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Gulbech
09-14-2013, 08:54 AM
The discussion about mana flood had me thinking, about some way to reduce the problem if you get mana flooded. We already get a little bonus from our charge power, but another solution could be making some shards have a dual purpose.

Each colour should have a shard, that works as usual except two things.
1. When you play them, you wont receive the resource until start of next turn.
2. Discard this card from your hand, to play this card as a quick action to xxxxxx (depending on colour)

Wild: target creature gets +1/+1until end of turn
Blood: target creature gets -2/-0 until end of turn
Diamond: target creature gets lifegain until end of turn
Ruby: deal 1 damage to target creature or player
Sapphire: target creature gets flight until end of turn

So you have the choice to sacrifice a resource for a small gain, if you get mana flooded. But the shard will have the drawback of not giving the resource right away. Of course this has to be balanced, but more the idea i want to discuss.

Zygon
09-14-2013, 09:14 AM
Make it an uncommon, and yeah I could see it. Magic has had much better land, but since in this game, resources are not physical, discarding them as a quickplay and getting the mana later is a pretty good alternative.

Maphalux
09-14-2013, 09:27 AM
I like this idea as long as they are non-basics that you can only have four of in a deck at max like the shards of fate.

keldrin
09-14-2013, 10:09 AM
I like this idea as long as they are non-basics that you can only have four of in a deck at max like the shards of fate.

I agree with that. Something nice to add some diversity in deck options. But not so abundant you are making entire deck concepts around it.

Gulbech
09-14-2013, 10:53 AM
My intention was of course that they are non basic, everything should be except the normal shards for each colour. So topic can have 4 of each colour shards in your deck. But will slow you down.

Aradon
09-14-2013, 11:26 AM
There was a cycle of non-basic lands in MtG's Zendikar set that was similar to this. Thoughts on your idea: the ability should be at basic-action speed. This way the complexity is lowered. Resources are played at basic speed, so the alternate option for the source card should also be at basic speed. I'd also suggest having them use the resource-drop, so that you can't play two or three 'free' spells all at once. There should still be a cost associated with the card.

For reference: http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Search/Default.aspx?action=advanced&set=|[%22Zendikar%22]&type=+[%22Land%22]+![%22Basic%22]&rarity=|[C]
Notice how they're actually still lands themselves, but add value even if you don't need the resource or color later in the game.

Rycajo
09-14-2013, 03:21 PM
I approve of something along these lines. I'm sure CZE has many, many awesome ideas for non-basic resources. For some cost (remove instant resource/ perm resource/ charge champion/ threshold) the shard can do something different. Pain resources, multi-colored resources, troop mimic resources; the world (of Entrath) is their oyster.

Could you see a shard that gives you this?

0/1 resources
1 wild threshold
0 charge
Put a Battle Hopper into play.

Yubar
09-15-2013, 07:02 PM
I dont think thats bad at all rycajo. Might be okay if it was optionally just a 1/1 resource too? good idea tho

noragar
09-16-2013, 09:19 AM
I dont think thats bad at all rycajo. Might be okay if it was optionally just a 1/1 resource too? good idea tho

This would not be okay because then it would be mandatory for any deck that includes that shard to include 4 of these to replace vanilla resources. If a resource does something to make it better than a basic resource (even if using that something is optional), then it needs to also have some potential drawback that would make it inferior to the basic resource.

Yubar
09-16-2013, 10:30 AM
You're right because that optionaility would require some sort of premium, at the very least a loss of 1 life. I guess 0/1 resource is fair (though the fact that it does not charge your champ is a drawback)

Would the optionality premium be paid at a loss of 1 life and the fact it doesn't charge your champ?

Kilo24
09-16-2013, 11:40 AM
The OP is an interesting idea. I'd like the general idea as options (subject to playtests and balancing, of course). No charge, forcing a choice between the effects, and giving interesting resources to monoshard decks is quite good; the biggest worry I have is that those are instant speed combat tricks and as such the mere possibility of playing against them can bog down the game significantly. Putting them to basic speed is probably a safer idea.



0/1 resources
1 wild threshold
0 charge
Put a Battle Hopper into play.

That strikes me as a rather overpowered card. Consider that Monika'shen (the Wild Shin'hare champion)'s power is to put a Battle Hopper into play and it costs 3 charges. This card makes one immediately without it being your champion's power *and* gives a resource next turn on top of it. It's enough that I could see running it in an otherwise monoblood Shin'hare deck just for the free Battle Hoppers. If this is to be a line of cards, then they need to be a lot weaker.

zadies
09-16-2013, 11:49 AM
Wouldn't nessicarily need to be weaker but would definitely need threshold requirements and not provide any threshold themselves.

Aradon
09-16-2013, 11:50 AM
That strikes me as a rather overpowered card. Consider that Monika'shen (the Wild Shin'hare champion)'s power is to put a Battle Hopper into play and it costs 3 charges. This card makes one immediately without it being your champion's power *and* gives a resource next turn on top of it. It's enough that I could see running it in an otherwise monoblood Shin'hare deck just for the free Battle Hoppers. If this is to be a line of cards, then they need to be a lot weaker.

That card's actually an identical card to one from MtG. It didn't see a whole lot of play, and Hex seems to be a bit higher in power level than MtG in many cases. Missing your resource for the turn is a huge deal, and I would say it's a pretty fairly-balanced card right now.

Kilo24
09-16-2013, 02:40 PM
I presume you mean Khalni Garden? I will say that Plant is not a particularly significant creature type as far as tribal decks go, unlike Shin'hare is designed to be. And that there are many more lands that enter play tapped which are jockeying for deck space in MTG than there are in Hex.

Still, you do make a good point.

Rycajo
09-16-2013, 11:07 PM
My example shard was just a quick idea off the top of my head. The loss of temporary resource is pretty big, as mentioned by Aradon.

What I find interesting is the resources in Hex have multiple things going for them over Magic lands:


Additional benefit (charge) - thus a new expectation to play with. Basic shards give 4 things whereas typical Magic lands only provide 3 (immediate mana, renewed mana, mana color)
The Threshold provided can immediately be used by other resources - whereas color fixing come-into-play-tapped lands will fix color, but are much slower
The digital nature of the resources allows many things to be created when the shard is used - for example, the OP mentions many quick actions that could be performed with the resource. In Hex, playing the shard could give you some minor benefit (perhaps only 1 of the 4 usual things), and create a card and add it to your hand. That card could be a 0 cost quick action similar to the things the OP suggested.


The interesting thing about building a deck with this type of non-basic shard would be the limit on playing one shard a turn. You could theoretically have some powerful shards, but the shard might not give you a permanent resource - slowing your ascending resource total. A player would have to decide the correct balance for including these unique and interesting shards.