands of dollars to go to the con does not make anything that happend unfair. Its business, calm down and stop acting like you are 5.

The fact you didn't know about the KS was your fault. I didn't know about the Grim Dawn KS and it looks fantastic and its something I'd really like to play but its my fault for not not knowing about it. Oh, well. The difference here is that everyone who has backed Hex and is following it knows about Gen Con. However, very few people will be able to attend.

I'm not opposed to giving away goodies and Cons like this. Just not exclusives. Boosters, sleeves, primal packs, AA, starter decks or something like that is fine. It sets a bad precedent esp. for a game who's main appeal was an online digital experience without any ties to anything physical. Having to go to a physical location to acquire a card goes against that.

Ginaz
07-08-2013, 02:45 PM
Some quick points I'd like to address that may not have been clear from the article:

1) We will have a booth in the convention hall with a playable Hex demo and a separate league setup in the TCG tournament hall.

2) We will have 32 stations set up in the tournament hall where players can earn the convention rewards.

Your post does nothing to address the issue we're discussing. Hex was billed as an online digital game with no ties to anything physical yet now you're giving away cards based on attendance in a physical location. Thats not the game I was sold when I pledge my $250 in good faith.

Rydavim
07-08-2013, 03:24 PM
Practically every online game made in the past decade is "100%" digital. They give away digital items. I think it would be tough to find a major online gaming company that doesn't give away swag at conventions. I'm not sure where in the publications from Cryptozoic it said that there would be "absolutely no ties to the physical world whatsoever from now until eternity". But if they did, I would be more than happy to take a look at the citation.

Conventions give goodies and exclusives. That's the world we live in. Maybe Cryptozoic will make things like that trad-able at some point, maybe they won't. Giving away special things that do not effect competitive game play isn't a big deal. So far I haven't seen anything announced to indicate that any convention give-aways or prizes will have a meaningful effect on any measurable scale of competitive gaming. But hey, I'm open to having my opinion changed if there are some official announcements I missed. I certainly don't claim to have read everything.

Ginaz
07-08-2013, 03:33 PM
Practically every online game made in the past decade is "100%" digital. They give away digital items. I think it would be tough to find a major online gaming company that doesn't give away swag at conventions. I'm not sure where in the publications from Cryptozoic it said that there would be "absolutely no ties to the physical world whatsoever from now until eternity". But if they did, I would be more than happy to take a look at the citation.

Conventions give goodies and exclusives. That's the world we live in. Maybe Cryptozoic will make things like that trad-able at some point, maybe they won't. Giving away special things that do not effect competitive game play isn't a big deal. So far I haven't seen anything announced to indicate that any convention give-aways or prizes will have a meaningful effect on any measurable scale of competitive gaming. But hey, I'm open to having my opinion changed if there are some official announcements I missed. I certainly don't claim to have read everything.

I'm not opposed to them giving away goodies at conventions such as this. Its what they're giving away that I take issue with. Magic stopped giving away exclusives tied to being physically at an event years ago because they realized it was a bad idea.

Sanik
07-08-2013, 04:14 PM
Your post does nothing to address the issue we're discussing. Hex was billed as an online digital game with no ties to anything physical yet now you're giving away cards based on attendance in a physical location. Thats not the game I was sold when I pledge my $250 in good faith.

Cory has touched on this a few times in the General forums here (http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=24425) and we are actively listening to constructive community feedback, as we have done from the beginning. I stopped by to address a couple questions that were asked earlier in this thread and then drowned out by the prevailing discussion topic.

There's no need to be confrontational. Just because I did not explicitly address your topic does not mean your concerns have not been heard.

Ginaz
07-08-2013, 04:22 PM
Cory has touched on this a few times in the General forums here (http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=24425) and we are actively listening to constructive community feedback, as we have done from the beginning. I stopped by to address a couple questions that were asked earlier in this thread and then drowned out by the prevailing discussion topic.

There's no need to be confrontational. Just because I did not explicitly address your topic does not mean your concerns have not been heard.

Sorry. I didn't mean it to sound confrontational. Its just disappointing to see the direction you guys are going wrt exclusive promo cards when other major TCG companies, namely Magic, realized it was a bad idea years ago.

Phearbot
07-08-2013, 05:17 PM
Ehy, do promos exclusive for convention if u want (I don't like the idea but buisness is buisness)... but let us the option to buy an online ticket and watch the stream at our home and take our promos too...

Gorgol
07-08-2013, 05:39 PM
Thanks for the explanation Sanik.

Chiany
07-09-2013, 01:06 AM
Thanks Drew for the explanation.
It's good to see you "Purples" are always active on these forum, even if its just on the background.

Keep up the good work!!

Ditsch
07-09-2013, 04:35 AM
Thank you for the feedback and letting us know that you are hard working and listening.

Diesbudt
07-09-2013, 06:51 AM
Ehy, do promos exclusive for convention if u want (I don't like the idea but buisness is buisness)... but let us the option to buy an online ticket and watch the stream at our home and take our promos too...

Who says there will be a stream...? This is not like Blizzcon where EVERYTHING is blizzard. This is GenCon, Hex will only be a small part of it.

Also Exclusives such as sleeves, and mercs are fine. As By the way it is shaping up, there will be hundreds of mercs be end of year 1. Having them all won't be a big deal.

Plus we do not know if the merc may be available at a later date through a digital medium. (Most likely)

Diesbudt
07-09-2013, 06:52 AM
Practically every online game made in the past decade is "100%" digital. They give away digital items. I think it would be tough to find a major online gaming company that doesn't give away swag at conventions. I'm not sure where in the publications from Cryptozoic it said that there would be "absolutely no ties to the physical world whatsoever from now until eternity". But if they did, I would be more than happy to take a look at the citation.

