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AscendedOne
07-27-2013, 09:17 PM
Old Build(s):
http://www.hex-datamine.com/deck.php?s=45,47,52,54,71,93,96,162,184,185,186,19 0,200,225&qt=4,4,4,2,4,12,9,2,4,4,2,1,2,4
http://hex.potion-of-wit.com/deck.php?s=15,45,47,52,54,71,93,96,130,162,184,185 ,186,225&qt=3,4,4,4,2,4,12,9,1,2,3,4,2,4
http://www.hex-datamine.com/deck.php?s=15,45,47,52,54,71,93,96,130,184,185,186 ,200,225,269,270&qt=4,4,1,4,4,4,11,9,1,4,4,2,3,1,2,2
http://www.hex-datamine.com/deck.php?s=15,45,47,52,54,71,93,96,130,184,185,200 ,270,295&qt=4,4,1,4,4,4,10,8,4,4,4,3,2,4

Current Build:

This build removed the four master beast rider as he probably does not exist any more. I added four cloudwatchers to shift through the deck faster. I do not care that I am discarding cards as I can access them later with void marauder and dream dance. I took out a oracle song as I think I do not need or benefit from having a third with the changes to my deck. I took out two runts of the litter to make room for two survival of the fittests for early and mid game removal. I added a Battle Beetle for the late game removal that was lost when master beast riders left the deck.



Card list

4 Shards of Fate
8 Sapphire Sources
10 Wild Sources


Troops:

4 Archmage Wrenlockes
4 Void Marauders
4 Prosperos, Sylvan Enchanter
4 Glimmerglen Witch
4 Cloudwatchers
1 Battle Beetle (Battle target troop gem)

Actions:

4 Dream Dances
2 Oracle Songs
2 Countermagics
1 Replicator's Gambit
4 Chlorophyllias
2 Runts of the Litter
2 Survivals of the Fittests

Equipment:

Gloves of the Archmage: When Archmage Wrenlocke enters play, put an action from your graveyard into your hand.

Conjurer's Headcover: Tempest Strike's effect is now permanent. (Prospero, Sylvan Enchanter)

Cloud Nine Boots: You may put a card in your graveyard on top of your deck. (Dream Dance)

Armor?

Trinket? I have recently considered that the reinforcements cage trinket is not needed in my deck, as I already have the ability to recover actions and I could probably find a better trinket for this slot. In the end, it isn't exactly a required piece of equipment for my deck. I am not sure whether the storm fan equipment for the cloudwatcher is for the trinket or the weapon slot, it could theoretically find a place in my deck in either spot.

Weapon? I am considering the Eye of Creation weapon and the Replicator's Gambit weapon, but neither seem very effective with my deck. While I do not know what cards are in the Eye of Creation deck, whatever they may be, it seems unlikely that they would be worth the weapon slot if I can find a half decent weapon.

After further consideration, if the Eye of Creation deck is not limited by size, (I.E. I can play an infinite amount of eye of creations without consuming the deck in question) it could theoretically add an infinite amount of actions to my graveyard to use with my Void Marauder. I could see this weapon being in my deck in certain conditions.

I feel like I do not have enough troops in my deck for Replicator's Gambit's weapon to be an effective choice, seeing as how I dont want to give up the first copy of Cloudwatcher, Prospero Slyvan Enchanter or the Void Marauder I field, and Archmage Wrenlocke is unique, the only creature it would get the full benefit on is the Glimmerglen Witch. After reducing the count of replicators gambits to 1, I really don't see any reason whatsoever to have it's weapon.




Notes

Key Card Interactions:

Archmage Wrenlocke and Prospero allow consistent card draw by giving an action card to use with Wrenlocke's special every turn.

Tempest strikes from Prosperos will flood the graveyard, effectively giving a Void Marauder many targets for his special later in the game.

Dream Dances allow me to constantly draw into my deck or repeatedly redraw a card from the graveyard if I have one Dream Dance in my graveyard, one in my hand, and a Void marauder out on the field by redrawing a card from the graveyard then using the second use of the Dream Dance via the Void Marauder to draw a Dream Dance back out of my graveyard. I could for instance, redraw Runts of the Litter for a large number of chump blockers, or Chlorophyllia to boost my mana count by large amounts each turn.

