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Phoenixfire
04-28-2014, 11:16 AM
I am a slacker backer and got 25 packs, I seem to be losing a lot even without mistakes and good strategies because so many people got 100+ packs and have better cards to work with.

I already spent 50 USD for access to a barely working game+ a few packs.

Do I now have to spend loads more to compete?

Not sure if im willing to.

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 11:19 AM
Playing limited when it's working will be a big help. Also, making some friends and playing pauper/fun decks with them rather than accepting games from people with full playsets at random.

Rapkannibale
04-28-2014, 11:25 AM
I am sorry you are having a bad experience. Competitive constructed play will require a heavy investment, that is the nature of the beast. However as Gwaer mentioned limited formats (sealed and draft) are much more wallet friendly because everyone starts at an even playing field and it comes down to mostly skill. So if you still have some packs left safe them for draft or sealed and if not play constructed more casually and then wait for draft tournaments to work again and invest a few bucks there.

Cory_Jones
04-28-2014, 11:34 AM
Also the hope is to get trading and auction house in very soon, that will also help you have access to cards... and hopefully build some fun decks at a more reasonable price. :)

Tathel
04-28-2014, 11:36 AM
Also the PvE 'free to play' portion of the game is not implemented yet in this closed beta. If you don't want to spend more money I think that will be the more MMO / PvE side. This is a closed beta so there will be issues and lack of features. By open beta things will be better. and then by release most of the features should be in.

The PvP portion that is currently implemented was always planned to be a market place using real money to play the TCG. If you don't want to put more money into the game the current state is probably not conducive to that. You'll probably want to wait until more of the F2P side is brought in. Or if you are ok spending some money but just not breaking the bank: drafting helps build your collection and is a competitive format in it's own right.

Also once trading is introduced it will be easier to build a specific deck because there will be options other then simply buying boosters

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 11:42 AM
Also the hope is to get trading and auction house in very soon, that will also help you have access to cards... and hopefully build some fun decks at a more reasonable price. :)
Cory makes a great point, once the AH is available you'll be able to buy singles from players which is way more cost efficient than cracking packs.

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 11:45 AM
Also the hope is to get trading and auction house in very soon, that will also help you have access to cards... and hopefully build some fun decks at a more reasonable price. :)

Please, a daily update would be nice for each next major feature. So with trading and the AH, a simple 'No delays today, things are looking good' would be great. Same when PvE is next in the queue, etc. Knowing what to expect, even in rough terms, is a godsend. :D

Poetic
04-28-2014, 12:07 PM
Once tournaments are back up, draft is definitely a good way to build up your collection while having fun in the process.

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 12:23 PM
If it'll make you feel betteri can start a thread and just post 'No delays today' in it every day for you Xen. It will accomplish basically the same thing, but not force a dev to have to.

Shaqattaq
04-28-2014, 12:31 PM
Please, a daily update would be nice for each next major feature. So with trading and the AH, a simple 'No delays today, things are looking good' would be great. Same when PvE is next in the queue, etc. Knowing what to expect, even in rough terms, is a godsend. :D

The unfortunate effect of something like this is that people begin making plans based on the information given, even if that information is given with the caveat of "we can't give anything specific at this time" or "this is subject to change." We prefer to give out information when it's solid and definite as opposed to a daily update that generally amounts to "still working on it."

BossHoss
04-28-2014, 12:38 PM
If it'll make you feel betteri can start a thread and just post 'No delays today' in it every day for you Xen. It will accomplish basically the same thing, but not force a dev to have to.

I would prefer cameras so I can check up on CZE like when I log onto the bridge traffic cameras on my phone ;p

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 12:39 PM
If it'll make you feel betteri can start a thread and just post 'No delays today' in it every day for you Xen. It will accomplish basically the same thing, but not force a dev to have to.

Please, it would entertain me immensely. :D



The unfortunate effect of something like this is that people begin making plans based on the information given, even if that information is given with the caveat of "we can't give anything specific at this time" or "this is subject to change." We prefer to give out information when it's solid and definite as opposed to a daily update that generally amounts to "still working on it."