Conventions give goodies and exclusives. That's the world we live in. Maybe Cryptozoic will make things like that trad-able at some point, maybe they won't. Giving away special things that do not effect competitive game play isn't a big deal. So far I haven't seen anything announced to indicate that any convention give-aways or prizes will have a meaningful effect on any measurable scale of competitive gaming. But hey, I'm open to having my opinion changed if there are some official announcements I missed. I certainly don't claim to have read everything.

GenCon always has many game exclusives you can never get anywhere else. Both digital medium and physical. It isn't anything new. How do I know? I have went past 8 years with my group of people. And going this year or course.

BossHoss
07-09-2013, 07:36 AM
I'm not opposed to them giving away goodies at conventions such as this. Its what they're giving away that I take issue with. Magic stopped giving away exclusives tied to being physically at an event years ago because they realized it was a bad idea.

Judge promos, FNM promos, DotP Promos, Buy a box promos, MtG comicbook promos, PTQ promos, Pre-release promos, Release promos...

Not sure why you think this > (Magic stopped giving away exclusives tied to being physically at an event years ago because they realized it was a bad idea.)

Rydavim
07-09-2013, 10:20 AM
@Diesbudt - I'm a little confused about the quote before your reply. We seem to agree? Exclusives have always been a part of conventions. I don't see that changing any time soon, and I don't disagree with it just because I can't attend every convention.

On the other mentioned topic...

I'm not opposed to them giving away goodies at conventions such as this. Its what they're giving away that I take issue with. Magic stopped giving away exclusives tied to being physically at an event years ago because they realized it was a bad idea.

This doesn't seem to be true to me.
Source One: SDCC 2013 Featuring Exclusive Planeswalker Cards (http://www.examiner.com/article/sdcc13-to-feature-exclusive-planeswalker-cards-for-magic-the-gathering)
Source Two: MtG Exclusives at SDCC (http://geek-news.mtv.com/2013/06/24/magic-the-gathering-planeswalkers-san-diego-comic-con/)
(Less Professional) Source Three: Exclusive Planeswalker Set at SDCC Released Before Core 2014 Set (http://awesometoyblog.com/2013/06/24/magic-the-gathering-sdcc-exclusive-planeswalker-card-set-at-hasbrotoyshop/)

Attendees will be receiving exclusive cards only featured at SDCC, which are also available before the core set is released in 2014.

I get it. It's disappointing. But realistically no one is going to be able to get every card ever created without putting a ton of money into it. Money won't even help if some things end up non-tradeable. But I personally feel that it's unreasonable to deny someone something just because I can't have it. Maybe one day companies will do it differently, but for now I think convention exclusives are something Hex players are just going to have to come to terms with.

I can't attend SDCC or Gen Con or many other conventions, but I support the people who can in growing the community of this game. Giveaways are an incentive to do that. Attendees - please show the world the best face of the Hex community!

Diesbudt
07-09-2013, 11:19 AM
@Diesbudt - I'm a little confused about the quote before your reply. We seem to agree? Exclusives have always been a part of conventions. I don't see that changing any time soon, and I don't disagree with it just because I can't attend every convention.


It was basically support/reinforce your statement as a second witness to such events.

Also PvE exclusivity (aka mercs and even playable cards) I am fine with. Why? It does not effect competitive PvP. So it shouldn't be that big of an issue. Unless one is a die hard addicted collector that believes they should have the right to every card.

Kslidz
07-09-2013, 11:52 AM
The fact you didn't know about the KS was your fault. . The fact you dont hve enough money(time whatever) to go to the con is your fault. yes it was my fault I didnt know about KS but jsut knowing shouldnt be enough to reward you calm down

Diesbudt
07-09-2013, 12:25 PM
The fact you dont hve enough money(time whatever) to go to the con is your fault. yes it was my fault I didnt know about KS but jsut knowing shouldnt be enough to reward you calm down

Wow. ouch epic burn.

Patrigan
07-10-2013, 12:48 AM
I just want to sa that I too am against any mechanical exclusives. For now, this only includes Mercenaries. I am not opposed to sleeves, alternative backgrounds, AAs, ...

Each and every mercenary I saw till now got all my deckbuilding gears grinding. I want them all, just so I can take them for a spin and actually use them. Taking away this opportunity for me, is like taking away access to a tournament legal PvP card and they're obviously not doing that.

For that very same reason I am 100% opposed to the Mercenaries (and PvE card) kickstarter exclusives and I would fully support a decision to make these available to the public after release. For the record, I backed it and have access to all these mercenaries. But I know I am not alone in my opinion and there will be others who will be really sad that they can't get the KS exclusives. Sometimes, it's not your fault that you didn't know about it, so why should we punish them?

I am NOT opposed to these exclusives being more like a "prerelease" where people get the mercenary to toy around with, and after a month or two, it becomes available to the big public. The best way to approach this would be an ingame "tavern" where you can permanently "hire" these mercenaries for a big amount of money (got to work for it, right).

Again I am not against purely cosmetic exclusives. There SHOULD be exclusives at events, to reward people making the trip. The exclusives should just NEVER be mechanical. So sleeves, alternative backgrounds, AAs, normal available cards with a special mark on the double back, ... are all great options.

Any response to this statement must address one question for me, or I will just ignore it. We already can see in this thread the harm that having mechanical exclusives does. What harm does it do if there are no mechanical exclusives? (meaning there are still exclusives, just no mechanical ones)

Ginaz
07-10-2013, 02:10 AM
@Diesbudt - I'm a little confused about the quote before your reply. We seem to agree? Exclusives have always been a part of conventions. I don't see that changing any time soon, and I don't disagree with it just because I can't attend every convention.

On the other mentioned topic...


