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View Full Version : Card Preview: Blood Bearer and Hideous Conversion



Shaqattaq
08-23-2013, 03:25 PM
by Mike Rosenberg

The Shin’hare have taken over this week’s preview!

http://hextcg.com/card-previews-august-23/

Icepick
08-23-2013, 03:35 PM
Shroomkins! Wooo! Too bad we've already seen the Blood Bearer out of GenCon, but those Shroomkins are cool.

Commoble
08-23-2013, 03:37 PM
Not a big fan of that +1/+0 Resource icon in Hideous Conversion's effect text. It was a little hard to read.

Vengus
08-23-2013, 03:40 PM
EDIT: Combo doesn't work as well as I thought, didn't notice Pact of Pain has a mana cost associated with its draw effect.

I am worried about Hideous Conversion. Combine it with Blood Bearer, Pact of Pain, Adamanthian Scrivener and a whole bunch of other 1 cost troops and you potentially got yourself a quick way to thin the deck for cards like Sliver of the Immortal Spear for a quick win.

Get Scriveners/Blood Bearers, Pact of Pain and Hideous Conversion on the field, then start summoning the hordes of 1 cost creatures. You will get 1 lifepoint from Scrivener, then a second lifepoint from Blood Bearer when you sacrifice the troop. This will keep Pact of Pain fueled, while Hideous Conversion grants you the resources needed to keep summoning the 1 cost troops. Of course you will draw resources and other copies of Pact and Conversion aswell but you have plenty of leeway to sacrifice some extra life to draw through that with Pact of Pain. Not to mention that if you get extra Scriveners/Blood Bearers on the field and if their health gain stacks which each other you actually have a net gain of life.

So I wonder, is this loop intended?

Shadowelf
08-23-2013, 03:47 PM
Hideous conversion+lot of bunnies/cheap guys+life syphon=huge fun :)

or chlorophylia+hideous conversion+bunnies/cheap troops=giant eye of creation:)

teasel
08-23-2013, 03:50 PM
ritualist of the spring litter get you the mana each turn and let you keep the bunnies around... why would you use hideous conversion instead?

oh also i agree that the symbol for +1/+0 is too small/hard to read,i tought it was some sort of special effect at first

Shadowelf
08-23-2013, 04:01 PM
ritualist of the spring litter get you the mana each turn and let you keep the bunnies around... why would you use hideous conversion instead?

oh also i agree that the symbol for +1/+0 is too small/hard to read,i tought it was some sort of special effect at first

Because it only works with bunnies and being a troop is easier to remove

RuthlessSqueak
08-23-2013, 04:06 PM
Just posting to further reinforce the line of thought that the resource icon is too small and too hard to read, 2-3 times that size would work (though I think some type of icon with out a rectangle might be an even better approach).

ps. Both cards look rather fun.

Westane
08-23-2013, 04:07 PM
*Looks at Hideous Conversion*
ProsBloom!?

*Looks again*
Not ProsBloom...

*Goes back to bed*

the_artic_one
08-23-2013, 04:11 PM
Ritualist:
Costs 4 instead of 3
Has 2 wild threshold vs 1 blood
only works with bunnies vs any troops (workerbots come to mind)
Is attached to a 1/1 troop making it easier to remove

You can also do neat tricks with HC like using bone warrior to get 2 resources (sac it, then sac the pile of bones).

Turn 1: blood bearer
Turn 2: bone warrior
Turn 3: Hideous Conversion
Turn 4: sac blood bearer + bone warrior twice for 3 + 4 = 7 resources, play Urunaaz

An idealized situation but you get the point.

Leingod
08-23-2013, 04:17 PM
Hideous is harder to get rid of, easier to play, and offers synergy with all the blood shin hare sac bonuses. Right now the only quality ways to sac on demand would be boltpaw and, now, hideous. Personally I like hideous more because it opens more possibilities up even though the effect isn't as powerful as the revert from boltpaw. It also has very nice synergy with extinction as well as many creatures in blood for various reasons.

Agree with the 1/0 being hard to read though. I think they just need to figure out a better way to show gaining resources honestly.

As far as the whole pact+blood bearer+scrivener+hideous 'combo' goes, it seems much too fragile and the deck seems like it would have to be awful with how many 1 cost creatures it would need. I'd rather just do something like t2 runts>t3 hopper + hideous>t4 eye of creation for 5+. (Though how amazing eye of creation truly is depends on whether you can drop multiple shards for free using it.)

MoikPEI
08-23-2013, 04:19 PM
Not a big fan of that +1/+0 Resource icon in Hideous Conversion's effect text. It was a little hard to read.

