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HyenaNipples
07-23-2013, 09:16 AM
Some Hex cards cost too many resources. Or at least, that's what I think! Let me hear your opinion about this list on Hex Shuffle! (http://hexshuffle.wordpress.com/2013/07/23/the-list-of-over-cost-cards-72313/)

Grissnap
07-23-2013, 05:59 PM
Nice thought provoking article.

It seems like you are approaching your evaluation from a constructed perspective. In that context I think most of your list is accurate. However, approaching things with limited in mind you definitely need to take Sniper of Gawaine and Shadowgrove Witch off of your list. Direct removal for 2 damage plus a 2/2 body is pretty efficient costing at 5, especially when the direct damage can be boosted through inspire effects. Shadowgrove Witch is also not completely overcosted in limited, it either gives you card knowledge and the ability to make your opponents next play below curve (plus some knowledge of the opponents hand). She would be a bit overpowered at 3 cost when you are on the play as you could potentially completely eliminate your opponents turn 3 drop, which would only exacerbate the advantage you get from going first.

Just my initial thoughts.

HyenaNipples
07-23-2013, 06:16 PM
You are absolutely correct. I wrote the entire article from a constructed perspective, and I've received three comments saying similar things. I've since added that little disclaimer to the article title.

As for your specifics- I agree with the Sniper. He's a great limited card.

Icepick
07-24-2013, 04:22 AM
Nice article, though I disagree on a few points in terms of constructed.

I think you've seriously undervalued Mortar Strike (although everyone seems to do this, so you're not alone.) The key thing to realise here is that if the 3 damage dealt to troops on the deck reduces them to 0 defence, they aren't removed from the deck. They stay in there, and essentially become dead draws. The opponent draws the card as normal and then either keeps it in their hand forever, or plays it and it immediately dies because it has 0 defence. Now, you're obviously playing the odds here as you mentioned, but I think that giving the other player a potential 3 dead draws in addition to some damage to their Champion is a pretty powerful effect.

I don't really think that the Legionnaire of Adamanth is overcosted at all, as especially in constructed you're only realistically going to use him in a full human deck, where it wouldn't be unreasonable to expect to have 30 humans. Now consider that most of those humans are likely to have Inspire effects and it wouldn't be unrealistic to end up with a 12/12+ with any combination of Speed, Lifedrain, Steadfast and/or an exhaust ability or some card draw. It's this potential that you are paying for, not just the raw card itself.

I think the Sniper is fairly costed in Constructed as well as Limited, as again you have to account for combo potential. The most obvious one we've seen, the Sword Trainer, boosts the Sniper's damage to 4, and potentially higher still if you add in other effects like the Human Rogue Champion's charge power (and since both cost 5 it's not unreasonable to assume you'll have access to both on the same turn.)

HyenaNipples
07-24-2013, 05:28 AM
Are you sure about Mortar Strike? I thought when a troop takes -damage- equal or greater than its defense, it dies. Meanwhile, an effect that reduces defense to 0 without damage would create the dead draws you describe.

Icepick
07-24-2013, 08:11 AM
Reasonably sure, though I obviously can't be 100%. I don't remember where, but someone on the forums recently quoted CZE as saying this is how it works when stuff is damaged while still in the deck.

HyenaNipples
07-24-2013, 08:56 AM
If that turns out to be the case, I would definitely agree. Dead draws would be pretty awesome.

Rycajo
07-24-2013, 01:57 PM
Are you sure about Mortar Strike? I thought when a troop takes -damage- equal or greater than its defense, it dies. Meanwhile, an effect that reduces defense to 0 without damage would create the dead draws you describe.

Mortar Strike should work this way; otherwise, by the time you have the 5 shards to cast it, you might just kill a few weak creatures from the top of your opponent's deck. You might actually be helping them improve their draws.

But with a dead troop being a dead draw - now you are looking at possible card advantage along with the 3 damage to the face.

ramseytheory
07-25-2013, 01:04 PM
Reasonably sure, though I obviously can't be 100%. I don't remember where, but someone on the forums recently quoted CZE as saying this is how it works when stuff is damaged while still in the deck.

I remember this as well, although I can't remember where from either. It's also worth noting that 5 damage is enough to kill most troops with cost 4 and below. (I still don't like Mortar Strike as a card, though.)

Icepick
07-27-2013, 04:21 AM
I asked Ben Stoll the Mortar Strike question during his AMA in the R&D thread and he confirmed that "dead" cards stay in the deck, so there you go!

HyenaNipples
07-27-2013, 06:18 AM
Nice! I'll have to make some changes.