PDA

View Full Version : Exclusives, Treasure, and Mercenaries



Shaqattaq
07-12-2013, 11:08 AM
by Cory Jones

So, we announced some Gen Con exclusives, and as I expected, the community had a mixed reaction. Some people loved it, some didnít mind, and others felt pretty strongly it was the worst idea ever. In the end, I felt like the spirit of what I want to do, which is make the live HEX events more fun and exciting, is worth the risk of doing exclusives.

http://hextcg.com/exclusives-treasure-and-mercenaries/

Vomitlord
07-12-2013, 11:14 AM
King Solomon could not have done better

+1 Cory

Also Gax looks awesome

nicosharp
07-12-2013, 11:17 AM
But I want all teh cards!
http://mypoliticalexile.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/veruca_salt.jpg

Aradon
07-12-2013, 11:18 AM
Excellent, excellent article. I really wish mercs were tradeable between accounts so I could get some of the convention ones, but I'm sure I'll live without them. What I do want to say, though, is thanks for the great transparency and detail going on here. The article answered a lot of questions very clearly and bluntly, giving information out without hedging the answers. I love the communication coming from you guys, keep it up :)

Also, I weep for not having Gax :(

Edit: Nevermind me, I actually did read the article. I now fear for my wallet come every holiday and convention, but love the decision :D

Stexe
07-12-2013, 11:21 AM
Eh. I'm mixed about having exclusives like this. It is cool and stuff, but I want the option to be able to "catch 'em all" without having to spend an arm and a leg traveling around the world. Having them available online during the convention is a good idea -- that's generally what League of Legends does with exclusives.

Riot Games / League of Legends have one exclusive everyone can get online during the event, and then one exclusive you can only get at events. However, those exclusives are available at nearly every event they are at... so say you can't make it to PAX then you might get your chance at E3 or GDC or whatever. I think simply having an exclusive promo card available for 6 months or something at whatever event you're attending is the best of both worlds. Exclusive but also available to more people.

Having exclusives that are "randomized" and have power are really annoying. That's the primarily reason I quit Team Fortress 2. It is neat to have special things for a limited time, but those limited edition things should be easily available to anyone at that time -- not a game of chance during a set period. Or, at the very least, have them all tradable so people who REALLY want them can still trade for them. But this is the same problem people ran into with the special Hex shirt promos... people don't really want exclusives that are a pain to get.

Arkaon
07-12-2013, 11:26 AM
The nod to Gary Gygax is awesome. I look forward to seeing you guys at GenCon.

Thanks,
Arky

Meglodon
07-12-2013, 11:27 AM
Hey, that is pretty awesome and a great idea about how the chests are available during event times. I am super stoked for this game, hot damn!

Vorpal
07-12-2013, 11:28 AM
I actually really like their approach to exclusives.

Having non game impacting exclusives like card sleeves only available to people who physically attend the gencon is fine with me. I won't be going, but if I did, that is exactly the sort of thing I would find cool. A way to let people know I'd been there without it providing me with an unfair in game advantage.

I also like the way they'll be modifying the exclusive pve mercs as necessary in case they get too strong. This way, no one who can't get a particular merc needs to worry they'll be forever disadvantaged. I also like being told up front that you'll have to make decisions about which mercs to get and can't possibly get them all. That makes collecting more meaningful to me.

Afterall, there's no point in exclusives if everyone has the same ones. People saying they feel like they have to get all the exclusives are clearly missing out on what an exclusive is.

I also like the idea that opening boosters during a holiday might get you different/cool stuff in chests!

I'm really looking forward to the chests.

Lochar
07-12-2013, 11:29 AM
I think this represents the best balance between all possibilities for exclusives. People can get them whether or not they show up, so long as they're trying.

And I think chests are tradable, so specially marked chests for oh, Christmas 2013, might be worth a lot too.

Chiany
07-12-2013, 11:29 AM
Thanks for clearing things up Cory.

Now let's hope those Con mercs etc aren't incredible rare in the chests.

Stexe
07-12-2013, 11:30 AM
Having non game impacting exclusives like card sleeves only available to people who physically attend the gencon is fine with me. I won't be going, but if I did, that is exactly the sort of thing I would find cool. A way to let people know I'd been there without it providing me with an unfair in game advantage.


Except they are game impacting exclusives... that's the problem.

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 11:30 AM
But I want all teh cards!
http://mypoliticalexile.files.wordpress.com/2009/09/veruca_salt.jpg

Well you are now on my evil list, listing that picture.

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 11:32 AM
Guess this means the debate can now end... time to find something else to get the community riled up about.

Stexe
07-12-2013, 11:34 AM
Can we at least get a poll or something to get feedback on this decision? I'd be more than happy to go along with it if something like the super majority of players agree with it.

Aradon
07-12-2013, 11:34 AM
Guess this means the debate can now end... time to find something else to get the community riled up about.

Just from this post: 1) Diluted loot table for Gencon 2014 means it's too difficult to get either exclusive, and 2) Drop rates of event exclusives being too low.

It'll happen, don't worry :P

majin
07-12-2013, 11:36 AM
i love this decision, now i can have a chance to earn the giveaways on conventions without needing to attend it. for someone who lives in the Philippines and don't have the means to travel to these cons, this decision really made me love the hex team more

they really make sure that it's fans first. they can't please everyone but they still try hard to do so

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 11:36 AM
Can we at least get a poll or something to get feedback on this decision? I'd be more than happy to go along with it if something like the super majority of players agree with it.

From the many debates in other threads, and people posting here, I can tell you at least at a guess 70-30% wise is for it. And even some who were against it have even stated this set-up works fairly in a way.

Erebus
07-12-2013, 11:37 AM
Except they are game impacting exclusives... that's the problem.

In what way are Sleeves impacting? Sure they have then and you don't, but in the grand scheme of things, it doesn't matter.

Everything else will be found in packs during the event. So instead of spending thousands of dollars going to cons, you can spend thousands of dollars opening packs to get your exclusives. Your choice.