I understand. About my only gripe is being left in the dark - I am one of the unusual people who can sit on information like 'We don't know yet' and be happy about it though. You could always twist Cory's arm into PM'ing me it every day :D I am not stupid enough to blab.

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 12:39 PM
CZE cam! Let us pay money to drop red bulls out of vending machines near them and watch them all scramble for it!

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 12:42 PM
CZE cam! Let us pay money to drop red bulls out of vending machines near them and watch them all scramble for it!

Holy crap, I am pissing myself thinking about this. We need to fund a kickstarter for this! I would chip in 10 no problem.

BossHoss
04-28-2014, 12:47 PM
http://youtu.be/Oll38dcbKZw

/HACK

Access to the CZE lunchroom done...

First RedBull released in 10... 9...

Lochar
04-28-2014, 12:52 PM
CZE cam! Let us pay money to drop red bulls out of vending machines near them and watch them all scramble for it!

The problem then, is they camp out the red bull machines and then don't get any actual coding done.

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 12:53 PM
We don't pay to put out a redbull until they are working diligently though.

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 12:57 PM
We don't pay to put out a redbull until they are working diligently though.

Christ, it keeps getting funnier. We need to put up one of those air raid sirens to give the 'all clear' when the red bull has been claimed, just so we can watch the sad walk back to their desks... :D

That might be a bit mean actually, but I want to do this in an office somewhere with sad, sad people.

BossHoss
04-28-2014, 01:14 PM
Christ, it keeps getting funnier. We need to put up one of those air raid sirens to give the 'all clear' when the red bull has been claimed, just so we can watch the sad walk back to their desks... :D

That might be a bit mean actually, but I want to do this in an office somewhere with sad, sad people.

Sounds a bit like me at home during Alpha/Beta

DRAFTS!!!!... Frozen hmphhhh.... Sad face saunter over to the fridge kicking rocks... Wait rocks? Guess I should vacuum

Axle
04-28-2014, 01:18 PM
I am a slacker backer and got 25 packs, I seem to be losing a lot even without mistakes and good strategies because so many people got 100+ packs and have better cards to work with.

I already spent 50 USD for access to a barely working game+ a few packs.

Do I now have to spend loads more to compete?

Not sure if im willing to.

Well the secret of card games as just a player is to not buy packs raw. You either earn them in tournaments or just simply buy singles. Focus on obtaining one deck and work your way from there. The amount you have to spend is significantly cheaper then. The Falconer deck plays no legendary cards so it shouldn't be that expensive if you buy it all on the AH for example. So in terms of saving money, the $50 you spent on slacker backer which buys packs at $2 each was a bad idea. It would have been just to play Alpha and closed Beta.

Krond
04-28-2014, 01:20 PM
To the OP: it can be a bummer to get thrashed by a Tier 1 competitive deck in a TCG when you simply don't have the cards to compete. All TCGs are essentially pay to win when it comes to constructed, an investment of $50 will not get you a Tier 1 deck. I can sympathize, but if you were expecting a slacker backer pledge to carry you to the finals in a competitive setting, you are in for a rude awakening.

Fortunately, as others have pointed out, Sealed and draft puts everyone on nearly equal footing, where player skill is THE most important factor, regardless of wallet size. And at $7 per draft, it's hard to beat the price/hour of entertainment you get.

Vorpal
04-28-2014, 01:21 PM
I am a slacker backer and got 25 packs, I seem to be losing a lot even without mistakes and good strategies because so many people got 100+ packs and have better cards to work with.

I already spent 50 USD for access to a barely working game+ a few packs.

Do I now have to spend loads more to compete?

Not sure if im willing to.

This is a problem in hearthstone as well.

Unless you like sealed and draft (which equalize things), the issue will (eventually) be found in ranked play.

Right now in hearthstone if you go into unranked queue you just get stomped by people with way more decks stuffed full of golden legendary cards. If you play in ranked you will eventually settle somewhere where you win about half your games against people of similar skill/deck level.

Sadly there is no ranked in Hex atm.

I have 20 packs from which to make my deck and like you, I get clobbered a lot. I treat it as a learning experience.