This doesn't seem to be true to me.
Source One: SDCC 2013 Featuring Exclusive Planeswalker Cards (http://www.examiner.com/article/sdcc13-to-feature-exclusive-planeswalker-cards-for-magic-the-gathering)
Source Two: MtG Exclusives at SDCC (http://geek-news.mtv.com/2013/06/24/magic-the-gathering-planeswalkers-san-diego-comic-con/)
(Less Professional) Source Three: Exclusive Planeswalker Set at SDCC Released Before Core 2014 Set (http://awesometoyblog.com/2013/06/24/magic-the-gathering-sdcc-exclusive-planeswalker-card-set-at-hasbrotoyshop/)

Attendees will be receiving exclusive cards only featured at SDCC, which are also available before the core set is released in 2014.

I get it. It's disappointing. But realistically no one is going to be able to get every card ever created without putting a ton of money into it. Money won't even help if some things end up non-tradeable. But I personally feel that it's unreasonable to deny someone something just because I can't have it. Maybe one day companies will do it differently, but for now I think convention exclusives are something Hex players are just going to have to come to terms with.

I can't attend SDCC or Gen Con or many other conventions, but I support the people who can in growing the community of this game. Giveaways are an incentive to do that. Attendees - please show the world the best face of the Hex community!

What I meant by "exclusives" was an original card that is not some sort of AA that you can't get by any other means other than going to an event. The ones you linked are all AA.

Ginaz
07-10-2013, 02:18 AM
The fact you dont hve enough money(time whatever) to go to the con is your fault. yes it was my fault I didnt know about KS but jsut knowing shouldnt be enough to reward you calm down

I could go if I wanted but spending upwards of $1000 just to get a code for a digital card is stupid. Technically, I guess I do have the opportunity to go but realistically...come on. I think its a dumb idea Crypto is doing this and equally dumb that Cory seems to think its a good idea but whatever. Its not my company and they're free to do what they want, doesn't mean I have to like it. It just dampens my enthusiasm for Hex and makes me question whether supporting it for as much as I did was a good idea.

Diesbudt
07-10-2013, 05:24 AM
I just want to sa that I too am against any mechanical exclusives. For now, this only includes Mercenaries. I am not opposed to sleeves, alternative backgrounds, AAs, ...

Each and every mercenary I saw till now got all my deckbuilding gears grinding. I want them all, just so I can take them for a spin and actually use them. Taking away this opportunity for me, is like taking away access to a tournament legal PvP card and they're obviously not doing that.

For that very same reason I am 100% opposed to the Mercenaries (and PvE card) kickstarter exclusives and I would fully support a decision to make these available to the public after release. For the record, I backed it and have access to all these mercenaries. But I know I am not alone in my opinion and there will be others who will be really sad that they can't get the KS exclusives. Sometimes, it's not your fault that you didn't know about it, so why should we punish them?

I am NOT opposed to these exclusives being more like a "prerelease" where people get the mercenary to toy around with, and after a month or two, it becomes available to the big public. The best way to approach this would be an ingame "tavern" where you can permanently "hire" these mercenaries for a big amount of money (got to work for it, right).

Again I am not against purely cosmetic exclusives. There SHOULD be exclusives at events, to reward people making the trip. The exclusives should just NEVER be mechanical. So sleeves, alternative backgrounds, AAs, normal available cards with a special mark on the double back, ... are all great options.

Any response to this statement must address one question for me, or I will just ignore it. We already can see in this thread the harm that having mechanical exclusives does. What harm does it do if there are no mechanical exclusives? (meaning there are still exclusives, just no mechanical ones)

So you think mercs shouldn't be exclusive. I Couldn't care less about exclusive sleeves, and I think mercs is a great option even if I cannot obtain some of them. Your opinion and mine will not co-exist.

AA cards affect value, and if they just kep doing AA cards for events, that actually affects the market as it is tradable. Unlike Mercs. So that is out of the question.

Sleeves, once you find one you like, unless you get a set off of a very hard achievement like say winning a championship tournament, no one will care very much for them. So not a good exclusive choice.

Alternate background sis just AA, and a mark on the back of the card? No one would care about that.

So in the end Mercs are a good choice.

1) It does not affect the PvP part of the game any. Which is where balance needs to be upheld
2) Heros will odds are be stronger than most if not all mercs, and by end of 1 year we will probably have 30+ mercs out in the game, exclusive and non. Missing a few shouldn't make anyone feel mechanically inadaquet
3) Who is to say this merc will not be available at a later date through a different promotion? Many exclusive promotions find themselves re-used in others to get more chances out there.
4) This merc will be tradable BEFORE the code is used in the game. (I.e. can trade the code) So the option is there to obtain it through other means, just hard
5) All games with exclusives have mechanical affected exclusives, yet no one normally complains about them? And I know before you try debating the Digital part of this TCG, understand CZE wants this to emulate a paper TCG as much as possible. This includes exclusives.
6) Cory really wants to do exclusive things, makes the game feel unique and different for different people. If everyone had the option of everything, some unique-ness of some of the special cards is loss.

Diesbudt
07-10-2013, 05:27 AM
I could go if I wanted but spending upwards of $1000 just to get a code for a digital card is stupid. Technically, I guess I do have the opportunity to go but realistically...come on. I think its a dumb idea Crypto is doing this and equally dumb that Cory seems to think its a good idea but whatever. Its not my company and they're free to do what they want, doesn't mean I have to like it. It just dampens my enthusiasm for Hex and makes me question whether supporting it for as much as I did was a good idea.

If not getting more free stuff. MORE!!!!! dampens enthusiasm, than your enthusiasm was not strong to begin with. You have enthusiasm to have more things.

The only exclusive thing I believe shouldn't exist (as does CZE) is PvP exclusives, because now you start affecting the pvp balance which is major for TCGs.