MicZeSeraphin
07-12-2013, 11:39 AM
First of all, thanks for clearing it up.

While I (like many others) would prefer to have AAAAAALL the mercenaries, the fact that they are gonna get nerfed/buffed if needed is a pretty sure sign there won't be any game breaking mercenary (or at least not for too long). This means I will be able to not mope all day long because I missed a mercenary ^^

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 11:42 AM
Favorite thing about this article? They took the most common theme of the forums past few days, and gave an update based on that. So you know they are reading.

Vorpal
07-12-2013, 11:55 AM
Except they are game impacting exclusives... that's the problem.

Card sleeves are not game impacting exclusives.

Those are the only gencon exclusives available only to people who were physically at gencon.

It's quite clear you didn't even read Cory's post. Please make an attempt to educate yourself.

Ditsch
07-12-2013, 11:56 AM
Yeah that solution is only semi okay as you have to wait 1 year for the gencon 2014 (and i really love that merc) and then you have a diluted loot table well i can still hope the make the gencon 2013 loot a common. :)

But I have to settle down that pve means no way of getting all the mercs as you have to choose and then you can't get the other. (that really sucks for collectible card game)

Vorpal
07-12-2013, 12:05 PM
It's the card part that is collectible, not necessarily the merc part.

YourOpponent
07-12-2013, 12:06 PM
Yes...very awesome Gygaxian theme! I almost wish the KS mercenaries could be traded to help ensure I get a copy of Gax. (Huge fan of Gary Gygax)

Roy_G
07-12-2013, 12:09 PM
Just from this post: 1) Diluted loot table for Gencon 2014 means it's too difficult to get either exclusive, and 2) Drop rates of event exclusives being too low.

It'll happen, don't worry :P

I agree with that.The randomization of game effecting exclusive is bad already creating different costs to those who get to Gen Con
to those who don't.Giving the exclusives of two Gen Cons will dilute the tables unless CZE compensates for this in the loot tables.

They effectively now just said that the PVE matters less than PVP.

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 12:10 PM
I agree with that.The randomization of game effecting exclusive is bad already creating different costs to those who get to Gen Con
to those who don't.Giving the exclusives of two Gen Cons will dilute the tables unless CZE compensates for this in the loot tables.

They effectively now just said that the PVE matters less than PVP.

No, what they actually said was Mercs do not matter much as there will be so many. PvE Can have a lot of exclusives. You can't always be fair. So it is fine for PvE exclusives because again, you play MOST PvE solo. And what I have does not affect your PvE experience, and what you have will not affect mine. No matter what you may think.

Aethnen
07-12-2013, 12:15 PM
Wow an exclusive merc that lets you go first whenever you want AND creates cards that have effects you want AND has a 65% chance to give you another turn if you're about to lose? That doesn't change the game or anything. LOL

Malicus
07-12-2013, 12:16 PM
Sounds great to me. I had accepted the idea that Cory needed to be able to have some fun and this solution is just about perfect while maintaining the non-tradability of mercs.

You also cannot call these game impacting exclusives now since they have clearly stated that if they have a negative impact they will be nerfed.

This change also means a drafting frenzy will probably happen around special events which is great for those of us who don't get to go in person since the time will be special online too.

Badmoonz
07-12-2013, 12:16 PM
Has there been any mention on how to open the Chests? Do they just open? Is there a time restriction or do you need to buy a key?

hammer
07-12-2013, 12:20 PM
You can only open the chests if you attended gen con obv

Malicus
07-12-2013, 12:21 PM
Has there been any mention on how to open the Chests? Do they just open? Is there a time restriction or do you need to buy a key?

You just open them. No mention of any time restriction and they are tradable so once you have your gencon exclusives in 2014 you can sell the rest so others have a chance at them. or hold them and sell them in the future.

Also as an aside - yes some mercs have cool abilities but stop thinking of them in a vacuum. You get their good abilities but lose all the good abilities your champion or other merc had. Comparative strength is far more relevant than absolute strength and unfortunately we don't really know how powerful champions are yet, I would be extremely surprised if we weren't using champions most of the time.

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 12:25 PM
Wow an exclusive merc that lets you go first whenever you want AND creates cards that have effects you want AND has a 65% chance to give you another turn if you're about to lose? That doesn't change the game or anything. LOL

I don't know about you but...

it takes 2 charge counters per random card (do not get a choice).
It costs 2-5 resources to play the card. Depending which one it is.
You get no + Health, damage, defense, or other things your Main hero or other Mercs might give.

I would never take this merc into a match trying to have the strongest deck. Ever. Now if I wanted randomness to decided my fate, sure.

Cory_Jones
07-12-2013, 12:31 PM
you can only open the chests if you attended gen con obv

hahahahhaha!

Patrigan
07-12-2013, 12:35 PM
I'm not entirely satisfied with their "you can't get every mercenary" and I fully intend to prove them wrong as well.

That said, at least they have shown that they at least listen. I am fairly ok with this approach, There is still more possibility for improvement, the random aspect is a bit meh. And there's the "you can't get every mercenary". I seriously hope you make mercenaries less interesting than they are now. It's a major downer not to get a certain mercenary, especially if it looks so fun to play with...

Vorpal
07-12-2013, 12:37 PM
Wow an exclusive merc that lets you go first whenever you want AND creates cards that have effects you want AND has a 65% chance to give you another turn if you're about to lose? That doesn't change the game or anything. LOL

You sound like someone who doesn't realize that mercs can only be used in pve.

You also sound like someone who msised the part where they say if a merc is trivializing the pve experience, they'll have no policy nerfing the living daylights out of it.

DreamPuppet
07-12-2013, 12:38 PM
So basically it means that everyone will be hoarding their chests never opening them unless its gencon, PAX or some other special event with added benefits.

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 12:39 PM
I'm not entirely satisfied with their "you can't get every mercenary" and I fully intend to prove them wrong as well.

