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darkwonders
04-26-2014, 06:14 PM
Would there be any way to implement an option to upgrade the free weekly booster draft to a sealed deck tournament by supplying 3 of our own boosters? That would allow a bit more variety for those who may get bored w/ the booster draft after a few weeks and would like to change it up every once in a while.

I also know I'm not the only person sitting on a couple hundred booster packs to use for this.

Yoss
04-26-2014, 09:35 PM
Interesting idea. Makes sense to me!

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 10:20 PM
I LOVE it, or maybe use a previous weekly draft and a current week for a sealed. I LOVE it. It helps those on vacation or whatever. Let me skip my weekly draft for a sealed the next week. OMG AMAZING! Perhaps just let the weekly bank ONLY for use in sealed....OMG Im gonna cry I like it so much

darkwonders
04-26-2014, 10:40 PM
I LOVE it, or maybe use a previous weekly draft and a current week for a sealed. I LOVE it. It helps those on vacation or whatever. Let me skip my weekly draft for a sealed the next week. OMG AMAZING! Perhaps just let the weekly bank ONLY for use in sealed....OMG Im gonna cry I like it so much

Turning 2 weekly Booster drafts in a semi-weekly sealed would be interesting. Probably a bit more complicated to implement as tickets are set to expire every week.

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 10:49 PM
Turning 2 weekly Booster drafts in a semi-weekly sealed would be interesting. Probably a bit more complicated to implement as tickets are set to expire every week.


Not too tough really. Just set an unused draft to .5 of a sealed. Anybody with a coding degree can do that in 30 minutes. Code testing with other modules will be another story....but still. I love your idea.

Gwaer
04-26-2014, 10:53 PM
I'm less keen on 2 tickets for a sealed, but I'm quite keen on bring 3 packs and a ticket to sealed.

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 11:12 PM
I'm less keen on 2 tickets for a sealed, but I'm quite keen on bring 3 packs and a ticket to sealed.

So whats the diff between the two in your head? Theres 6 packs entered into the game either way right?

GatticusFinch
04-26-2014, 11:23 PM
So whats the diff between the two in your head? Theres 6 packs entered into the game either way right?

The weekly ticket expires every week. It will be impossible to stack two of them.

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 11:29 PM
The weekly ticket expires every week. It will be impossible to stack two of them.


VERY easy to code. During beta, sure lots of other stuff to work on. But really its not a hard thing to design for release, or even open beta.

Expired unused ticket gets added to "Sealed only tourny" pool for its owner....very easy.

Gwaer
04-26-2014, 11:30 PM
Also, having to bring packs means they are getting those packs from somewhere, so ticket holders who want to play sealed would be assisting in taking unopened boosters out of the economy, rather than just purely creating them with their tickets.

.. If they don't actually go away when they expire that gets rid of the entire point of them expiring. They're supposed to be a use them or lose them perk, having them convert to another type of tournament on their expiration is not really an option.

I've been seeing this "it would be so easy to code argument" popping up a lot tonight. That is not the point, as an electronic artifice created by man, it can literally do anything, but it shouldn't necessarily do everything to the point of not making CZE money from over-generosity.

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 11:36 PM
Also, having to bring packs means they are getting those packs from somewhere, so ticket holders who want to play sealed would be assisting in taking unopened boosters out of the economy, rather than just purely creating them with their tickets.

And an unused ticket just removes the already allocated packs from the pool. Do you not think CZE has addressed the packs from the free drafters? All it does is delay the packs to the used pool by a week if you look at it logically. You CANNOT use a draft ticket in a sealed that was already used. It only delays the packs into the stream, doesnt add a single pack that CZE thought of. And it actually cuts down on packs if you think about it.

Gwaer
04-26-2014, 11:41 PM
...

...


......

I tried to see where you're coming from... But I couldnt... so I'm going to lay it out how I think you're wrong, and you're going to have to explain it to me how you aren't.