And as a reminder. While playing PvE your choices and options will affect which mercs you get and cannot get. Like which faction you back. And other things (this even includes PvE cards). So there will already be other moments in the game itself you cannot obtain all the PvE stuff, as it changes based on how you play the story. And from what they commented your choices affect the account and not character. So you cannot replay through on another champion to do the other faction.

Dracatis
07-10-2013, 06:06 PM
Well if nothing comes of this I hope people trade reasonably for the AA Ozawa, like for a pack or something. Will the Mercenary be tradable too? I still think a digital grab-bag is reasonable for a digital game.

I mean you can't compare it to LoL or WoW giveaways because getting a skin or a promo silly item does absolutely nothing other then some eye candy, while getting a rare card and another potentially strong way to deal with PvE(the mercenary) is literally quite an edge in a competitive environment.

Please CZE, use the online format to it's fullest to make sure us busy people can keep up. If it costs players to pay $10 there to play and earn it then I'd be ok if it costs us $15 or $20 and if the requirements are hard for earning it gives them a second way to get it so they can enjoy more of the con.

Ginaz
07-10-2013, 06:45 PM
If not getting more free stuff. MORE!!!!! dampens enthusiasm, than your enthusiasm was not strong to begin with. You have enthusiasm to have more things.

The only exclusive thing I believe shouldn't exist (as does CZE) is PvP exclusives, because now you start affecting the pvp balance which is major for TCGs.

And as a reminder. While playing PvE your choices and options will affect which mercs you get and cannot get. Like which faction you back. And other things (this even includes PvE cards). So there will already be other moments in the game itself you cannot obtain all the PvE stuff, as it changes based on how you play the story. And from what they commented your choices affect the account and not character. So you cannot replay through on another champion to do the other faction.

Its not about wanting more. I'm probably one of the few people who thinks they gave too much with the KS packages. If they want to give away free goodies at conventions like this, go right ahead. Its a good way to promote the game. Just limit it to AA, sleeves, boosters, starters or something similar. It don't think its an entirely unreasonable request. Having to rely on Ebay or the generosity of others isn't giving the same opportunity to those who can't attend Gen Con. Again, I don't think its unreasonable to ask that everyone has the same opportunity to acquire the card. If people don't avail themselves of that opportunity, then yes, they have no room to complain afterwards, much like missing out on the Kickstarter.

As for your pve comments, its obvious pve doesn't matter to you. Well, it does matter for others. Also, I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that faction doesn't matter and that you're not locked in. Either way, everyone still has the same opportunity to make a choice on how they want play. Theres that word again. Opportunity.

Eightberry
07-11-2013, 12:21 AM
My question is if I may have a surrogate play for me? I have a friend attending gen con and I could have him play in my stead if he could give my account details.

GreyWorm
07-11-2013, 12:55 AM
Patrigan, I totally agree withh you.
Also, likes the idea of some sort of tavarn.
That will sure make earning gold more rewarding...

Iounsoul
07-11-2013, 03:29 AM
My question is if I may have a surrogate play for me? I have a friend attending gen con and I could have him play in my stead if he could give my account details.

From what I read from previous posts, it looks like a redemption code is given out in the goodie bag given as part of the entry fee.
So as long as you get the code, it should be all good.

Hatchet
07-11-2013, 04:26 AM
According to my entitlement card I am to receive everything for free and no one else can ever get something that would in my mind make them more special than I am. Are you guys trying to make me not feel like a special snow flake? I am going to create a very anguish internet petition that will be seen by hundreds!

Ginaz
07-11-2013, 05:25 AM
According to my entitlement card I am to receive everything for free and no one else can ever get something that would in my mind make them more special than I am. Are you guys trying to make me not feel like a special snow flake? I am going to create a very anguish internet petition that will be seen by hundreds!

Says the guy going to Gen Con and getting the goodies. Its not like you have a vested interest in maintaining the status quo, right?:rolleyes:

Diesbudt
07-11-2013, 07:30 AM
Its not about wanting more. I'm probably one of the few people who thinks they gave too much with the KS packages. If they want to give away free goodies at conventions like this, go right ahead. Its a good way to promote the game. Just limit it to AA, sleeves, boosters, starters or something similar. It don't think its an entirely unreasonable request. Having to rely on Ebay or the generosity of others isn't giving the same opportunity to those who can't attend Gen Con. Again, I don't think its unreasonable to ask that everyone has the same opportunity to acquire the card. If people don't avail themselves of that opportunity, then yes, they have no room to complain afterwards, much like missing out on the Kickstarter.

As for your pve comments, its obvious pve doesn't matter to you. Well, it does matter for others. Also, I could be wrong, but I was under the impression that faction doesn't matter and that you're not locked in. Either way, everyone still has the same opportunity to make a choice on how they want play. Theres that word again. Opportunity.

Sleeves are pointless. I don't know why people think throwing more sleeves as "exclusives' is a great idea. Once you find a set you like. There is no reason to have more unless you win one in a tough competition or something that you can actually show off. So sleeves as exclusives is not something I would ever like to see. AA is ok, but Hex has been throwing AA at people like water. Look at the KS ones, collectors bonuses (and Grand king +) and they are giving a few AA at the league match you sign up for at GenCon. Starters and boosters? No. There is nothing special to them, and never really gets the same advertisement/promotion of a game as an exclusive thing.

Also you are so wrong that I do not care about PvE. That's a primary reason I backed it. If Joe Smith over there has PvE exclusives I cannot get. So? It doesn't effect my PvE gameplay in the slightest. Unless I team up with him. Even then at most it now helps me instead of not affect me. However if it was PvP, I may run into Joe smith in a match and he has a card he can use against me I cannot. Which affects the game. Exclusive PvE stuff effects no one. Especially Mercs, since they cannot be traded (after the code is added).

Personally I am fine they do Mercs as exclusives. Even those I cannot obtain.