That said, at least they have shown that they at least listen. I am fairly ok with this approach, There is still more possibility for improvement, the random aspect is a bit meh. And there's the "you can't get every mercenary". I seriously hope you make mercenaries less interesting than they are now. It's a major downer not to get a certain mercenary, especially if it looks so fun to play with...

Prove them wrong? You do realize as you play through PvE you will have to make choices that PREVENT you from getting certain mercenaries while getting others. And this decision is for your account and not character.

So please, tell me, what is your plan?

Grimthorn
07-12-2013, 12:41 PM
So basically it means that everyone will be hoarding their chests never opening them unless its gencon, PAX or some other special event with added benefits.

It's not when you open the chest, it's when you open the pack of cards the chest came from.

Patrigan
07-12-2013, 12:45 PM
So basically it means that everyone will be hoarding their chests never opening them unless its gencon, PAX or some other special event with added benefits.

The problem is that it is dependant on the booster packs. So a booster pack opened now, will already have the chest contents generated. So you would have to hoard booster packs. Or buy plenty during the interval.

jgsugden
07-12-2013, 12:46 PM
I'm not sure we're all on the same page. Perhaps someone can confirm my understanding?

It looks to me like at Gen Con 2013 they'll hand out redeemable codes for 2 mercenaries (based upon reading the language at the bottom of the card) as well as codes for Gen Con 2013 Sleeves.

Those sleeves will only be available to attendees (or people that get the codes somehow).

The mercenaries will be available via the codes handed out this year, and will also appear in Treasure Chests popped during the Gen Con 2014 event.

In the future, event cards / items / etc... used in game will pop from Treasure Chests during the time of the event, regardless of where you are when you pop open a chest. Note: It may be harder for attendees of these events that do other things to get these cards as they may be busy during these times playing D&D, MtG, LARPing, hooking up, etc... While people at home have less distractions from the game.

Sleeves (and perhaps other non-game influencing things) will be granted at events as well, but will be handed out via codes or logging into your account from the event in the future. They will not be available to anyone and everyone.

Is that all correct?

Crota
07-12-2013, 12:49 PM
Here is a question that I don't think has been asked yet. What will happen to Treasure Chests during drafts? Obviously we won't be able to open them during the draft and get an entire pack of cards over our opponent. Will we magically find 3 treasure chests waiting for us to open later in our inventory after the tournament? Will those treasure chests be added to the prize pool? First place gets 12, second 6 and third 3? Or will they be magically lost, gone forever to the mystical land beyond the unicorn room?

Diesbudt
07-12-2013, 12:50 PM
Here is a question that I don't think has been asked yet. What will happen to Treasure Chests during drafts? Obviously we won't be able to open them during the draft and get an entire pack of cards over our opponent. Will we magically find 3 treasure chests waiting for us to open later in our inventory after the tournament? Will those treasure chests be added to the prize pool? First place gets 12, second 6 and third 3? Or will they be magically lost, gone forever to the mystical land beyond the unicorn room?

This has been asked many times. Answered many times.

When you open a pack during a draft the chest automatically gets added to your inventory. You can open it later.

hammer
07-12-2013, 12:52 PM
I really like the article it explains a fair bit and should satisfy the majority of the community. It is awesome that CZE listens, responds and then Listens again . They obviously care on so many levels and this is more important to me, a self-proclaimed collector, than not being able to get all of the mercs. Though I am sure if I keep sucking up Cory et all will bung me a gen con merc over the Atlantic. Seriously though the longevity of the game is far far more important to a collector so I am happy. I love how the thread provides answers eg primal chest drop rate but also asks even more questions. Hex sure is one deep game and so far I believe CZE have all the answers to balance the depth. Still hoping for an update on whether equipment will be bound and if so whether its bind on equip or pickup.

DreamPuppet
07-12-2013, 12:52 PM
The problem is that it is dependant on the booster packs. So a booster pack opened now, will already have the chest contents generated. So you would have to hoard booster packs. Or buy plenty during the interval.

thanks for the clarification, i must have misread :)

Patrigan
07-12-2013, 01:03 PM
Prove them wrong? You do realize as you play through PvE you will have to make choices that PREVENT you from getting certain mercenaries while getting others. And this decision is for your account and not character.

So please, tell me, what is your plan?

Don't be such a downer, I realize that, sadly enough. There were the game forces me to make a choice, I will pick the one that I like most.

Then I will go on my second account, play through it all again and pick the other. I might not have it all on one account, but I will get them all. And certainly I will TEST them all.

Alternatively, I might just give up my completionist attitude and hope that one day CZE sees that they're being party poopers by witholding all these awesome mercenaries from a part of the community ^^ I still stand by my Tavern idea, where after some time players can get the mercenary with gold / plantinum. Limited in time exclusivity is still a form of exclusivity, is it not?

Still thank you Cory and CZE for actually looking at some pressing discussions. I'm glad you guys answered this.

Taun
07-12-2013, 01:05 PM
So what happens if we get more than one of the same Merc? This isn't a problem for tradable items, but Mercs can't be traded. Is it just a wasted 'loot' item?

Blowfeld
07-12-2013, 01:11 PM
Great solution. Things like these are the reason CZE have earned my full trust. Good job fellas, keep being awesome!

Aethnen
07-12-2013, 01:16 PM
You sound like someone who doesn't realize that mercs can only be used in pve.

You also sound like someone who msised the part where they say if a merc is trivializing the pve experience, they'll have no policy nerfing the living daylights out of it.

I knew all that. I read. It's still pretty powerful IMHO specially if I'm reading some of those dice cards right. Gain 1xx life? Interesting. Makes me want to go to Gen Con.

Prophecy
07-12-2013, 01:19 PM
I knew all that. I read. It's still pretty powerful IMHO specially if I'm reading some of those dice cards right. Gain 1xx life? Interesting. Makes me want to go to Gen Con.