It's going to be near impossible to read on an iPad (and especially on an iPad Mini) or other smaller 7" tablets.
I want to flag that as a strong concern too. :/

[Also, Hideous Conversion boots text typo; "sacrifieced"]

Shaqattaq
08-23-2013, 04:29 PM
Well, if that turns out to be a problem on Hideous Conversion, we'll make sure to not change it as we entrench ourselves on that hill and insist on dying on it ;)

Vorsa
08-23-2013, 04:54 PM
Drat! I was all set to rule out Shin'hare for being a capital E Evil race & sharing the colour with the monopoly on gross art (I like less intestine on display when playing :D), but as a TCG culture they are just so characterful & well put together...

The most exciting Shin'Hare aspect of Hideous Conversion has got to be that it's not a Basic Action!

Send a swarm of jobber minions against outnumbered forces of opponent > see which ones get blocked without managing to trade kills > sacrifice them before resolution > spend big in the casting phase after combat.

Ditto for creature killing spells etc. - though that only helps on your own turn or if the killing has a little extra spice to it (e.g. your card was going to be exiled, opponent was targeting it with deal x damage and gain x life).

Granted it costs 3 to cast, but in the long run it's got to be such an efficiency gain for aggressive decks and/or enabler of much bigger things from turns 4 or 5.

+ Is this the first card we've seen that can effortlessly bump off Claw of the Mountain God and comparable cards? (Inner Conflict can be so cruel.)
Another string to it's bow, then. :cool:

Mathaw
08-23-2013, 05:19 PM
It's going to be near impossible to read on an iPad (and especially on an iPad Mini) or other smaller 7" tablets.
I want to flag that as a strong concern too. :/

[Also, Hideous Conversion boots text typo; "sacrifieced"]

If its an retina ipad then if anything it'll be easier to read.

But regardless it is far too small.

jaxsonbatemanhex
08-23-2013, 05:41 PM
I should point out here that using Ritualist of the Spring Litter and using Hideous Conversion does not have to be mutually exclusive - you can use both.

Hideous Conversion is just awesome. While wild gives it the best surge-effect in Runts of the Litter (as well as Monika'shin for extra surge), even blood itself can get a 2 mana burst via Shin'hare High Born, and sapphire and ruby get access to 3 charge troop champs if they feel the desire to get burst mana.

Worst case scenario? A control deck can use it to pump out a turn 4 Extinction if need be - and given that their troop wouldn't be around anyway after the Extinction, there's no downside to that.

While it's nowhere near as straightforward as just casting a Dark Ritual or Rite of Flame, it certainly has potential.

Gorgol
08-23-2013, 05:41 PM
why is the resource icon thingy so small? Other than that I think Hideous Conversion may open up some looping/semi-looping potential.

jaxsonbatemanhex
08-23-2013, 05:45 PM
I am worried about Hideous Conversion. Combine it with Blood Bearer, Pact of Pain, Adamanthian Scrivener and a whole bunch of other 1 cost troops and you potentially got yourself a quick way to thin the deck for cards like Sliver of the Immortal Spear for a quick win.

Get Scriveners/Blood Bearers, Pact of Pain and Hideous Conversion on the field, then start summoning the hordes of 1 cost creatures. You will get 1 lifepoint from Scrivener, then a second lifepoint from Blood Bearer when you sacrifice the troop. This will keep Pact of Pain fueled, while Hideous Conversion grants you the resources needed to keep summoning the 1 cost troops. Of course you will draw resources and other copies of Pact and Conversion aswell but you have plenty of leeway to sacrifice some extra life to draw through that with Pact of Pain. Not to mention that if you get extra Scriveners/Blood Bearers on the field and if their health gain stacks which each other you actually have a net gain of life.

So I wonder, is this loop intended?
Pact of Pain costs 2 mana to activate, which you also have to account for. 4 extra cards to account for the life loss (2 lifegain troops, sacrificial troop and Hideous Conversion) isn't really worth it. Far easier to run Warlock Inquisitor with a lifegain gem instead.

Vengus
08-23-2013, 06:51 PM
Pact of Pain costs 2 mana to activate, which you also have to account for. 4 extra cards to account for the life loss (2 lifegain troops, sacrificial troop and Hideous Conversion) isn't really worth it. Far easier to run Warlock Inquisitor with a lifegain gem instead.
The Idea behind the combo is not to gain life, it's to rapidly go through a player's own deck to find various win cards like Sliver. Also Bearer and Scrivener serve the same role, you don't need exactly 1 Bearer and 1 Scrivener on the field for it to work. 2 Bearers or 2 Scriveners work fine aswell. You essentially have 8 targets instead of 4 for the selfheal part of the combo, which only makes it more consistent. On top of that you can use the champion Herczeg to get some extra draw power if the player is missing Pact of Pain. Of course there will be times one doesn't draw all the pieces he/she needs, but that's the risk of any deck that relies on combos. All I can say is that if someone does get the pieces together, and there's a reasonable chance they will, the opponent is a goner on turn 6, and that's fast, compared to the twitch matches.

