View Full Version : Judam + cost reduction cards

08-14-2013, 08:01 AM
I guess this might be a question more directed towards the game developers, since most people probably won't know how CZE is going to have Jadiim's ability work.

I'm kind of curious about what Jadiim's ability triggers on. Jadiims ability gives +x/+x based on the troops casting cost, but will it be based on the cost its being cast for or will it be based on the cards base cost. For example, if I use Master Theorycrafters trinket ( or Journeyman Technician), and the price of Pack Raptor becomes 0. Will Jadiim actually get +1/+1 because of its base cost being 1 or +0/+0 because its casting cost was 0.

It states "where X is that card's cost". From this I assume its the cards base cost, otherwise I would have assumed they would use the wording "casting cost", where it would be based on the amount of resource you have paid for the card.

Anybody else any thoughts on this, or perhaps already know what Jadiim's ability is based on?

08-14-2013, 08:14 AM
Card's are affected by all spoiled cards so far as "has COST-[1]" or "COST +[1]".

With this, it means it changes the actual cost of the card, not just how much you pay. So yes, it will change the X as well.

08-14-2013, 08:52 AM
Actually, Technical Genius says you pay 1 less to play artifacts. Pic at the bottom. Dream Dance and Wrenlocke are both the same.

In any case, if the cost is actually reduced or increased (such as with Time Ripple), then I imagine Jadiim (you do mean Jadiim, right?) will use the adjusted cost to determine how big a boost it gets. If the cost isn't changed and you're just able to cast it cheaper or for more via an ability worded like Technical Genius or Dream Dance, then I believe you'll get a boost equivalent to the cost in the top left corner.

Essentially, I believe it's going to be what figure you have in the top left corner that determines the boost - but we can't know for sure until the rules come out.


08-14-2013, 10:05 AM
Well put Jax. Your explanation seems the most likely.

08-14-2013, 11:09 AM
Ah sorry, yeah I meant Jadiim, not sure how it ever ended up becoming Judam in my post, but ah well.

And thats more or less my point as well Jax, it's kind of how I saw it as well. Was curious because I was testing my deck, and was using the assumption that Jadiim would use the base price (except with master theorycrafter perhaps) rather than the casting price, but seeing as the developers are the ones that really know how it works until the game is released, I was just curious about other peoples ideas on it. I guess people see it both ways, making me less certain. This of course is mainly for a PvE perspective, since I probably won't be using any cost reduction cards in a Jadiim deck in PvP.

NOTE: Corrected (hopefully) all the spelling from Judam to Jadiim :P

08-19-2013, 06:29 PM
This would leave that card open for some crazy abuse as you get costs reduced to 0 through dream dance for example.... not sure if that would be intended.

08-19-2013, 11:54 PM
This would leave that card open for some crazy abuse as you get costs reduced to 0 through dream dance for example.... not sure if that would be intended.
Right now it seems intended - it's not easy to get many 0 cost cards (especially in PvP), and the wording is clearly different between Dream Dance/Technical Genius and Archmage Wrenlocke; not to mention that Technical Genius' wording still doesn't indicate 1 is a minimum even after it was updated for Gencon.

08-20-2013, 07:44 AM
Reducing the cost to zero I'm sure will happen I'm questioning the intent of using the actual cost vs the cost paid as the buff. It seems casting cost would be the cost you paid to cast/play the card not the number printed on the card itself.

08-20-2013, 08:05 AM
It's tough to say. If we based it on Magic, it'd be the cost printed on the top left, as this is the cost of the card, even if it gets adjusted (ie. even if Technical Genius makes it cost 1 less to play, its actual cost is still whatever is on the top left - you're just getting a discount on that). A card that actually reduces that figure though, like Shrine of Prosperity or Buccaneer, would affect the actual figure though, and thus the boost.

But then, we don't actually have Hex rules. We can just make guesstimations based on Magic, which has heaps in common, especially rules wise.

08-20-2013, 03:29 PM
Also cards like Eye of Creations which cast the spells for free would still likely buff Jadiim. The fact that there are 2 distinctions around permanent cost reduction and casting for less suggests it will be the top right number - you could argue that use of the term casting cost over cost to cast supports this reading too since cost to cast would incorporate all reduction scenarios by setting the timing of the evaluation at the point it was cast.

08-21-2013, 02:18 AM
It dose change on cost why do i think this because on princess victoria if you reveal her she costs -3 and makes her 0 cost she then inspires troops with a cost of 1 and 2 if the number at the top left dident change to 0 how could she inspire troops?? that cost 1 ior 2 and remeber as this is not a paper tcg the number at top left can change :)

08-21-2013, 02:25 AM
Some cards do change the cost - things like Buccaneer, Time Ripple, Princess Victoria, Countermagic etc. actually do change the cost in the top left corner.

Cards like Dream Dance, Archmage Wrenlocke and Technical Genius don't change the cost; they simply change the amount of mana you need to pay. While it achieves a similar effect, the technical difference does mean some interactions work differently - such as this one with Jadiim.

Of course, this is all based on how Magic works (which most of Hex's rules are lining up with), so it's quite possible they'll do it differently.