Yeah you read it wrong it is one roll of a 12 sided die

Aethnen
07-12-2013, 01:22 PM
Yeah you read it wrong it is one roll of a 12 sided die

Ohhhh, interesting 1d12 still. Being able to choose to go first AND having a 65% chance to live another turn is pretty good.

__X__
07-12-2013, 01:37 PM
FYI:
D4 - Draw 1d4 cards.
D6 - Gain 1d6 temporary resources.
D10 - Deal 1d10 damage to all opposing troops.
D12 - Gain 1d12 health.
D20 - Deal 1d20 to target champion.

Vorsa
07-12-2013, 01:55 PM
Seems a very clever solution to me. :cool:

Also very interesting that there are stamped treasure chest, though I wouldn't be fooling anyone if I said that's going to stop me opening chests as soon as I get them!

Gorgol
07-12-2013, 01:57 PM
Absolutely brilliant solution!

Vorpal
07-12-2013, 02:04 PM
Ohhhh, interesting 1d12 still. Being able to choose to go first AND having a 65% chance to live another turn is pretty good.

I don't think either of those is particularly good, let alone game breakingly powerful such that anyone who doesn't go to gencon is behind the power curve for life.

There are half a dozen KS mercs whom I think are way better, for example.

I'd rather go second with two more cards in hand than go first.

Ginaz
07-12-2013, 03:21 PM
I like this. It gives everyone the same opportunity to acquire the mercs, which is all I was asking for.

Mindless
07-12-2013, 03:50 PM
Well I believe GAX can be a strong merc. 6 mana (spread on turns as well) for 2/5 chance at minimum 1 card (with the level 15 passive) and also depending on how much hp the enemies in pve will have the damage to opponent can be very strong (sure luck is involved but if PVE can be "zerged" that luck factor will be very strong). Example: a raid boss and you fight it as 3 GAX (3 people with the same merc hero). Potentially you can deal 3*20*2 damage to this boss on round 6 (this damages is spread onto 2 turns by 3 members), this means that the boss will take 120 damage by charge power alone (ofc this is a max luck streak and yes you will invest some resources into it) and next turn (turn 7) you get another shot. Maximum luck streak is however also depending on times repeated (this max or near max luck will occur if there are infinite retries) as people will restart many times and even more if it is easy to do it (without penalty). Meaning that depending on how long the restart of a raid boss the luck factor can decide how easy the boss actually is with this setup.

All in all this merc is more depending on the punishment of death/defeat in pve than other mercs (as retries are free?). Also it might enable some feats that are impossible or darn hard just by adding some random strong luck (ever played lost oddessy, spell "gamble" or using death ("trick") with vanille in FFXIII and you know what I mean).

Phearbot
07-12-2013, 04:49 PM
I hate you so much Cory, but I can't do nothing to stop you so... buisness is buisness I suppose... this way lots of people will buy tons of booster just to find the merch they need... good move to milk money from us... why don't let us buy a digital tiket (like BlizzCon 4 example...)??? Oh wait, tons of booster > digital tickets... way more money!!!
Not to mention your other brilliant idea... you want to give promos with other crypto games... so if I want the promo 4x I need to buy 4x random crypto game and because I'm not rich (like the majority of the community I suppose) I will not be able to have the crads.
I can't say how much I'm hating you because I will probably be banned forever.
I'm a collectionist (easy to say at this point) and I know it's kinda impossible to have all stuff in a MMO game, but I think the way you fixed the promos CON issue is just a buisness-like shit to milk money form HEX community.
Good for you, bad for us.
Now you can all flame me because I'm a flamer and let the flame war begins (and sorry for my bad english too...).

Ginaz
07-12-2013, 06:03 PM
I hate you so much Cory, but I can't do nothing to stop you so... buisness is buisness I suppose... this way lots of people will buy tons of booster just to find the merch they need... good move to milk money from us... why don't let us buy a digital tiket (like BlizzCon 4 example...)??? Oh wait, tons of booster > digital tickets... way more money!!!
Not to mention your other brilliant idea... you want to give promos with other crypto games... so if I want the promo 4x I need to buy 4x random crypto game and because I'm not rich (like the majority of the community I suppose) I will not be able to have the crads.
I can't say how much I'm hating you because I will probably be banned forever.
I'm a collectionist (easy to say at this point) and I know it's kinda impossible to have all stuff in a MMO game, but I think the way you fixed the promos CON issue is just a buisness-like shit to milk money form HEX community.
Good for you, bad for us.
Now you can all flame me because I'm a flamer and let the flame war begins (and sorry for my bad english too...).

Where do you see where it says they want to tie Hex promo cards with other Crypto games? From what I read, they're available in the treasure chests you get when opening booster packs.

Stok3d
07-12-2013, 06:04 PM
I was a fan of the secondary market. Seems I lost my argument while supporting the prior idea. Nothing seems to be hitting ebay now. Let the "have-nots" rejoice. I am wanting further clarification as to the specifics of the chests:

Q: For the 2014 Gencon, am I limited to a particular card set for mercs to drop from the treasure chests? Will set 1 only provide 2013 Gencon chests while set 2 will provide 2013 & 2014 loot tables. What about 2016 Gencon? Can I use Set1 packs for loot tables there?

ecaflip
07-12-2013, 06:17 PM
I'm still quite confused about this ordeal, if we can't attend do we still get the exclusives like we were promised on the kickstarter page? Also, booster packs at GenCon or when the game goes live? This article has me running around in circles of confusion.

Phearbot
07-12-2013, 06:26 PM
Where do you see where it says they want to tie Hex promo cards with other Crypto games? From what I read, they're available in the treasure chests you get when opening booster packs.
Here is an Interview CZE did with Gamasutra, read and cry ^^''

"Since Cryptozoic is best known for its physical card games and board games, will there be any cross-product promotion, perhaps a redeemable code for a free booster pack or starter deck included with future physical products from Cryptozoic?"