Dream Dance (in tandem with an active void marauder to prevent the scenario from JUST being an even exchange) will allow me to recover cards from the graveyard allowing me to continue using my entire spellbook even after consuming the deck. Dream Dance also allows me to recover my counter spells during my enemies turn if he tries to pull a fast one.

Replicator's Gambit combined with the large amounts of card draw during each of my turns allows me to create a large army of whatever creatures I happen to need during the turn, well, during the deck's endgame anyways. Battle Beetle would serve as my damage based removal during the late game with Tempest Strikes, (which would most likely get copied into the other 6 troops during a Replicator's Gambit) and the gem that allows you to battle a unit with the creature when deployed. I assume the Battle Beetle could target an air unit with the wild gem. Glimmerglen witch serves as my mid-late game health recovery. Getting additional Prosperos increases the rate of the tempest strike flood in my graveyard.


General Thoughts:

Countermagic is in the deck to deal with any cards that could disrupt the deck. I only put in two, as I felt I wouldn't need more to use with the void marauder's special. Cards that wipe the board, clean out the graveyard, invalidate one type of card, or kill multiple creatures could potentially stop this deck dead in it's tracks by preventing me from using any part of the combo.

This deck wants to devour itself quickly with large amounts of card draw to get to the endgame. When it finally manages to clean the last of the cards out of the deck is when it begins to shine the brightest, having the ability to get large amounts of mana with chlorophyllia to extend future turns, increasingly larger Tempest Strikes, and massively increasing the army size with Replicator's Gambits and whatnot. I believe it is likely that this deck would have a slow start, despite the card draw available in the deck, as the creatures start out fairly weak and would most likely end up struggling for early board control.

I'm basically brand new to this game and the game (magic the gathering) from which this game was derived and I am looking for feedback concerning what problems there may be with the deck I have formed or how I could improve it.


Questions:

Is there a hand size limit and what is it and how does it work? Does it prevent getting past the limit or does it discard extra cards at the end/start of your turn? (or something different?)

Can anyone confirm or correct an assumption I have made for any game mechanic in this post?

Are there any game mechanics that hinder an aspect of my deck?

Does anyone not understand an aspect of my deck or how I have worded my thoughts?

Barkam
07-28-2013, 02:00 AM
You have great ideas. Unfortunately, this deck is very susceptible to an aggro deck. You really don't have enough troops to block/trade. I understand this is why Replicator's Gambit is in the deck, but it actually doesn't help you as you just returned your chump blocker back into your deck. You don't have any removals once their troops are on the board.

Countermagic is actually bad for what you are trying to do as it will further slow you down and keep you from playing troops at turn 3 when you actually have enough mana to cast your early troops. I would replace them with more Eye of Creations.

Bottom line: You have no early plays that would even get you close to end game for your deck to win.

AscendedOne
07-28-2013, 01:37 PM
http://hex.potion-of-wit.com/deck.php?s=15,45,47,52,54,71,93,96,130,162,184,185 ,186,225&qt=3,4,4,4,2,4,12,9,1,2,3,4,2,4

I restructured the deck a bit, found a new candidate for health gain in the glimmerglen witch, I put 3 runts of the litter in there, with their trinket effect, removed two oracles song, a single archmage wrenlocke, and chronic madness. That should hopefully solve any chump blocker problem.

With the trinket and void marauder, that should fill the need for chump blockers, seeing that I can void 6 shin'hares to place 9 once all 3 runts of the litter are in the graveyard. Glimmerglen witch may be slower for health gain than chronic madness with it's trinket effect, but it isn't a dead card to use if I should get it before the endgame and frees up the trinket slot for the runts of the litter action.

Considering the amount of card draw I already have, I feel like I do not need more eye of creations. Please consider the only reason why I have any eye of creations in the deck at all, is to chew through the resource cards, because I assume that it allows multiple resources to be played in the same turn. I fail to see why countermagic is a bad card in my deck. Just because I COULD play it on turn 3, doesn't mean that I would. To me, it basically says: "NO. You don't to get to play that card until later in the game." At which point, I hopefully would be able to lock down any card that threatens my play style. In addition, in the early game, I would likely use it against any card that may threaten my early board position, not just those that disrupt my playstyle.

vulture27
07-29-2013, 09:05 AM
I think you have the start of a strong deck; two or three years from now. I just don't see the cards being available yet that make this a really consistent and powerful combo deck. That being said....