Diesbudt
07-11-2013, 07:32 AM
Well if nothing comes of this I hope people trade reasonably for the AA Ozawa, like for a pack or something. Will the Mercenary be tradable too? I still think a digital grab-bag is reasonable for a digital game.

I mean you can't compare it to LoL or WoW giveaways because getting a skin or a promo silly item does absolutely nothing other then some eye candy, while getting a rare card and another potentially strong way to deal with PvE(the mercenary) is literally quite an edge in a competitive environment.

Please CZE, use the online format to it's fullest to make sure us busy people can keep up. If it costs players to pay $10 there to play and earn it then I'd be ok if it costs us $15 or $20 and if the requirements are hard for earning it gives them a second way to get it so they can enjoy more of the con.

There is a good chance if I do get that AA Ozawa that Ill trade it off. I like AA, for cards I like. I personally am not a fan of the Ozawa card.

Patrigan
07-11-2013, 07:50 AM
It doesn't effect my PvE gameplay in the slightest. Unless I team up with him. Even then at most it now helps me instead of not affect me. However if it was PvP, I may run into Joe smith in a match and he has a card he can use against me I cannot. Which affects the game. Exclusive PvE stuff effects no one. Especially Mercs, since they cannot be traded (after the code is added).

Personally I am fine they do Mercs as exclusives. Even those I cannot obtain.

So if you don't care, then why are you so against mercs being taken out of the equation? I know for a fact that many players like to show off that they've been to a certain event, so the sleeves will go like hot candy. AA promos have a lot more value than a mercenary, so they will also be far more popular.

You say that Mercs are the only thing that interest you? So would you be against the idea of a "tavern", where these "exclusive" mercenaries were added after some time. Players can then buy them with gold/platinum. Those who went to the con got an edge, as they got to play with it for let's say 2 months. Everyone else has the possibility to eventually get them. If CZE would choose to go with platinum, it might even make them some extra money. It's hard to complain about the tavern approach, because everyone wins, not everyone wins as much as in some other approaches, but at least everyone wins. (Except maybe those who want their exclusives to show off, but how would you show off a mercenary? For those people the sleeves / AA are much more value. Besides they still got to show them off the period that they exclusively had them).

Ginaz
07-11-2013, 08:28 AM
So if you don't care, then why are you so against mercs being taken out of the equation? I know for a fact that many players like to show off that they've been to a certain event, so the sleeves will go like hot candy. AA promos have a lot more value than a mercenary, so they will also be far more popular.

You say that Mercs are the only thing that interest you? So would you be against the idea of a "tavern", where these "exclusive" mercenaries were added after some time. Players can then buy them with gold/platinum. Those who went to the con got an edge, as they got to play with it for let's say 2 months. Everyone else has the possibility to eventually get them. If CZE would choose to go with platinum, it might even make them some extra money. It's hard to complain about the tavern approach, because everyone wins, not everyone wins as much as in some other approaches, but at least everyone wins. (Except maybe those who want their exclusives to show off, but how would you show off a mercenary? For those people the sleeves / AA are much more value. Besides they still got to show them off the period that they exclusively had them).

I have a suspicion that most of the people who have been posting in favour of the exclusive merc are going to Gen Con (or are getting the card some other way) so they have a vested interest in keeping the status quo.

Diesbudt
07-11-2013, 10:33 AM
So if you don't care, then why are you so against mercs being taken out of the equation? I know for a fact that many players like to show off that they've been to a certain event, so the sleeves will go like hot candy. AA promos have a lot more value than a mercenary, so they will also be far more popular.

You say that Mercs are the only thing that interest you? So would you be against the idea of a "tavern", where these "exclusive" mercenaries were added after some time. Players can then buy them with gold/platinum. Those who went to the con got an edge, as they got to play with it for let's say 2 months. Everyone else has the possibility to eventually get them. If CZE would choose to go with platinum, it might even make them some extra money. It's hard to complain about the tavern approach, because everyone wins, not everyone wins as much as in some other approaches, but at least everyone wins. (Except maybe those who want their exclusives to show off, but how would you show off a mercenary? For those people the sleeves / AA are much more value. Besides they still got to show them off the period that they exclusively had them).

Not only would I be fine with those mercs be available later via other methods, I am willing to bet they will. Exclusives like this usually find themselves in other promotions which since things like GenCon and such only takes place once a year it would be a digital promotion.

AA is more valuable, which is why I am against it. AA can be traded and value can go up. THAT can be considered unfair too. Mercs cannot be traded once on an account. Don't affect the PvP scene, or anyones personal PvE scene except their psychological mindset how unfair life can be sometimes over 1 single merc out of 50ish out there that odds are you may not ever use.

Sleeves are nothing special for events like this where you show up. Some people may think its special but in all reality no one would care. NOW if it was sleeves for participating in the Hex world championship 2015 because you were 1 of X people that qualified, THAT is worth showing off.

Diesbudt
07-11-2013, 10:35 AM
I have a suspicion that most of the people who have been posting in favour of the exclusive merc are going to Gen Con (or are getting the card some other way) so they have a vested interest in keeping the status quo.

Untrue. Even if I was not to get any exclusive mercs because of a physical promotion, I would still be all for it. I think game NEEDS some special oomph for events like that, and sleeves wont cut it except for special circumstances as I said 1 post up about participating in a championship or winning a huge tournament. Showing of sleeves anyone could have gotten, but didn't isn't special. But sleeves that one had to earn their way too, that is worth something.

Vomitlord
07-11-2013, 01:33 PM
I have a suspicion that most of the people who have been posting in favour of the exclusive merc are going to Gen Con (or are getting the card some other way) so they have a vested interest in keeping the status quo.

I have no problem with physical event exclusives. They wont be stupid enough to give anything game breaking away.