Cory: We absolutely can and will do that. We can even take it one step further at live events like Gen Con or PAX where we can potentially host side tournaments and give away exclusive redeemable Mercenary cards for attendees. Other digital games have done this to great success in years past and there's no reason why we wouldn't do the same for our fans."

Just beacause other "digital games" did this shit only for buisness it means you have to emulate these idiots?
You know what you are if you do the same thing that idiots do? Yeah, I think you can imagine it...
Calling this a "thing for the fans" is just a lie... now Cory repeat after me... "Just to milk money from Hex community, just to milk money from MY community".

Phearbot
07-12-2013, 06:40 PM
I'm still quite confused about this ordeal, if we can't attend do we still get the exclusives like we were promised on the kickstarter page? Also, booster packs at GenCon or when the game goes live? This article has me running around in circles of confusion.

You will get NOTHING.
Now that you're happy, every time a HEX phisical event in the world apperar if you go there (phisically) you will get a special code for a cool sleeve (untradable).
After tht you will get a promo Merchenary and a promo Alternate Art Card.
If you can't go there you will not be able to get the sleeve. There is no way to find this stuff in the game. Just lost forever if you can't go there, BUT...
OH YES THAT'S THE FUNNY PART, if you open a booster pack the days the event is up (like GenCon for example) you will have a chance to find the promo Merc and Alternate card.
I suppose the chance is low, so you will need lots of money. *mil* *milk*
The KS bonus you mentioned is all about the first HEXCON, only the first... not for life...
So the first time HEXCON will be live you will get the promos of the event for free.
Because GENCON will be live before the launch of hex you will have the chance to get the exclusive promos in SUMMER 2014 during the next GENCON events (along with 2014 promos).
Sorry for my bad english... I hope this help you.

Shaqattaq
07-12-2013, 06:44 PM
I'm still quite confused about this ordeal, if we can't attend do we still get the exclusives like we were promised on the kickstarter page? Also, booster packs at GenCon or when the game goes live? This article has me running around in circles of confusion.

Kickstarter backers were promised the promos from the first HEXCon, not any other conventions.

Malama
07-12-2013, 07:41 PM
So what happens if we get more than one of the same Merc? This isn't a problem for tradable items, but Mercs can't be traded. Is it just a wasted 'loot' item?

I also want to know this.

Gorgol
07-12-2013, 07:53 PM
"Since Cryptozoic is best known for its physical card games and board games, will there be any cross-product promotion, perhaps a redeemable code for a free booster pack or starter deck included with future physical products from Cryptozoic?"

Cory: We absolutely can and will do that. We can even take it one step further at live events like Gen Con or PAX where we can potentially host side tournaments and give away exclusive redeemable Mercenary cards for attendees. Other digital games have done this to great success in years past and there's no reason why we wouldn't do the same for our fans."
fixed

bangari
07-12-2013, 08:10 PM
You will get NOTHING.
Now that you're happy, every time a HEX phisical event in the world apperar if you go there (phisically) you will get a special code for a cool sleeve (untradable).
After tht you will get a promo Merchenary and a promo Alternate Art Card.
If you can't go there you will not be able to get the sleeve. There is no way to find this stuff in the game. Just lost forever if you can't go there, BUT...
OH YES THAT'S THE FUNNY PART, if you open a booster pack the days the event is up (like GenCon for example) you will have a chance to find the promo Merc and Alternate card.
I suppose the chance is low, so you will need lots of money. *mil* *milk*
The KS bonus you mentioned is all about the first HEXCON, only the first... not for life...
So the first time HEXCON will be live you will get the promos of the event for free.
Because GENCON will be live before the launch of hex you will have the chance to get the exclusive promos in SUMMER 2014 during the next GENCON events (along with 2014 promos).
Sorry for my bad english... I hope this help you.

Wow, seems like someone is seriously butthurt over the fact that can't get his hands on everything.


I suppose the chance is low, so you will need lots of money. *mil* *milk*

Or you can, you know, act like an adult and have some self control over spending?

Are you seriously bitching because they decided to add EXTRA stuff into booster packs for a few days so that people at home can get some EXTRA goodies they won't be able to otherwise get their hands on?

Really?

Half of the stuff is cosmetic. I doubt the other half is going to break PVE. It doesn't matter if you don't get them. If you can't control the impulse to buy 100 booster packs just to get them, you have issues. Don't blame the developers for your own personal failings.

Jesus, i wonder what your reaction is like when you're young and first realized that you can't capture every single pokemon in a given game without trading with other versions. How many houses did you burn down?

Madican
07-12-2013, 08:13 PM
This is a very good solution. I'll probably save my major purchasing sessions for when events are going on to maximize chances of getting event loot.

Gabbelgak
07-12-2013, 08:38 PM
So the codes you get from the con's, are they going to be scalpable on ebay? I realize you can't trade the stuff after it's been tied to your account, but they usually just hand out like 16 digit codes you enter that you tie to your account so those of us that can't attend can get this kinda stuff from resellers.

Malicus
07-12-2013, 10:00 PM
So the codes you get from the con's, are they going to be scalpable on ebay? I realize you can't trade the stuff after it's been tied to your account, but they usually just hand out like 16 digit codes you enter that you tie to your account so those of us that can't attend can get this kinda stuff from resellers.

That was the original and nothing says that side of it has changed so there will be 2 avenues.

Gencon isn't suitable for a digital ticket because it is not a Crypto event they just happen to be there.

If you don't want the mercs you don't need to open boosters. I plan to generally open quite a few boosters through drafting, once I get my gen con mercs etc I will probably list the gen con flagged chests on the AH as will others so you can have a chance there as well.

Some people think this will have a detrimental effect on the timing of opening packs but you forget that once you expand a loot table you reduce the chances of getting the other things. So if you want to win packs rather than mercs you are actually less likely to open a chest during an event etc this will generally balance stuff like that out or even open up opportunities to trade non-con chests for con-chests with other players.

