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WWKnight
10-15-2013, 03:48 AM
I have not been able to play due to the card database not showing my cards, and I realised I have another alpha ready account and figured id give that a try.

However, I forget the password associated with the email address that I made to make the second account, and I foolishly didnt set up password retrieval options.

Is there someone I can talk to about getting the alpha code sent to my main email address? I dont want the two accounts merged, I just want to be able to access the second one.

Shadowelf
10-15-2013, 03:52 AM
Try to contact them directly here http://www.cryptozoic.com/contact-us

hammer
10-15-2013, 04:52 AM
I have not been able to play due to the card database not showing my cards, and I realised I have another alpha ready account and figured id give that a try.

However, I forget the password associated with the email address that I made to make the second account, and I foolishly didnt set up password retrieval options.

Is there someone I can talk to about getting the alpha code sent to my main email address? I dont want the two accounts merged, I just want to be able to access the second one.

Is this password for the account which you had pledge to give away for the Pro Player Utopian Chaos Giveaway then later reneged on living the "winner" without his prize??

WWKnight
10-15-2013, 03:45 PM
No, cause that account would be a pro tier, which cant enter yet. Keep up.

ANd I didnt pledge it, Utopian Chaos did, that is Ashenor, Machine and I. And since Ashenor and Machine kicked me out of Utopian Chaos, I am not responsible to give away my possessions to anyone.

Its like I work for Ford, I tell someone they won a car, I get fired from Ford, and then that person expects me to deliver a car.

EDIT: Thanks Shadowelf :)

DataDragon
10-16-2013, 04:18 PM
Can you PM me the details of the two accounts so that I can have a look?
No promises, but if I can find a way to verify, I'll see what I can do.

Stok3d
10-16-2013, 08:42 PM
Its like I work for Ford, I tell someone they won a car, I get fired from Ford, and then that person expects me to deliver a car.


I'm confused, is the account you are referring to WWKnight the one in which you had Cory draw a name from a hat at the Dragon Lord Dinner on video as a contest to give that Tier to the lucky draw?

Velorath
10-17-2013, 03:24 AM
No, cause that account would be a pro tier, which cant enter yet. Keep up.

ANd I didnt pledge it, Utopian Chaos did, that is Ashenor, Machine and I. And since Ashenor and Machine kicked me out of Utopian Chaos, I am not responsible to give away my possessions to anyone.

Its like I work for Ford, I tell someone they won a car, I get fired from Ford, and then that person expects me to deliver a car.

EDIT: Thanks Shadowelf :)

That analogy doesn't really hold up though. First off, you'd be Henry Ford in this analogy, not just some guy who worked for Ford. You formed Utopian Chaos. When the contest was announced, you were the one who announced it and said it was an extra pro-tier that you bought that was being given away. Every article that further clarified the rules had your name on it. You were present and still part of Utopian Chaos when the winner was announced, and you subsequently posted up an article announcing the winner. At that point you should have no longer considered the pro-tier yours. It was the contest winner's property which you later claim to have sold out of necessity, while somehow being able to afford to keep your own property, a Dragon Lord and a Grand King account.

I'm sure next time a community member approaches Crypto about participating in or helping promote any contests like this in the future they're going to be pretty reluctant as a direct result of this.

WWKnight
10-17-2013, 07:31 AM
Yes. You are absolutely correct.

I am a horrible, evil little troll.

Best flame me, it stops my regeneration cycle.

Falaris
10-17-2013, 11:05 AM
Edit: Fair enough

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 11:12 AM
No, he was kicked out first. You've no idea what you're talking about. I have a huge post about this I'm trying very hard not to post because it's not my place. But I at least know what happened and do not stick my nose in other peoples business unless I have some modicum of knowledge of the situation.

Falaris
10-17-2013, 11:17 AM
Edit: Fair enough

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 11:20 AM
.

Rycajo
10-17-2013, 11:37 AM
Hey there, Rycajo here. Contest winner (and later loser).

Let's leave off WWKnight a bit here. He may have made some bad choices that will cost him reputation in the Hex community, but he isn't an evil guy. He had a falling out with other leaders in Utopian Chaos, which he helped found. Along with this falling out he felt he didn't need to fulfill his part of the giveaway. As far as bad breaks go, I can understand his thinking. He was giving up a very valuable item in order to promote a community - but he was no longer part of that community. In fact, he was probably quite upset about the whole issue and would want to stick it to the other leaders. But this kind of action has other consequences. I told him he had sold his honor. I still believe that and some of this community seem to agree and are giving him a hard time.

As I related to him a while back, I felt very similar to Velorath about the ownership and transfer of the promised PPT. Once it was promised he shouldn't have considered it his own. Once the falling out happened, he should have followed through with the goods, but sought recompense from the other leaders (who would still benefit from the promotion) for the value.