The_Wine_Gnat
08-23-2013, 07:06 PM
Am I missing something about Hideous Monstrosity? It has no text, does 0/0, with an X cost? No one has mentioned this...

Also, the Hideous Conversion text really needs to be redone. It took me several minutes to try to guess what it said with the awkward symbol. Keep in mind I'm new to CCGs. If it confuses me instantly, it probably will confuse many other new players as well.

Karokoram
08-23-2013, 07:10 PM
Am I missing something about Hideous Monstrosity? It has no text, does 0/0, with an X cost? No one has mentioned this...

Also, the Hideous Conversion text really needs to be redone. It took me several minutes to try to guess what it said with the awkward symbol. Keep in mind I'm new to CCGs. If it confuses me instantly, it probably will confuse many other new players as well.

Hideous Monstrosity is made by the effect of one of Hideous Conversion's equipment, it will have power equal to how many creatures have been sac'd to Hideous Conversion.

MoikPEI
08-23-2013, 07:50 PM
[Edit: Ooops, already said.]

Leingod
08-23-2013, 07:52 PM
The Idea behind the combo is not to gain life, it's to rapidly go through a player's own deck to find various win cards like Sliver. Also Bearer and Scrivener serve the same role, you don't need exactly 1 Bearer and 1 Scrivener on the field for it to work. 2 Bearers or 2 Scriveners work fine aswell. You essentially have 8 targets instead of 4 for the selfheal part of the combo, which only makes it more consistent. On top of that you can use the champion Herczeg to get some extra draw power if the player is missing Pact of Pain. Of course there will be times one doesn't draw all the pieces he/she needs, but that's the risk of any deck that relies on combos. All I can say is that if someone does get the pieces together, and there's a reasonable chance they will, the opponent is a goner on turn 6, and that's fast, compared to the twitch matches.

The problem is you still are missing 1 mana per card drawn not even including the mana to keep playing creature drops since hideous gives 1 mana and pact costs 2 to activate. Pact + bearer + hideous certainly has some synergy, but it isn't on par with the traditional mtg combo type stuff, especially without the tutor power that is available in magic.

BlackRoger
08-24-2013, 01:27 AM
While the sliver searching idea is not ideal, I think it could be decent as an alternate win condition.
Add in a paladin which can get multiple power ups per turn, use charge bots which can cycle and let you splash ragefire, and maybe this can be a decent deck.

Edit: ok ragefire is 2 red threshold, may not be as viable as I thought.

Vengus
08-24-2013, 02:47 AM
The problem is you still are missing 1 mana per card drawn not even including the mana to keep playing creature drops since hideous gives 1 mana and pact costs 2 to activate. Pact + bearer + hideous certainly has some synergy, but it isn't on par with the traditional mtg combo type stuff, especially without the tutor power that is available in magic.
Hmm you're right, I thought it was only 2 health you had to pay, seems they added the cost sometime or I simply missed it. That does pretty much kill the combo yes. =/

Mathaw
08-24-2013, 05:25 AM
Also, the Hideous Conversion text really needs to be redone. It took me several minutes to try to guess what it said with the awkward symbol. Keep in mind I'm new to CCGs. If it confuses me instantly, it probably will confuse many other new players as well.

I'm familiar with the mechanic, but without zooming in and squinting I still had no idea what it was. For this stuff clarity is the key, I'm a designer and even I think it's overdesigned. The numbers don't need chrome.

On a positive note though, these cards look fun :) Set 1 is shaping up amazingly, so bravo to those involved.

The_Wine_Gnat
08-24-2013, 01:33 PM
Hideous Monstrosity is made by the effect of one of Hideous Conversion's equipment, it will have power equal to how many creatures have been sac'd to Hideous Conversion.

Oh that's pretty cool then! Thanks for clarifying.

jaxsonbatemanhex
08-27-2013, 02:02 AM
Hmm you're right, I thought it was only 2 health you had to pay, seems they added the cost sometime or I simply missed it. That does pretty much kill the combo yes. =/
Just to confirm, it has always worked like this. ;-)

Vengus
08-27-2013, 04:00 AM
Just to confirm, it has always worked like this. ;-)
Yeah I looked back at the first twitch stream and the 2 was there. Good thing they changed the cost symbol to something more visible.