Gridian
07-12-2013, 10:33 PM
I love this decison, Cory. It is absolutely ingenious - there is still a feeling of having gotten special cards and mercs during the Con, but since it's all digital there is no need to be physicly present.
Sleeves have no impact whatsoever in the gameplay, thus making them earned means that those people who come attend the Con personally have something to be happy about every day henceforth when they look at those sleeves.

Perfect. :-D

self1sch
07-12-2013, 11:11 PM
Quick Question:

Will the primal chests contain 3 legendary goodies? Or does primal only mean that it contains 3 random goodies (for example 2 uncommon and 1 rare)?

Beastmaster
07-12-2013, 11:45 PM
Originally Posted by Taun

So what happens if we get more than one of the same Merc? This isn't a problem for tradable items, but Mercs can't be traded. Is it just a wasted 'loot' item?


I also want to know this.

I too want to know this - particularly for the 2014 Gencon where we will have to open packs till we get a 2013 merc then keep opening them till we get the second 2013 merc then the 2 2014 mercs risking getting a non tradable double the entire time. Ie we cant just stop after we have the merc and sell the remainder on auction house as there are 4 mercs altogether..

elfstone
07-13-2013, 12:35 AM
holy cripes Ive been here since kickstarter started and its amazing what people complain about :p

For the question of getting a merc you already have:

You cant trade them, you cant save them. and they are account bound.

I really dont see crypto having us lose an item just cause we have it, my assumption is that once you get an account bound treasure item its simply crossed off your list of chances to pull, or is just "rerolled" if you get it.

Simple solution really.

Chiany
07-13-2013, 12:41 AM
holy cripes Ive been here since kickstarter started and its amazing what people complain about :p

For the question of getting a merc you already have:

You cant trade them, you cant save them. and they are account bound.

I really dont see crypto having us lose an item just cause we have it, my assumption is that once you get an account bound treasure item its simply crossed off your list of chances to pull, or is just "rerolled" if you get it.

Simple solution really.

Indeed, this was my solution too, easy peasy.

CustomCombo
07-13-2013, 02:59 AM
As many people have pointed out...the concept of not being able to acquire all the mercenaries is a pretty big blow to those of us who want some semblance of completion. Monetary constraints due to having made a large purchase shortly before the kickstarter was announced left me at a level that was well below what I wanted, but I eventually convinced myself to pledge what I could and get over the lost opportunity to acquire the higher tier exclusives. Jump forward a month and we're now being told that this is apparently going to become a regular thing. I also don't see allowing us to acquire the mercenaries through opening packs as much of an offering. Yes, we're given the opportunity to get something we would previously not have had...but it's a complete gamble. Those of us wanting to get these mercenaries are given 2 options: either shell out the money for a ticket to each convention or shell out enough money to gamble one of them through chests.

I guess my biggest problem with this is so many people equating it to exclusives offered by other "digital games". What people aren't mentioning is that those exclusives are almost always cosmetic. These mercenaries won't be, and while some people may argue the mercenaries are a small part of the game, I saw them as an opportunity to completely change your playstyle. What makes this even worse is that if I don't pick them up when they're available and later decide that I'd like to play with one...that option will never be available to me.

I understand that CZ is a business, and they're here to make money...but I really wish the kickstarter exclusives would've been the only ones that affected gameplay. I was frustrated enough about not being able to get them then, now there are going to be more. :-/

Blurr
07-13-2013, 03:04 AM
So wait, anyone who doesn't have the money/time to fly to Gen-Con or these other conventions, gets to pay to play the slot machine for a chance at these items?

I think that's my issue with this, the idea that you have to open boosters during the event for a chance to get the items. It feels too much like the lockbox systems of some other F2P games.

I guess I just don't like the idea that you have to spend money for these items. I don't like the idea that spending money earns you exclusive rewards. But then, perhaps I'm in the wrong genre to be feeling like that.

Lafoote
07-13-2013, 04:08 AM
The chest draw is a satisfactory solution. Provided the special drops aren't absurdly rare everyone gets what they want. Completionists get their mercs, it helps CZE's bottom line, and those wacky 'value' people can horde the stamped chests and sell them at a premium down the line.

Well done, and thanks for taking immediate care of our concerns.

Ginaz
07-13-2013, 04:27 AM
So wait, anyone who doesn't have the money/time to fly to Gen-Con or these other conventions, gets to pay to play the slot machine for a chance at these items?

I think that's my issue with this, the idea that you have to open boosters during the event for a chance to get the items. It feels too much like the lockbox systems of some other F2P games.

I guess I just don't like the idea that you have to spend money for these items. I don't like the idea that spending money earns you exclusive rewards. But then, perhaps I'm in the wrong genre to be feeling like that.

Its not an ideal solution but its much better than having the only way to get them being attending conventions in person. It gives everyone a relatively equal opportunity to get them without having to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars going to the event. You should also be able to buy boosters and chests off the AH from other players for less than the $2 Crypto will be charging for boosters. You might even be able to buy them for gold instead of plat if thats what the person selling wants. We'll see.

fawus
07-13-2013, 05:51 AM
I want my sleeves!:(

Facilier
07-13-2013, 07:01 AM
Kinda curious about the treasure chests - if they drop mercenaries and sleeves, which cannot be traded, will a chest only be able to roll sleeves and mercs we don't have, or is there a chance you will effectively get nothing from the chest?

Chiany
07-13-2013, 07:26 AM
Kinda curious about the treasure chests - if they drop mercenaries and sleeves, which cannot be traded, will a chest only be able to roll sleeves and mercs we don't have, or is there a chance you will effectively get nothing from the chest?

Submit as a question for the livestream later today ;)

RuthlessSqueak
07-13-2013, 08:47 AM
Better solution/s, that they won't use (and I don't understand why other than the fact that they think they can get away with this method and make more money doing so):

1. If you attend a live event you get a promotional mercenary card with a code to add it to your account. When playing with the mercenary in game the image/artwork of the mercenary is different from other versions (when browsing your mercenaries it also bares an icon/logo for the convention/event and year).