I think he should fix the problem, not try to defend his actions. In fact, I believe (albeit somewhat selfishly) he should do what is needed to get the PPT back from his roommate, then work out a trade with Utopian Chaos. He would regain the reputation, Utopian Chaos would get the promotion, and CZE wouldn't regret their first participation in community giveaways. We can all be winners.

ossuary
10-17-2013, 12:44 PM
I also happen to know what happened, and people would probably be more likely to give WWKnight a break if it weren't his own actions and deceptions that directly led to the rift and eventual splitting up of the UC founders. Whether he originally paid for that pro player tier himself isn't really relevant - he made a commitment to give it as a prize, and later reneged. That's dirty, plain and simple. Like Rycajo said, he shouldn't have felt he had the right to give or sell it to someone else, and if he really felt he was owed anything for it, Machine and Ashenor almost certainly would have paid him the $250 back just to be done with it (and so they could properly award the prize).

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 12:55 PM
That's bs OSS. There was one reason why his pp was up for grabs. It was his website that offered it. It would benefit his interests. When he got banned from his own forums so machine could villainise him all bets were off. He lost his website. He lost his guild. He started that stuff and it was taken. The people that ended up with UC should be responsible for its promises. Not the person who already got screwed.

WWknight had put up the most content, even during an extended cross country move he was putting up content. His friends knew where he was and why. Anyone that looks at the amount of content he had on that site should see through that bs hack job about him not pulling his weight.

HyenaNipples
10-17-2013, 01:05 PM
I feel this thread is toeing the line of pointless gossip. It's certainly well over the line of relevance by now.

Rycajo
10-17-2013, 01:05 PM
I also happen to know what happened, and people would probably be more likely to give WWKnight a break if it weren't his own actions and deceptions that directly led to the rift and eventual splitting up of the UC founders.

Lets not finger point about fault for the rift and split. It happened. Name calling, intrigue, and blame games won't help anybody. I am not privy to all of the messages and events that led up to the chaos within Utopian Chaos. I cannot judge fault, I can only choose how I will interact with the involved individuals in the future.

As far as that goes, the remaining UC leaders and WWKnight have separately offered some condolences and some rewards. I haven't accepted any rewards yet as none have been what I was promised (far from it). In the end I will be okay without a PPT. The missing PPT is a sad consequence, but the real pity is that of multiple human beings less than fully humane toward each other. But I am hoping people can come together, be honorable and just, and work things out.

ossuary
10-17-2013, 01:06 PM
I wasn't referring to the accusation of him not pulling his weight. I don't particularly want to get into this publicly, but I'm perfectly happy to discuss it with you further if you want. I'm honestly not trying to villainize him, either, I just think he should make good on his commitment because it's the right thing to do.

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 01:16 PM
I think it's UC's commitment. Not his.

WWKnight
10-17-2013, 03:40 PM
Lock tread please -_-

And Ryjaco, you are a really great person, and so sorry events unfolded as they did.

Velorath
10-17-2013, 04:16 PM
No, he was kicked out first. You've no idea what you're talking about. I have a huge post about this I'm trying very hard not to post because it's not my place. But I at least know what happened and do not stick my nose in other peoples business unless I have some modicum of knowledge of the situation.

Both sides have posted their side of the story elsewhere. The only people who know what happened are those directly involved. You or I may believe one side more than another, but really all of that is neither here nor there anyway.

http://www.digitaltcg.com/utopian-chaos-dragon-lord-dinner/

I'm not sure how you can say he was kicked out first when he posted an article up after the drawing on UC's website announcing the winner.

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 05:26 PM
The post I was responding to posited that he was kicked out because he refused to hand over the pro player, which was patently false that quote is out of context.

lamaros
10-17-2013, 06:26 PM
By any measure offering a contest and then failing to deliver on it is poor form.

That he later was removed from the group that he was associated with when offering the contest is immaterial, the contest reward was owed before then.

If you and me go into business and I start promising things we have to people on the side, then I fail to deliver and take those things with me when leaving the business then it makes no sense to make you owe them.

Or, at least, it makes no sense for you to own them without first taking them back off me.

It's a clear dick move. And trying to waddle about saying "oops, sorry they happened how they did" doesn't cover the fact that WWKnight is responsible for them happening like they did. You don't get a pass from acting like a dick by saying "sorry things turned out dickish" - that's not even a personal apology that accepts responsibility.

Zomnivore
10-17-2013, 06:37 PM
So, it sounds like UC didn't honor the contest, and if in the fine print they didn't state that they could revoke the prize for any reason....then they're still liable to offer a prize.

So...as far as liability goes, it looks like its not just him at fault. If it wasn't really binding that he'd be the one to offer the reward, then I don't see much you can do.

As much as holding people's feet to fire goes. Sounds like a case of "best left alone".

Also the hex forums...aren't the best place to hash this out.