No vested interest as I will never attend an event unless they hold one in the north west of England (preferably my house:rolleyes:).

Gorgol
07-11-2013, 02:26 PM
I have no problem with physical event exclusives. They wont be stupid enough to give anything game breaking away.

No vested interest as I will never attend an event
This

mydragoon
07-11-2013, 06:30 PM
*sigh* i only blame myself and my parents for not getting a residence near Gen Con where Hex freebies will be given out... but seriously, this is so unfair... then again... life's never fair... *sigh*

at least those in US can still expect some other events sometime in the future... what about those living outside USA, like England, Australia, Thailand, etc...?

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 05:43 AM
*sigh* i only blame myself and my parents for not getting a residence near Gen Con where Hex freebies will be given out... but seriously, this is so unfair... then again... life's never fair... *sigh*

at least those in US can still expect some other events sometime in the future... what about those living outside USA, like England, Australia, Thailand, etc...?

Simple. Move to America. (Joking)

I have gone to GenCon 8 years now, even though it used to be a 3.5hr drive one way. Now I have a job 25min from Indy, so its literally in my back yard!

Ginaz
07-12-2013, 06:00 PM
Simple. Move to America. (Joking)

I have gone to GenCon 8 years now, even though it used to be a 3.5hr drive one way. Now I have a job 25min from Indy, so its literally in my back yard!

So you are going to Gen Con. Thats what I thought.:rolleyes: Explains why you were fine with the way things were before today's update.

Diesbudt
07-16-2013, 09:53 AM
So you are going to Gen Con. Thats what I thought.:rolleyes: Explains why you were fine with the way things were before today's update.

I was fine with things even after the update. I was going to Gencon reguardless of CZE and probably won't have time to pick up the merc. Yet I am still totally fine with it.

Bekkir
07-16-2013, 11:02 AM
My only question is can the armbands be ordered through the ticket system and picked up at will call or will you need to exchange generics for armbands?

I was wondering the same thing.

Malcolm
07-16-2013, 11:18 AM
I was wondering the same thing.

I just ordered armbands via the GenCon ticketing system; the confirmation did indicate they will need to be picked up at Will Call.
That was about .. 4 minutes ago.

Malcolm
07-16-2013, 12:08 PM
So you are going to Gen Con. Thats what I thought.:rolleyes: Explains why you were fine with the way things were before today's update.
And you're not, which explains why you weren't. Logical syllogisms are great for stating the obvious! :p
Oh btw: wall of following txt crits you for 10k!
for the ADD kids: Removing rewards (c'mon: sleeves?) for Any GenCon (or any Con) based new game will not draw more people to that game, and will result in stagnation. Also those followers of said game who planned on spending $$+time at Con on game will be disinfranchised and look elsewhere for fun.

I'm going to Gen Con, taking the family too and we've All paid for various levels of Kickstarter; and all of us want to recieve a little bit something special for the effort. That is what GenCon is all about.
At HexCon KS-backers should recieve what the Kickstarter stated.
GenCon? ComicCon? Origins? DragonCon? The 100+ other little Cons that CZE might have a presence at and want to reward those that spent their hard-earned dollars to attend?
Will all of those who complained now be micro-managing their complaints on these forums to complain about "unfair advantage" about each of those Cons?
There will be Cons run in Europe that CZE better have a presence at; does that entitle every single HEX player in other continents to whine and recieve the exact same rewards for doing literally nothing?

You see, there are literally Thousands of events and other companies to pay our hard-earned time/money towards when we attend GenCon this year.
If we're going to plop down $10 (+fuel costs, Con costs, Housing, PTO, food), an hour or two of our Con time testing a pre-Alpha system, and give feedback from our gaming background (over 60yrs+ of combined experience TCG/MMO/PnP and multiple game QA-testing experience between the 4 of us) which will help Everyone who is going to be a part of HEX (players & Company both) then ya: I don't think it's too much for us to ask for a little bit of "gifting" from a digital game.

So now, because of forum complaints, we're going to be getting digital sleeves (?? pfft. nice but no cigar) and boosters we can't open for X+months (see: Alpha in Sept articles)? With a loot table on them that will be the same thing as if we'd waited until GenCon2014 to attend and then open up??
Wait: if I roll over to the Upper Deck Legendary Tournament for 2 days I have a chance to win $5k in cash/prizes each day based on luck alone. Not to mention doing the MTG, Poke-scholarship, etc. tournys where even a small booster draft will give me Real cards I can sell on eBay for Real $$.
The majority of people are not going to pay $10 for some digital items to play-test (yes thats what Alpha still is) an online game they've never heard of for no other tangible rewards. $2/4 generic for "Flapjacks and Sasquatches" yes; $10 for a LAN rough looking game = no. There needs to be more rewards for those who actually show up, Pay, and then play.

So you're telling me, those HEX-backers who complained, that you want competitors to HEX to have a bigger draw/presence at a major marketing Con? Thus causing less paying new comers to HEX itself, less growth of the game in it's infancy, etc. I don't think the majority of you have any idea what GenCon represents as far as getting a company's new game boosted off the ground; either that or a majority of you are trolls from other gaming companies who want HEX to fail (/wave I know you're out there CSR from WoTC!).

This isn't a matter of "Haves vs Have-nots" that too many people have tried to turn it into: You have food, shelter, and clothing with fair Rights/Laws. That is Have vs. Have-not in the real world.
HEX is a game, and a TCG at that. Not everyone is going to get the same cards, have access to the same loot/mercs/booster packs, etc. No matter what kind of special consideration CZE tries to give players there is no 100% matter of making Everyone 100% equal both for game-play and access to goods.