2. Other players that can't/won't attend the event can acquire the mercenary through an alternate method but it won't have the same artwork/image as the promotional mercenary and won't bear the logo identifying what event it was associated with. Here are some reasonable options to make these mercenaries available, any one of these is a good solution in my opinion:

a. Make any purchase in the online store during the event you automatically receive the mercenary if you don't already have it.

b. Log in to your account during the event and automatically receive the mercenary.

c. Log in and visit a set area/npc and the mercenary is added to your account.

d. Host a stream/video feed and routinely release general access codes. These codes can be used once per account by any one during the event period to add the mercenary to the account that enters the code.

e. Make a promotional section of the website only available during the event that when clicked on/entered will add the mercenary to your account.

GreyWorm
07-13-2013, 10:10 AM
Better solution/s, that they won't use (and I don't understand why other than the fact that they think they can get away with this method and make more money doing so):

1. If you attend a live event you get a promotional mercenary card with a code to add it to your account. When playing with the mercenary in game the image/artwork of the mercenary is different from other versions (when browsing your mercenaries it also bares an icon/logo for the convention/event and year).

2. Other players that can't/won't attend the event can acquire the mercenary through an alternate method but it won't have the same artwork/image as the promotional mercenary and won't bear the logo identifying what event it was associated with. Here are some reasonable options to make these mercenaries available, any one of these is a good solution in my opinion:

a. Make any purchase in the online store during the event you automatically receive the mercenary if you don't already have it.

b. Log in to your account during the event and automatically receive the mercenary.

c. Log in and visit a set area/npc and the mercenary is added to your account.

d. Host a stream/video feed and routinely release general access codes. These codes can be used once per account by any one during the event period to add the mercenary to the account that enters the code.

e. Make a promotional section of the website only available during the event that when clicked on/entered will add the mercenary to your account.

If I remember correctly, they said that they will give some items free for everyone at special events, like they did with princess cory, or chest o hex.

So your (good) suggestions (b-e) might just happen!

TheMadHatter
07-13-2013, 10:48 AM
@Cory

Thank you for waiting patiently to consider the topic, then taking a strong stance. Many of my concerns were addressed. :)

Indecision and a lack of information will cause unnecessarily violent shifts in the market, creating a culture of fear, hoarding and allowing the economically/informationally advantaged to rob the average Hexer. Continue to consider deeply and I won't have to worry.

Economy and value will drive the community in the direction of limited edition items. By allowing everyone the opportunity to access limited items through drafting, everyone who cannot attend are attending in a realistic sense, AND people will now be encouraged to draft then play the best part of Hex (balanced and competitive TCG goodness). I don't know about the rest of the community, but I'd rather pay to draft a few times potentially winning big, than pay for some digital ticket that gives you all the best stuff with no effort. Cheers!

Having special chests allow future players the opportunity to try to get the limited edition content.

Using treasure chests in this way takes away some of the incentive to hoard packs, markets are stronger when there is robust trade!

Allowing players to consistently have the opportunity to invest in the chance of getting something from a chest in the market will greatly reduce the value and legitimacy of a 3rd party markets dealing in similar products. The more influence 3rd parties have, the weaker the legitimate market economy will be.

Making an incriminating video of yourself is one kind of balls. Continuing to do what you believe is right knowing it will bring some hate onto you is another. I'm glad I invested so heavily in Hex, and encouraged so many friends of mine to do the same.

Hail to the Cory!

Pezzle
07-13-2013, 05:06 PM
Are we going to be able to purchase multiple $10 entries and give the base rewards (deck, sleeve, merc?) to others or is it one per customer?

Nthanel
07-15-2013, 02:36 PM
"-Unfortunately, no. It's one entry per person. We will not be allowing multiple purchases from players who wish to play in the league."

That was the reply I got when I emailed them with the same question.

Bloodroot
07-15-2013, 03:01 PM
Let me start of by saying, it will be impossible to collect every single Mercenary. Seriously, you can’t.

I hope everyone can get on board with this concept, because let me tell you, the mercenaries are sooooo fun!

This seems a bit cruel. Have you considered naming one of the mercenaries Tantalus?

Bloodroot

Diesbudt
07-16-2013, 09:56 AM
"-Unfortunately, no. It's one entry per person. We will not be allowing multiple purchases from players who wish to play in the league."

That was the reply I got when I emailed them with the same question.

This makes sense.

Pezzle
07-16-2013, 04:51 PM
"-Unfortunately, no. It's one entry per person. We will not be allowing multiple purchases from players who wish to play in the league."

That was the reply I got when I emailed them with the same question.

If the person that emailed you is correct then the event itself is registered incorrectly. I just purchased two tickets for league play. Two seems to be the maximum.

Any chance a Cryptozoic employee could offer clarity in this thread?

Bells
07-16-2013, 07:51 PM
Maybe the fact that the larger playerbase for this comes from the US makes it harder to see... but i take issue with this.

You see... one of the beauties of an fully online developed experience if that the world is connected via the game world. With local exclusives, i'm screwed unless i have enough money to fly myself to a convention to try and get it.

is that fair? your backers where from all around the world... you guys were funded GLOBALLY. Why would it be fair to restrict -DIGITAL- benefits for an 100% DIGITAL game to a local PHYSICAL group?

Makes very little sense and it's a tad unfair to me. You think i wouldn't want to come to these events? Or collect awesome loot and improve my collection and decks? Just cause i'm not from regional US does that make it fair that i would have to pay up 4-5k just to be get a chance at it?

look... i like the idea of exclusives. I Love the concept of rewarding loyalty. I love exclusive deals and feeling like you have acquired something special just by being a fan. But -do not- lock out your fans just cause they can't fly over. This is a new experience, a new TCG made for an online world. Trapping it with restrictive local benefits would be locking yourselves to a bad trope.