- I would drop the Honeycaps. They do nothing to help your deck. I know you intend for them to be a win condition via Replicator's Gambit, but Master Beast Rider already does that. By the time you combo out you will easily drop 14+ Beast Riders in one turn, kill everything on your opponents board, and swing for leathal next turn. Also, as already mentioned, if you play them before comboing out they are great against aggro decks.

- I would replace the Eye of Creations with Oracle Songs. It is highly unlikely the Eyes will let you play extract resources like you hope. It reduces spell costs to zero, it says nothing about changing the one resource per turn rule. The Oracle Songs can help you dig prior to going off with your combo, and they interact amazingly with Void Marauder. However, this is one of those cards I would hope to replace with a better version of in a year or two.

- Not entirely sold on Wild Soul. I think Wild Growth is going to be better most of the time, and Wild Soul only really better after you already combo out. Probably personal preference though.

- Prospero.... I hate this card for what the deck wants to do, but I don't see any alternative. Its just too damn slow. I'd also look to replace this with future sets.

- Glimmerglen Witch and Runts of the Litter. I'd replace these with either Pack Raptors or Sensei of the Milky Eye. The one witch isn't going to give any sort of significant, reliable life gain to slow an aggro deck. Runts of the Litter is a horrible version of several cards in Magic: The Gathering that have seen high level tournament success. The Raptors and Sensei can both help you in the early game with different mid-late game effects (Lots of people have already suggested Raptors as a Replicator's Gambit deck finisher, Sensei digs a little for combo pieces). Whatever you pick, I would be looking to replace this 4x of in the future.

Edit: As for the two Coutermagics, I might include one in the current build for something like extinction following you playing a ton of summoning sickness creatures. Maybe a couple more copies in the future if we get quick action card draw.

Edit: I'd also hope to see some sort of mana fixing in the future. If Hex ever has "dual lands" they could really help here.

AscendedOne
07-29-2013, 02:14 PM
- I would drop the Honeycaps. They do nothing to help your deck. I know you intend for them to be a win condition via Replicator's Gambit, but Master Beast Rider already does that. By the time you combo out you will easily drop 14+ Beast Riders in one turn, kill everything on your opponents board, and swing for leathal next turn. Also, as already mentioned, if you play them before comboing out they are great against aggro decks.


I think you misinterpreted their purpose. It isn't suppose to be a "win condition", because most of this stuff is built with raid encounters in mind, where the boss's health is not reduced relative to the damage dealt to him, just being attacked at all reduces his health by a set amount that doesn't scale with the damage dealt. At least, that is what I have heard. The reason they are there is to be able to absorb damage with their temporary stats then keep on kicking with no sense of fatigue. Maybe they still don't have a place in the deck. I'll look into what I can replace them with.



- Not entirely sold on Wild Soul. I think Wild Growth is going to be better most of the time, and Wild Soul only really better after you already combo out. Probably personal preference though.


I see wild soul being strong when you consider that chlorophyllia gives two wild thresholds, and then you can factor in my card recovery and void marauders. While I don't know what equipment wild growth comes with, wild soul looks promising to me, even with it being weaker early on.



- Glimmerglen Witch and Runts of the Litter. I'd replace these with either Pack Raptors or Sensei of the Milky Eye. The one witch isn't going to give any sort of significant, reliable life gain to slow an aggro deck. Runts of the Litter is a horrible version of several cards in Magic: The Gathering that have seen high level tournament success. The Raptors and Sensei can both help you in the early game with different mid-late game effects (Lots of people have already suggested Raptors as a Replicator's Gambit deck finisher, Sensei digs a little for combo pieces). Whatever you pick, I would be looking to replace this 4x of in the future.