When you use a draft token, 3 packs are created for you to use in the draft, those packs can roll primals and you can end up with a primal pack, so instead of a normal person just taking 3 packs out of the economy, you created an additional 3 packs. Now all of those packs are opened, and you get the cards from them, then you win some more packs, so the situation moved from, X packs when into the draft Y packs came out as rewards, to X-draft ticket packs went into the draft, for Y rewards, so effectively you have created more packs in the system than would have been created if you hadn't used a draft ticket.

When a draft ticket expires, that person cannot create the packs that would have been made that week... That's pretty self explanatory I think.

Your turn.

Vibraxus
04-26-2014, 11:54 PM
...

...


......

I tried to see where you're coming from... But I couldnt... so I'm going to lay it out how I think you're wrong, and you're going to have to explain it to me how you aren't.

When you use a draft token, 3 packs are created for you to use in the draft, those packs can roll primals and you can end up with a primal pack, so instead of a normal person just taking 3 packs out of the economy, you created an additional 3 packs. Now all of those packs are opened, and you get the cards from them, then you win some more packs, so the situation moved from, X packs when into the draft Y packs came out as rewards, to X-draft ticket packs went into the draft, for Y rewards, so effectively you have created more packs in the system than would have been created if you hadn't used a draft ticket.

When a draft ticket expires, that person cannot create the packs that would have been made that week... That's pretty self explanatory I think.

Your turn.

First its my understanding that Drafts and Sealed will not make a primal. I read it somewhere, but I can be wrong....

Next. CZE knows how many "Draft for life" accounts they have sold and have factored that into their pack algorithm thing, if they didnt, they are idiots. And Im sure they also calculated some form of attrition of said draft for life people. So I skip my week of draft....CZE "earns" my draft fee that I didnt pay, and also doesnt have to dole out my 3 packs that week.....The next week I use 6 packs (last week plus this week) and use my entry fee (Last week unused plus this week) to join a sealed. So in all what did CZE lose over what they would have "Spent" had I drafted bth weeks? Not to mention what I could have won 2 weeks ina row compared to just a 1 week win?

Daer
04-26-2014, 11:58 PM
First its my understanding that Drafts and Sealed will not make a primal. I read it somewhere, but I can be wrong....



Draft and Sealed packs will generate Primals. That was the main reason for the switch from getting Primals when you open a pack to getting Primals when a pack is generated.

Gwaer
04-27-2014, 12:01 AM
The tickets will make primals, at least last I heard from an official CZE source.

...pack algorithm thing?

The issue is an economic one, not a technical one that CZE won't be able to make enough packs. Every free draft ticket is 3 packs and 3 chances at a primal that wasn't paid for. That has an effect on the card economy, the purpose of expiring tickets is to limit that. So letting them go into sealed, doesn't limit that.

To answer your question though, CZE lost 6 bucks from you not buying packs from them, or the economy lost the opportunity to shed 3 packs, and instead had the packs from the tournament payout added without the normal amount of packs being removed from the system.

Every draft ticket that expires is actually a good thing for the economy, and cze, and the game as a whole. Though it may be inconvenient, you're still getting basically unlimited value in the draft per life tier, and somewhere in the neighborhood of $364 worth of free packs and entry fees from the free draft for a year.



Draft and Sealed packs will generate Primals. That was the main reason for the switch from getting Primals when you open a pack to getting Primals when a pack is generated.

It was never primal on open, it was always primal on generation of a new pack, the change was that the primal pack no longer replaced the normal pack that was just created, but now was given in addition.

Vibraxus
04-27-2014, 12:02 AM
Draft and Sealed packs will generate Primals. That was the main reason for the switch from getting Primals when you open a pack to getting Primals when a pack is generated.

OK, sorry, I was wrong.
So what happens if my draft opens a primal? Is the primal in the draft, or is the primal added to my packs?

Gwaer
04-27-2014, 12:03 AM
it's added to your stash, same way the treasure chests from the three packs the ticket just created are added to your stash.

Daer
04-27-2014, 12:05 AM
It was never primal on open, it was always primal on generation of a new pack, the change was that the primal pack no longer replaced the normal pack that was just created, but now was given in addition.

Right, I knew that. I've just been reading too much general chat where half the people think you get primals from opening packs.