I think there needs to be a dramatic shift away from perceived notions of the past regarding "the importance" of forum posts vs. actual players. The tone and manner of complaints on these (and many other MMO and TCG) forums which are most frequently done by young males 17 and under (who use their time and energy to do so but not much of their $$ to back a game) is inconsequential when compared to the Actual Statistics of who is playing & spending money on computer/online games. Proof: ESA EF 2013 pg 3 & 4 http://www.theesa.com/facts/pdfs/ESA_EF_2013.pdf
Hint: It's people over 30yrs old. Specific Hint: It's women over 18 and 35% online/mobile category includes card games.

So right now (and literally the other day) 1/3rd of my household has said: "Who the *smurf* are these whiners and who the *smurf* cares about them not being equal? Wait. I'm getting just Sleeves now? *smurf*!"

jimmywolf
07-16-2013, 04:31 PM
And you're not, which explains why you weren't. Logical syllogisms are great for stating the obvious! :p
Oh btw: wall of following txt crits you for 10k!
for the ADD kids: Removing rewards (c'mon: sleeves?) for Any GenCon (or any Con) based new game will not draw more people to that game, and will result in stagnation. Also those followers of said game who planned on spending $$+time at Con on game will be disinfranchised and look elsewhere for fun.

I'm going to Gen Con, taking the family too and we've All paid for various levels of Kickstarter; and all of us want to recieve a little bit something special for the effort. That is what GenCon is all about.
At HexCon KS-backers should recieve what the Kickstarter stated.
GenCon? ComicCon? Origins? DragonCon? The 100+ other little Cons that CZE might have a presence at and want to reward those that spent their hard-earned dollars to attend?
Will all of those who complained now be micro-managing their complaints on these forums to complain about "unfair advantage" about each of those Cons?
There will be Cons run in Europe that CZE better have a presence at; does that entitle every single HEX player in other continents to whine and recieve the exact same rewards for doing literally nothing?

You see, there are literally Thousands of events and other companies to pay our hard-earned time/money towards when we attend GenCon this year.
If we're going to plop down $10 (+fuel costs, Con costs, Housing, PTO, food), an hour or two of our Con time testing a pre-Alpha system, and give feedback from our gaming background (over 60yrs+ of combined experience TCG/MMO/PnP and multiple game QA-testing experience between the 4 of us) which will help Everyone who is going to be a part of HEX (players & Company both) then ya: I don't think it's too much for us to ask for a little bit of "gifting" from a digital game.

So now, because of forum complaints, we're going to be getting digital sleeves (?? pfft. nice but no cigar) and boosters we can't open for X+months (see: Alpha in Sept articles)? With a loot table on them that will be the same thing as if we'd waited until GenCon2014 to attend and then open up??
Wait: if I roll over to the Upper Deck Legendary Tournament for 2 days I have a chance to win $5k in cash/prizes each day based on luck alone. Not to mention doing the MTG, Poke-scholarship, etc. tournys where even a small booster draft will give me Real cards I can sell on eBay for Real $$.
The majority of people are not going to pay $10 for some digital items to play-test (yes thats what Alpha still is) an online game they've never heard of for no other tangible rewards. $2/4 generic for "Flapjacks and Sasquatches" yes; $10 for a LAN rough looking game = no. There needs to be more rewards for those who actually show up, Pay, and then play.

So you're telling me, those HEX-backers who complained, that you want competitors to HEX to have a bigger draw/presence at a major marketing Con? Thus causing less paying new comers to HEX itself, less growth of the game in it's infancy, etc. I don't think the majority of you have any idea what GenCon represents as far as getting a company's new game boosted off the ground; either that or a majority of you are trolls from other gaming companies who want HEX to fail (/wave I know you're out there CSR from WoTC!).

This isn't a matter of "Haves vs Have-nots" that too many people have tried to turn it into: You have food, shelter, and clothing with fair Rights/Laws. That is Have vs. Have-not in the real world.
HEX is a game, and a TCG at that. Not everyone is going to get the same cards, have access to the same loot/mercs/booster packs, etc. No matter what kind of special consideration CZE tries to give players there is no 100% matter of making Everyone 100% equal both for game-play and access to goods.

I think there needs to be a dramatic shift away from perceived notions of the past regarding "the importance" of forum posts vs. actual players. The tone and manner of complaints on these (and many other MMO and TCG) forums which are most frequently done by young males 17 and under (who use their time and energy to do so but not much of their $$ to back a game) is inconsequential when compared to the Actual Statistics of who is playing & spending money on computer/online games. Proof: ESA EF 2013 pg 3 & 4 http://www.theesa.com/facts/pdfs/ESA_EF_2013.pdf
Hint: It's people over 30yrs old. Specific Hint: It's women over 18 and 35% online/mobile category includes card games.

So right now (and literally the other day) 1/3rd of my household has said: "Who the *smurf* are these whiners and who the *smurf* cares about them not being equal? Wait. I'm getting just Sleeves now? *smurf*!"

while i see your POV an sympathies, i still feel if your going too attach a online/mmo side too a card game, it must be equal if not greater then the live side. their trying too push a digital market that, in my opinion will expand far more then any live event.


the main issue is we have no proof who will be right in till it too late, was live events the only advertisement that kept the game going an healthy? or was supporting digital side better with them spreading the word on the internet?

Gorgol
07-16-2013, 05:09 PM
And you're not, which explains why you weren't. Logical syllogisms are great for stating the obvious! :p
Oh btw: wall of following txt crits you for 10k!
for the ADD kids: Removing rewards (c'mon: sleeves?) for Any GenCon (or any Con) based new game will not draw more people to that game, and will result in stagnation. Also those followers of said game who planned on spending $$+time at Con on game will be disinfranchised and look elsewhere for fun.

