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DanTheMeek
03-22-2014, 07:57 PM
Is is just a random minor buff suggestion post, but while looking at Inner Conflict the thought occurred to me that the card might be a little more interesting if it was a quick action. For those that don't know, Inner conflict is the Hex equivalent of Pacifism (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370812), a 2 cost enchantment spell (so can only be casted when you could cast a basic action in hex), only instead of being removed by revert effects Pacifism (http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=370812) is removed by enchantment hate or the troops death. Despite seemingly being largely a wash do to the amount of revert effects in the game, CZE felt they wanted their Pacifism to be a little more expensive, and bumped it to 3, which is all well and good (the more things about hex versions of MTG cards that differ them from the original the better I say) but it does feel to me like it may make the card a little over priced now and that it could benefit from something really minor being thrown its way to justify its use over (or in addition to) Repel and Solitary Exile (aka The Box as I refer to it with my hex buddies) which feel like more powerful removal to begin with. With this in mind I propose changing Inner Conflict from a basic action to a quick action. This would allow you to use it in response to the opponent ending their main phase 1 or during their end phase after they've summoned stuff for their turn, both of which can be advantageous times to be able to cast this spell over only during your own main phases. At the end of the day its still Pacifism for 3 instead of 2, but I think tossing it that bone could be enough to make it a more appealing option.

Again, just a random thought, all thoughts negative or positive appreciated, my feelings won't be hurt if everyone things its a terrible idea.

Zomnivore
03-22-2014, 10:19 PM
I think its unacceptable for it to be better. Thematically and balance wise you need downsides to differentiate the themes. If it was a quick action I'd argue it would be almost better then murder. Some do some things better and more efficiently. Removal is something diamond is supposed to do less well then other colors.

Showsni
03-23-2014, 08:30 AM
Pacifism is removed by bounce, blink effects, death + return to hand, death + reanimation, enchantment destruction and permanent destruction. Inner Conflict survives all of those; it even survives shuffle into deck and redraw! Yes, Reversion stops it; but Reversion effects seem to be very rarely maindecked. Inner Conflict is, I'd say, quite possibly better than Pacifism as is.


Removal is something diamond is supposed to do less well then other colors.

Actually, Diamond is probably one of the best at removal, if not the best. It has Inner Conflict, Solitary Exile and Repel, as well as Judgement for a potential one sided Wrath effect.

Zomnivore
03-23-2014, 03:27 PM
Actually, Diamond is probably one of the best at removal, if not the best. It has Inner Conflict, Solitary Exile and Repel, as well as Judgement for a potential one sided Wrath effect.

Its not specifically about it being worse, but more towards it being bad in a thematically consistent way.

Its removal is slightly more defensive, and sorta janky because it can be removed with revert or other sorts of removal like voiding after the fact.

Lonenut
03-23-2014, 08:22 PM
Yeah, the impact of not being able to bounce creatures back to hand to remove negative effects is HUGE in this game. People very rarely run disenchant effects in competitive Magic, but bounce effects are a pretty decent cure for this sort of thing.

I've been floored a couple times by how much of an impact this "permanent alteration of cards" thing is during games. The fact that tokens go to the graveyard, for instance, is one of the most significant changes that has a hidden importance you might not notice.

mightjustaswell
03-23-2014, 10:19 PM
Yeah for this reason I never really took a second look at boltpaw wizard but that 1 resource/troop revert is such a boon for wild/blood.

knightofeffect
03-25-2014, 08:35 AM
I think the primary take-away from this thread is: Reversion effects are vastly underrated. I have drafted Reversion in diamond several times, and at worst, it gets crucial 1-for-1s, it has even 3-for-1'd.

Lonenut
03-25-2014, 01:22 PM
Can you explain how reversion interacts for effective trades and damage removal?

Xenavire
03-25-2014, 01:27 PM
Can you explain how reversion interacts for effective trades and damage removal?

Revert currently reverts a troop to it's basic form - including health. So any damage would be reset up to the standard defence on the card.

Lonenut
03-25-2014, 01:38 PM
Can you revert after a creature has been assigned lethal, or can you only do it while the creature has non-lethal on it before further damage is applied to take it to lethal?

I can't think of too many instances where a creature has, say, combat damage sitting on it at non-lethal and a finisher instant comes in. It certainly happens, but not so much that I'd rely on reversion to save anything.

Xenavire
03-25-2014, 01:41 PM
Can you revert after a creature has been assigned lethal, or can you only do it while the creature has non-lethal on it before further damage is applied to take it to lethal?

I can't think of too many instances where a creature has, say, combat damage sitting on it at non-lethal and a finisher instant comes in. It certainly happens, but not so much that I'd rely on reversion to save anything.

You can only revert before lethal, not after. And there is the whole swiftstrike deal to consider.

knightofeffect
03-25-2014, 02:41 PM
Can you revert after a creature has been assigned lethal, or can you only do it while the creature has non-lethal on it before further damage is applied to take it to lethal?

I can't think of too many instances where a creature has, say, combat damage sitting on it at non-lethal and a finisher instant comes in. It certainly happens, but not so much that I'd rely on reversion to save anything.

You gotta open your mind man =P. The key is reverting their troops that have been buffed and/or inspired. (although reverting during a swiftstrike/regular strike double block has happened a few times too)

I have reverted troops after they have been wild growth'd resulting in a 2 for 1 and broad presence where they were expecting to 1 for 1 with board presence. I have reverted so many inspired troops I have lost count, reverted the hell outta troops that have been aura'd (esp ruby), reverted honeycaps all over the place. Reverting an inner conflicted troop of my own to throw off the math and swing for the win or a critical block isn't rare either. Oh you put 3 combat damage on my Boulder Brute and are now trying to burn it? Reverted into a 2 for 1.

I can't think of a single time in draft when I have drawn reversion where it was a completely dead card and several times I was looking to rip a reversion or mantis or the like.

Its high quality stuff =).