Velorath
10-17-2013, 06:58 PM
This isn't the best place to get into the guild drama. However the contest was very publicly advertised here, was mentioned in one of the kickstarter updates, and they got a Cory to publicly draw the winner's name as well. As something that could potentially poison the well for future contests like it, I think it's important that the situation is resolved and that the community the contest was targeted to sees that it's properly resolved.

Gwaer
10-17-2013, 08:32 PM
If I am part of a company, and I on behalf of my company say it will provide something to you, A service, a gift, anything. And then come time to provide said service or product I am no longer affiliated with that company, it is not my personal responsibility to provide that thing. It is the company on whose behalf I was offering it. I don't know what else needs to be said about it.

Dralon
10-17-2013, 09:21 PM
This has been discussed in other, more appropriate, venues, and the matter has been put to rest as best it can by all the partys involved, with fault on both sides. I would humbly ask a moderator to lock and or delete this thread as the first few posts relevant to alpha have been dealt with.

Velorath
10-17-2013, 10:13 PM
I disagree. Again, when the contest was going well and you guys were getting good publicity this was apparently a good venue to discuss it in. Now that things have fallen through and people have broken their promises, all of a sudden this isn't the right place to talk about it now? The people on these boards are the ones the contest was aimed at, and I don't think trying to swiftly sweep what happened under the rug so as to avoid any potential blemishes to your reputations is the best way to handle it. The people involved on both sides should be making a thread here to formally apologize, not trying to get threads shut down for talking about it.

Quasari
10-17-2013, 11:10 PM
If I am part of a company, and I on behalf of my company say it will provide something to you, A service, a gift, anything. And then come time to provide said service or product I am no longer affiliated with that company, it is not my personal responsibility to provide that thing. It is the company on whose behalf I was offering it. I don't know what else needs to be said about it.

It depends on how the company exists. If its not a separate legal entity(such as a corporation), there would still be liability legally.

Any who, Rycajo says cool it, so let's leave the discussion at that.

Dralon
10-17-2013, 11:14 PM
This can only degenerate into a "He said, She said" scenario here however. These events occurred well over 1 month ago, so nothing has been swept under a rug. Those who are interested can see details from one side on our forums in our Everything Else section in which we talk about the WebSite change, which has been publicly visible for the last month. Those who know WWK can certainly get his side from him. Then it comes down to what one's personal opinion is, and what parts of the "truth" those on the outside wish to believe. Anyone is welcome to PM me, Ashenor or Machine at any time with questions. Those who have been owed apologies over the way things turned out, namely all those involved in our community on our forums, and Rycajo in particular, have been offered them. I have no hard feelings towards anyone, as things happen.

Alpha forums are however the wrong place to discuss this.

WWKnight
10-17-2013, 11:53 PM
Ive already admitted to being an evil troll. Let's just leave it at that and move on please.

SilverDirewolf
10-19-2013, 12:19 AM
While not a perfect solution, as Crypto were atleast partially affiliated with the contest, and seeing as the prize fell through for whatever reason, would it not be easy enough for them to just reward the winner with a Pro Player Tier?

I know THEY never offered it, and it's not THEIR problem, but it would be a way to stop the bad blood and arguments, before the game is even out. It's a virtual game, and all the PPT boons are digital things, so it wouldn't "cost" them anything. It'd also be seen as a very kind, selfless gesture on their part.

hammer
10-19-2013, 12:37 AM
While not a perfect solution, as Crypto were atleast partially affiliated with the contest, and seeing as the prize fell through for whatever reason, would it not be easy enough for them to just reward the winner with a Pro Player Tier?

I know THEY never offered it, and it's not THEIR problem, but it would be a way to stop the bad blood and arguments, before the game is even out. It's a virtual game, and all the PPT boons are digital things, so it wouldn't "cost" them anything. It'd also be seen as a very kind, selfless gesture on their part.

A better suggestion would be for Cryptozoic to assign the original Pro Player Account (pledged by WKKnight) to the winner. WKKnight even consented to this during the giveaway.

In the comment section of the article announcing the giveaway Luke Aka WKKnight stated "The account will be yours. CZE are helping us transfer the ownership. :) "

http://www.digitaltcg.com/utopian-chaos-pro-tier-hex-giveaway/

WKKnight was certainly a member of Utopian Chaos when the draw took place and when the prize winner was announced. He even wrote an article 17th August to announce the winner who was drawn from the bread basket at the DragonLord Dinner. "A big congratulations to Rycajo, who won a Pro Tier!"

http://www.digitaltcg.com/utopian-chaos-dragon-lord-dinner/

Regardless of what happened to Utopian Chaos after this date, this competition was done and dusted the winner identified and the account transferred in spirit at the point of the article on the 17th August.

Prism
10-22-2013, 01:49 AM
Lynch him, boys! He didn't give out the loots!