Vibraxus
04-27-2014, 12:08 AM
The tickets will make primals, at least last I heard from an official CZE source.

...pack algorithm thing?

The issue is an economic one, not a technical one that CZE won't be able to make enough packs. Every free draft ticket is 3 packs and 3 chances at a primal that wasn't paid for. That has an effect on the card economy, the purpose of expiring tickets is to limit that. So letting them go into sealed, doesn't limit that.

To answer your question though, CZE lost 6 bucks from you not buying packs from them, or the economy lost the opportunity to shed 3 packs, and instead had the packs from the tournament payout added without the normal amount of packs being removed from the system.

Every draft ticket that expires is actually a good thing for the economy, and cze, and the game as a whole. Though it may be inconvenient, you're still getting basically unlimited value in the draft per life tier, and somewhere in the neighborhood of $364 worth of free packs and entry fees from the free draft for a year.




It was never primal on open, it was always primal on generation of a new pack, the change was that the primal pack no longer replaced the normal pack that was just created, but now was given in addition.

OK, I get the primal thing now. My misunderstanding...
So would you agree to only allowing an unused free draft to be used the followin week as a sealed? Maybe let every free draft to be a 2 week exp date, and then its lost. That way it can be used as either a draft or in addition to another draft for a sealed? That way a draft cant be banked (For more than a week) and vacation people can still use it as an actual draft?

Gwaer
04-27-2014, 12:15 AM
I'm the wrong person to agree with you on that. I have taken a pretty hard line stance that CZE has already been far far too generous. That it's going to take a long time to recover from the amount of value we are already getting, and it might doom the game as is. But it's pretty much impossible to tell a gaming community "oops, we goofed, going to have to increase the cost of things". I think nothing that gives players more value should be done until maybe 6 months after launch, so they can get a good idea of their average users purchases and retention/capture rates. Then if they're sitting pretty, sure, do what you ask. Until then, I think it would be totally acceptable to bring an additonal 3 packs with your draft ticket to sealed and do that instead.

Vibraxus
04-27-2014, 12:24 AM
OK, I get the primal thing now. My misunderstanding...
So would you agree to only allowing an unused free draft to be used the followin week as a sealed? Maybe let every free draft to be a 2 week exp date, and then its lost. That way it can be used as either a draft or in addition to another draft for a sealed? That way a draft cant be banked (For more than a week) and vacation people can still use it as an actual draft?

Looks like you are replying to the OP here, but I have to goto bed.

I totally agree that these things can be added to the free drafters at a later date. Its just an option tht has been thrown out...and I added to.... and I think is a good way to spend the drafts.

I dont think its adding 3 packs to the system tho, its just delaying them. Well in my idea, the OP its really removing 3 packs from the system if you think about it.

As for CZE and inflow of cash....Dude I wouldnt have spent what I did for GK had I not thought they would kick ass. I spent a whole paycheck on this thing. PvE is where we will get players, and we NEED it to be out there when open beta hits. But anyway, Im ranting and need sleep.

darkwonders
04-27-2014, 08:48 AM
I spent GK + Pro :p so I have 2 Booster drafts a week I to use! Hence why I'd like to swap one out for a Sealed once in a while if I can provide my own packs for the difference. It's a win-win. More packs get used. More people are trying out different tournaments. And we don't get bored :)

Yoss
04-27-2014, 02:31 PM
I've said in another thread that a 10 day expiration would make more sense to me to allow for minor schedule variations (not big vacations or whatever). To Gwaer's worry about CZE being too nice, the suggestion of combining two tickets actually gives CZE back some value since the 100p entry fee from the second Draft ticket is forfeited in Sealed (you only need the first 100p, not both). In that sense, it's actually win-win, CZE gives out less free stuff, but players get more options.

Still, just letting a single draft ticket plus three packs work for Sealed sounds excellent to me. I would not use the other (double ticket) option, even if it was offered.

darkwonders
04-28-2014, 01:41 PM
I wonder how long it'd take to implement this. They do have to get the Tournament system stable first XD