Glimmerglen Witch isn't suppose to be there to deal with an agro deck, its suppose to be there to recover health in the mid to late game in tandem with Replicator's Gambit. Pack Raptors seem awfully counter intuitive to my deck, seeing as how they delay reaching the deck's endgame (and possibly prevent it entirely) and at the same time hinder it. Because of the increasingly larger decksize instead of increasingly smaller decksize, there isn't a way to retrieve the troop effected by Replicator's Gambit, which means I can't use Replicator's Gambit in it's intended manner. I can't use it with Glimmerglen Witch to recover health, I can't use it with Master Beast Riders as removal, I can't use it with Archmage Wrenlocke to recover any actions, I can't use it with Prospero to increase the amount of Tempest Strikes I receive each turn, it hinders my deck for what I wanted it to be.



Edit: As for the two Coutermagics, I might include one in the current build for something like extinction following you playing a ton of summoning sickness creatures. Maybe a couple more copies in the future if we get quick action card draw.


You mean like Dream Dance? Which either allows me to recover a card from my graveyard or draw into my deck. (and y'know the void marauder allows me to use it multiple times) But either way, I don't feel like I need more than two.

Eierdotter
07-31-2013, 07:43 AM
looks like a really slow fun deck to me...
you miss on 4 Lotus in the Deck (you do not need to sac them, but a free card draw is awesome)
this deck needs some more thoughts.

AscendedOne
07-31-2013, 03:52 PM
looks like a really slow fun deck to me...
you miss on 4 Lotus in the Deck (you do not need to sac them, but a free card draw is awesome)
this deck needs some more thoughts.

I'm not a donor. I'm going to work my ass off trying to get some of this stuff as it is. What do you mean when you say that this deck needs some more thoughts?

Aradon
07-31-2013, 04:32 PM
I want to point out that it's just a single raid encounter that uses the damage method described. Most raid bosses will probably lose health like normal, but the example they gave us used an alternate method of damage.

AscendedOne
07-31-2013, 04:52 PM
I want to point out that it's just a single raid encounter that uses the damage method described. Most raid bosses will probably lose health like normal, but the example they gave us used an alternate method of damage.

When I heard it, it sounded like it was going to be for all boss encounters. It seems like the type of mechanic where they would consistently have it on either all the bosses or none of them. But whatever, the game isn't out yet. If I'm wrong, oh well.

jimmywolf
08-04-2013, 07:13 PM
either way good theory crafting deck, i lack insight too plan that far ahead, an would need stare at the cards an play them for a while, before i had any solid grasp. so it nice too see others play builds.

AbandonAllHope
08-09-2013, 09:27 AM
AscendedOne:
Even if you are not a donor, you will be able to buy spectral lotus from the Auction House, or trade it possibly with friends that want to sell/trade. Its a very useful 0 mana artifact that gives free draw, basically making your deck a 56 card deck and bringing out your most important cards faster. I'm sure you already knew this, just wanted to point out that you can easily buy one, since all those donors will be getting one per day, if not 2 per day for certain contributors. Just never trigger those lotuses unless its a very difficult raid boss or something :P

chansen005
08-11-2013, 01:08 PM
To all who care, i also have a blue green deck created for PVE, it consists of the following.

2 secret laboratory
4 Archmage wrenlock
4 Dream Dance
4 Oracle song
4 Technical Genius
-
4 pack raptor
4 Master Beast Rider (force combat)
4 sensei of the milkey eye
4 wild growth
2 Jadiim
-
14 Sapphire shard
10 Wild Shard

The goal isnt to get an archmage going and then just action murder your opponent. The idea is simply that of every compeditive game knows to man... SURVIVE! if you end up living, it gets to the point where you draw and play as many pack raptors as you have mana, and you win. Archmage is simply so that you can get through your deck to that point.

I plan on using edonrock (obviously) so i can get jadiim out asap with reverse engineering, and with all troops being artifact troops, that means that pack raptors get played for free with technical genius out on the field. Assuming I get the PVE equipment I would get 3 master theory crafters to make Jadiim go down to a 3 cost, and just secret lab throw them away once a drew them.

what be your ideas/dislikes community people?

AbandonAllHope
08-11-2013, 01:12 PM
I assume you would be including 4 pack raptors in that deck as you stated in your tactics (counted 56 cards).

I had something similar in mind, but not exactly the same.

chansen005
08-11-2013, 01:45 PM
I feel as though void Marauder/archmage wrenlock is just too gimmicky. I've tested it, it's retarded once you get it off. And i know my idea dies to zombie plague, but yours dies to any removal. what was your deck idea that was similar?