I'm going to Gen Con, taking the family too and we've All paid for various levels of Kickstarter; and all of us want to recieve a little bit something special for the effort. That is what GenCon is all about.
At HexCon KS-backers should recieve what the Kickstarter stated.
GenCon? ComicCon? Origins? DragonCon? The 100+ other little Cons that CZE might have a presence at and want to reward those that spent their hard-earned dollars to attend?
Will all of those who complained now be micro-managing their complaints on these forums to complain about "unfair advantage" about each of those Cons?
There will be Cons run in Europe that CZE better have a presence at; does that entitle every single HEX player in other continents to whine and recieve the exact same rewards for doing literally nothing?

You see, there are literally Thousands of events and other companies to pay our hard-earned time/money towards when we attend GenCon this year.
If we're going to plop down $10 (+fuel costs, Con costs, Housing, PTO, food), an hour or two of our Con time testing a pre-Alpha system, and give feedback from our gaming background (over 60yrs+ of combined experience TCG/MMO/PnP and multiple game QA-testing experience between the 4 of us) which will help Everyone who is going to be a part of HEX (players & Company both) then ya: I don't think it's too much for us to ask for a little bit of "gifting" from a digital game.

So now, because of forum complaints, we're going to be getting digital sleeves (?? pfft. nice but no cigar) and boosters we can't open for X+months (see: Alpha in Sept articles)? With a loot table on them that will be the same thing as if we'd waited until GenCon2014 to attend and then open up??
Wait: if I roll over to the Upper Deck Legendary Tournament for 2 days I have a chance to win $5k in cash/prizes each day based on luck alone. Not to mention doing the MTG, Poke-scholarship, etc. tournys where even a small booster draft will give me Real cards I can sell on eBay for Real $$.
The majority of people are not going to pay $10 for some digital items to play-test (yes thats what Alpha still is) an online game they've never heard of for no other tangible rewards. $2/4 generic for "Flapjacks and Sasquatches" yes; $10 for a LAN rough looking game = no. There needs to be more rewards for those who actually show up, Pay, and then play.

So you're telling me, those HEX-backers who complained, that you want competitors to HEX to have a bigger draw/presence at a major marketing Con? Thus causing less paying new comers to HEX itself, less growth of the game in it's infancy, etc. I don't think the majority of you have any idea what GenCon represents as far as getting a company's new game boosted off the ground; either that or a majority of you are trolls from other gaming companies who want HEX to fail (/wave I know you're out there CSR from WoTC!).

This isn't a matter of "Haves vs Have-nots" that too many people have tried to turn it into: You have food, shelter, and clothing with fair Rights/Laws. That is Have vs. Have-not in the real world.
HEX is a game, and a TCG at that. Not everyone is going to get the same cards, have access to the same loot/mercs/booster packs, etc. No matter what kind of special consideration CZE tries to give players there is no 100% matter of making Everyone 100% equal both for game-play and access to goods.

I think there needs to be a dramatic shift away from perceived notions of the past regarding "the importance" of forum posts vs. actual players. The tone and manner of complaints on these (and many other MMO and TCG) forums which are most frequently done by young males 17 and under (who use their time and energy to do so but not much of their $$ to back a game) is inconsequential when compared to the Actual Statistics of who is playing & spending money on computer/online games. Proof: ESA EF 2013 pg 3 & 4 http://www.theesa.com/facts/pdfs/ESA_EF_2013.pdf
Hint: It's people over 30yrs old. Specific Hint: It's women over 18 and 35% online/mobile category includes card games.

So right now (and literally the other day) 1/3rd of my household has said: "Who the *smurf* are these whiners and who the *smurf* cares about them not being equal? Wait. I'm getting just Sleeves now? *smurf*!"
http://i.imgur.com/N0fKltN.gif

Bekkir
07-16-2013, 05:58 PM
I just ordered armbands via the GenCon ticketing system; the confirmation did indicate they will need to be picked up at Will Call.
That was about .. 4 minutes ago.

I tried that, but since Im only able to go to GenCon for the weekend, the website is telling me that I cannot register for Hex because I do not have a badge for Thursday, the day the Hex event begins.

Ashenor
08-07-2013, 12:01 PM
I will be there, where do i get my armband at? My Gen Con 4 day pass was delivered about a month ago already.

Malcolm
08-12-2013, 09:47 AM
I tried that, but since Im only able to go to GenCon for the weekend, the website is telling me that I cannot register for Hex because I do not have a badge for Thursday, the day the Hex event begins.


I will be there, where do i get my armband at? My Gen Con 4 day pass was delivered about a month ago already.


To answer both questions at once, from Project Update #41:

You can come to the Cryptozoic booth, #731, and demo the game with our staff. Once you've done that and know how to play, you can head to the TCG room. Purchase a $10 event ticket from Gen Con for the HEX League, and you can play on our LAN where you'll earn tickets for Jadiim sleeves, mercenaries, and the alternate art Ozawa.

You earn 2 HEX tickets for a win, 1 ticket for a loss. (Real games, not "I concede to you over and over again" games) You'll get the GAX mercenary just for signing up (limited to one per attendee), and then you can redeem your tickets as follows:

1 Ticket - Jadiim Sleeves
2 Tickets - Alternate Art Ozawa
5 Tickets - Portensio of Avon Mercenary

Falaris
08-13-2013, 10:55 AM
Not reading 13 pages to see if this has been answered anywhere, but has CZE mentioned anywhere that these con 'exclusives' are not eligible to be traded/auctioned? If they are permanently tied to accounts I can see how this would be an issue. However, if people have the ability to trade or buy them there shouldn't be any real issue with having con 'exclusives'.

DucklessPond
08-13-2013, 04:00 PM
You will receive a card at the con, the card can be traded physically. Once it is activated the mercenary is account bound.

ursa23
08-14-2013, 08:19 AM
And remember, if you are patient you will be able to try for these goodies in one year's time. I plan on still playing then, and you better believe I'ma open some boosters then. Gax is toot sweet.