My suggestion is one already proposed in this thread... allow everyone to have a shot at the exclusives online during event hours. Give physical goods to those who come to the event, that's cool, that's even fair... but don't take a piece of the game we all supported and give it just to some that are closest to you guys. You have fans who would love to have access to that stuff and just can't.... the thing is, within the proposal of what HEX is supposed to be... what we all kickstarted for, it doesn't have to be.

I really hope more of my Fellow US players would support this stance as it can benefit players worldwide and provide a fair, balanced, community for HEX... which is good for all of us.

Hell dude, i Bough Duels of the Planeswalker 2014 and WOTC gave me a free physical booster pack for it. It's in English, but they actually made it avaliable with no extra cost...

Diesbudt
07-17-2013, 10:08 AM
Maybe the fact that the larger playerbase for this comes from the US makes it harder to see... but i take issue with this.

You see... one of the beauties of an fully online developed experience if that the world is connected via the game world. With local exclusives, i'm screwed unless i have enough money to fly myself to a convention to try and get it.

is that fair? your backers where from all around the world... you guys were funded GLOBALLY. Why would it be fair to restrict -DIGITAL- benefits for an 100% DIGITAL game to a local PHYSICAL group?

Makes very little sense and it's a tad unfair to me. You think i wouldn't want to come to these events? Or collect awesome loot and improve my collection and decks? Just cause i'm not from regional US does that make it fair that i would have to pay up 4-5k just to be get a chance at it?

look... i like the idea of exclusives. I Love the concept of rewarding loyalty. I love exclusive deals and feeling like you have acquired something special just by being a fan. But -do not- lock out your fans just cause they can't fly over. This is a new experience, a new TCG made for an online world. Trapping it with restrictive local benefits would be locking yourselves to a bad trope.

My suggestion is one already proposed in this thread... allow everyone to have a shot at the exclusives online during event hours. Give physical goods to those who come to the event, that's cool, that's even fair... but don't take a piece of the game we all supported and give it just to some that are closest to you guys. You have fans who would love to have access to that stuff and just can't.... the thing is, within the proposal of what HEX is supposed to be... what we all kickstarted for, it doesn't have to be.

I really hope more of my Fellow US players would support this stance as it can benefit players worldwide and provide a fair, balanced, community for HEX... which is good for all of us.

Hell dude, i Bough Duels of the Planeswalker 2014 and WOTC gave me a free physical booster pack for it. It's in English, but they actually made it avaliable with no extra cost...

Did you even read the update from last Friday? They said that the exclusives will be available in the game via chance in chests from booster packs opened during the event time period.

And for events the game is not active, like GenCon 13, it will be added also to GenCon 14 exlcusives list.

Kalium
07-17-2013, 12:44 PM
Pardon but I have a couple of questions/ concerns.

What will the percentage chance be on getting Mercenary or Sleeve in a Treasure Chest be? I am hoping it will be closer to 10% instead of the expected .01%. Since these are limited time events a higher drop rate would be preferable.

Second, since Mercenaries and Sleeves are not able to be traded... will there be safeguards in place to get something useful instead of duplicates? (I recently finished reading the thread and this was asked a lot but still warrants an answer).

Thank you for your time,
Kalium

Yoss
07-17-2013, 05:52 PM
Will the chest-drop mercs be tradeable codes like the live-event ones?

Yoss
07-17-2013, 06:27 PM
Prove them wrong? You do realize as you play through PvE you will have to make choices that PREVENT you from getting certain mercenaries while getting others. And this decision is for your account and not character.

So please, tell me, what is your plan?
To start with, Story Mercs should be differentiated from Exclusive Mercs. Story Mercs can be earned by any player at any time who makes the requisite PVE plot choices with a Champion, and therefore the Story Mercs should be bound to that Champion (or maybe Keep, if they allow multiple Keeps per player account). Meanwhile, Exclusive Mercs have no such restriction in a lore sense, so they should be tradeable. (Another idea someone had was to allow "rent-a-merc" where you can go to someone's keep and temporarily hire their exclusive mercs for a fee that they set.)


Don't be such a downer, I realize that, sadly enough. There were the game forces me to make a choice, I will pick the one that I like most.

Then I will go on my second account, play through it all again and pick the other. I might not have it all on one account, but I will get them all. And certainly I will TEST them all.

Alternatively, I might just give up my completionist attitude and hope that one day CZE sees that they're being party poopers by witholding all these awesome mercenaries from a part of the community ^^ I still stand by my Tavern idea, where after some time players can get the mercenary with gold / plantinum. Limited in time exclusivity is still a form of exclusivity, is it not?

Still thank you Cory and CZE for actually looking at some pressing discussions. I'm glad you guys answered this.
As discussed in another thread (that the new rules do not allow me to link to), I'm hoping they will not encourage multiaccounting for situations like you're listing here. I am hoping they encourage a "one player, one account" policy and have ways to be completionist within that framework.


So what happens if we get more than one of the same Merc? This isn't a problem for tradable items, but Mercs can't be traded. Is it just a wasted 'loot' item?
Hopefully the chest will drop a tradeable redemption code so that you can sell the extras on the AH. (The other proposed solution is to have the game re-roll the duplicate.)


I like this. It gives everyone the same opportunity to acquire the mercs, which is all I was asking for.
Future players do not get "the same opportunity" because the account-bound nature of the Exclusive Mercs cripples the secondary market. Granted, I'm covered because I got in early, but it will be a bummer for player recruitment a year or two down the line.


I was a fan of the secondary market. Seems I lost my argument while supporting the prior idea. Nothing seems to be hitting ebay now. Let the "have-nots" rejoice.
Time to join "our" side of the debate and argue in favor of in-game tradeability?


I am wanting further clarification as to the specifics of the chests:

Q: For the 2014 Gencon, am I limited to a particular card set for mercs to drop from the treasure chests? Will set 1 only provide 2013 Gencon chests while set 2 will provide 2013 & 2014 loot tables. What about 2016 Gencon? Can I use Set1 packs for loot tables there?
I'm pretty sure they said it will affect ANY booster you open during the proper time slot.