AbandonAllHope
08-11-2013, 02:14 PM
How does your deck die to Zombie Plague? As far as I understand it, zombie plague can't kill any of your cards.

"At the start of your turn, add a plague counter to this constant. Then, reveal a random troop from each opposing champion's deck for each plague counter on this constant. Those troops get permanent -1 /-1 . If a troop's is reduced to 0 this way, revert it, transform it into a [Zombie], and put it into play under your control."

As far as I understand Zombie Plague, all it does is puts -1/-1 counters on, for example, your Pack Raptor, but it dies immediately, but it gets "reverted" (as per the "revert it" text) back to its original 1/1 Pack Raptor. So it can only ever reduce your creatures stats, but never permanently kill them. (Anybody Correct me if I'm wrong). Unless this "revert it" part is actually just something absolete and the "transform it into a Zombie" means the card does disappear (in which case, I completely misinterpreted it)

As for the deck, I would probably replace technical genius with 4 Spectral Lotus, give Master Beast Rider the Draw gem, and personally I would have replaced the Wild Growth with Chlorophyllia. I also was debating with myself about Sensei of the Milky Eye. Its really nice with speeding up it finding what you need, but I definitely like the new cards Buccaneer/Time Ripple. Time Ripple has good control since its not limited to troop cards only, and I'm sure there will be instances in PvE where there are devastating constants/artifacts.

For the rest it was the same.

Oh wait, I had 3 Archmage Wrenlock and 3 secret laboratory.

jaxsonbatemanhex
08-11-2013, 02:26 PM
How does your deck die to Zombie Plague? As far as I understand it, zombie plague can't kill any of your cards.

"At the start of your turn, add a plague counter to this constant. Then, reveal a random troop from each opposing champion's deck for each plague counter on this constant. Those troops get permanent -1 /-1 . If a troop's is reduced to 0 this way, revert it, transform it into a [Zombie], and put it into play under your control."

As far as I understand Zombie Plague, all it does is puts -1/-1 counters on, for example, your Pack Raptor, but it dies immediately, but it gets "reverted" (as per the "revert it" text) back to its original 1/1 Pack Raptor. So it can only ever reduce your creatures stats, but never permanently kill them. (Anybody Correct me if I'm wrong). Unless this "revert it" part is actually just something absolete and the "transform it into a Zombie" means the card does disappear (in which case, I completely misinterpreted it)
From what we understand, a card keeps modifications like "gains permanent +1/+1" or "gains permanent life drain" when it transforms. Reverting a card, as far as we understand, turns it back into its complete, original form (ie. not transformed if it has been), free of any permanent modifications (such as from Ruby Pyromancer or Inner Conflict).

Zombie Plague needs to revert the card before it transforms it into a zombie, otherwise any 2/2 or higher creature that had been 'killed' by it would get transformed into a zombie with at least -2/-2, and then die immediately for being 0/0 or less.

Also, as far as we know, creatures can't die in any non-battlefield zone. Otherwise, something like Ozawa which is only ever not 0/0 on the battlefield would die at the beginning of every game.

AbandonAllHope
08-11-2013, 02:30 PM
Makes sense. Was thinking it would have been ridiculous if Zombie Plague was able to permanently destroy creatures in a deck.

jaxsonbatemanhex
08-11-2013, 02:44 PM
Makes sense. Was thinking it would have been ridiculous if Zombie Plague was able to permanently destroy creatures in a deck.
It more or less does. :-P It eventually reduces a troop to 0 toughness, then transforms that very troop into a zombie under the ZP controller's control. If the zombie then dies for some reason, the zombie (and thus, the card it was originally was) gets voided, so there's no getting it back.

AbandonAllHope
08-11-2013, 03:00 PM
Yeah I know, but that was my logic of reading it the way I did, because ZP already having a decent speed of zombie production, having creature removal capabilities just seemed ludicrous and deck breaking (if lucky on the randomization). Worried in seeing it in PvP now =/

Really curious in seeing how it will work in the Alpha.

Rycajo
08-11-2013, 05:04 PM
Rather powerful against the long game, but if your opponent can kill you with the troops in hand at the start, the "removal" won't really matter.