Axle
04-28-2014, 01:28 PM
To the OP: it can be a bummer to get thrashed by a Tier 1 competitive deck in a TCG when you simply don't have the cards to compete. All TCGs are essentially pay to win when it comes to constructed, an investment of $50 will not get you a Tier 1 deck. I can sympathize, but if you were expecting a slacker backer pledge to carry you to the finals in a competitive setting, you are in for a rude awakening.

Fortunately, as others have pointed out, Sealed and draft puts everyone on nearly equal footing, where player skill is THE most important factor, regardless of wallet size. And at $7 per draft, it's hard to beat the price/hour of entertainment you get.

I think $50 should be enough to buy a tier 1 deck in set 1 if prices in the market aren't inflated (aka rares cost as much as MTG rares..despite packs and tournaments costing half as much). RFalconer decks are just rares and commons, there also aren't any expensive lands to buy yet. $50 might only not be enough if you want to play Blood+Diamond, however Blood+Sapphire or just Blood would still cost under $100.

Khazrakh
04-28-2014, 01:33 PM
To the OP: it can be a bummer to get thrashed by a Tier 1 competitive deck in a TCG when you simply don't have the cards to compete. All TCGs are essentially pay to win when it comes to constructed, an investment of $50 will not get you a Tier 1 deck. I can sympathize, but if you were expecting a slacker backer pledge to carry you to the finals in a competitive setting, you are in for a rude awakening.

Fortunately, as others have pointed out, Sealed and draft puts everyone on nearly equal footing, where player skill is THE most important factor, regardless of wallet size. And at $7 per draft, it's hard to beat the price/hour of entertainment you get.

Just to clarify - they actually are pay to compete as you will need a Tier 1 deck to be competitive but once you got it money won't buy you any wins.
Once the AH is up you'll be able to buy one rather cheap I guess.

Krond
04-28-2014, 01:42 PM
Pay to win is a phrase that gamers use to describe paying more money to have a greater chance of winning. It is not meant to be taken literally. Kinda like when a you say, "Oh man, that card is crazy," you actually mean that the card is suffering from an unfortunate psychological condition.

Aldri
04-28-2014, 01:43 PM
Sounds a bit like me at home during Alpha/Beta

DRAFTS!!!!... Frozen hmphhhh.... Sad face saunter over to the fridge kicking rocks... Wait rocks? Guess I should vacuum

That's why they froze draft, to give you time to clean your house !

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 01:44 PM
That's why they froze draft, to give you time to clean your house !

That just sent me to the forums :D I am so unproductive haha.

Werlix
04-28-2014, 02:05 PM
I am a slacker backer and got 25 packs, I seem to be losing a lot even without mistakes and good strategies because so many people got 100+ packs and have better cards to work with.

I already spent 50 USD for access to a barely working game+ a few packs.

Do I now have to spend loads more to compete?

Not sure if im willing to.

Ah... and it begins :) Welcome to the Hearthstone forums, everyone

Aldri
04-28-2014, 02:06 PM
That just sent me to the forums :D I am so unproductive haha.

Please clean your house so they can put the drafts back online... think about us ! I cleaned my bathroom this afternoon

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 02:20 PM
Please clean your house so they can put the drafts back online... think about us ! I cleaned my bathroom this afternoon

If it would bring drafts up, I would clean my house, then get on a plane and clean the entire CZE office. If I had that power, I wouldn't hold out!

Gwaer
04-28-2014, 02:27 PM
If it would bring drafts up, I would clean my house, then get on a plane and clean the entire CZE office. If I had that power, I wouldn't hold out!

How do you know you don't until you try! Go xenavire! Clean like you've never cleant before!

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 02:27 PM
How do you know you don't until you try! Go xenavire! Clean like you've never cleant before!

But... But... Dammit, I can't actually not clean, can I? :p

Lochar
04-28-2014, 02:32 PM
But... But... Dammit, I can't actually not clean, can I? :p

Not to slow the possible implementation of Drafting(since it now relies on you), but you did say you'd get on a plane and go clean CZE as well.

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 02:38 PM
Not to slow the possible implementation of Drafting(since it now relies on you), but you did say you'd get on a plane and go clean CZE as well.

Right, who is paying that bill? :p

Lochar
04-28-2014, 02:40 PM
Hey, you never said you were going to not foot the bill.

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 02:52 PM
Hey, you never said you were going to not foot the bill.

I never said I would either! But seriously, I have no money for that right now.

Although, I live in EU. That would be a very long flight, even for an awesome joke. I think tourneys would be up long before I even got on the plane, let alone arrived.

Saeijou
04-28-2014, 02:53 PM
SOunds like a challenge :P

Aldri
04-28-2014, 03:03 PM
Start by cleaning your own house, who knows, it might be enough ! But we need a picture before / after as a proof

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 03:07 PM
Start by cleaning your own house, who knows, it might be enough ! But we need a picture before / after as a proof

Its midnight - if I start now, I would pass out at 3-4am, wake up at 10-11, forget all about cleaning until 7-8pm, then scramble for 2 hours cleaning up all the mess I just made, before I could finally finish everything around 1am. Do you really want drafts to take that long? :p

Aldri
04-28-2014, 03:09 PM
Well.. go to sleep and do that tomorow morning ! :)
We count on you !

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 03:12 PM
Well.. go to sleep and do that tomorow morning ! :)
We count on you !

You know what, I might actually follow through. I did some heavy duty cleaning earlier today in the kitchen, I could spread that oua little and do a few more rooms. Would be a good use of my downtime while waiting for tournies.

ossuary
04-28-2014, 03:13 PM
Its midnight - if I start now, I would pass out at 3-4am, wake up at 10-11, forget all about cleaning until 7-8pm, then scramble for 2 hours cleaning up all the mess I just made, before I could finally finish everything around 1am. Do you really want drafts to take that long? :p

All I hear is excuses. What I DON'T hear is you cleaning your damn house. :cool:

BossHoss
04-28-2014, 03:34 PM
Sleep on the plane. It's going to be a long flight to CZE! I hope for your sake the "Red Bull" skirmishes in front of the vending machine didn't create too much of a sticky mess... My draft tickets don't have long left before expiry

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 03:37 PM
*Feigns sleep*

Seriously though, I would totally clean their office for free, if someone could pay the airfare. :D Maybe I can make it into some secret meetings dressed as a maid :D

hex_colin
04-28-2014, 03:50 PM
*Feigns sleep*

Seriously though, I would totally clean their office for free, if someone could pay the airfare. :D Maybe I can make it into some secret meetings dressed as a maid :D

Oh, if you're there, they don't tend to worry about whether or not you're in their meetings. ;) Last time I was at the office a huge design meeting sprung up around me the game room and no one seemed too concerned that I was sitting there.

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 03:52 PM
*Screams internally*

Anyone who ever has the chance to visit is so freaking lucky. I would love to work there, or at least visit, and it is incredibly unlikely that I will ever have the chance to do either. :(

ossuary
04-28-2014, 03:54 PM
Yeah, I'm kicking myself for not clearing my schedule when I went to visit family last August. My mom's house is less than 20 minutes down the road from the office. I justified not going to CZE that night because I hadn't seen my family in person for 10 years, but I now realize that it was a poor decision due to misplaced priorities. ;)

BossHoss
04-28-2014, 03:57 PM
Yeah, I'm kicking myself for not clearing my schedule when I went to visit family last August. My mom's house is less than 20 minutes down the road from the office. I justified not going to CZE that night because I hadn't seen my family in person for 10 years, but I now realize that it was a poor decision due to misplaced priorities. ;)

Me thinks that would be grounds to move back in with mom!

Xenavire
04-28-2014, 03:57 PM
Yeah, I'm kicking myself for not clearing my schedule when I went to visit family last August. My mom's house is less than 20 minutes down the road from the office. I justified not going to CZE that night because I hadn't seen my family in person for 10 years, but I now realize that it was a poor decision due to misplaced priorities. ;)

I dunno, I haven't seen my family in 4+ years and I would rather visit them than CZE, but its pretty borderline haha. But CZE now tops my list of destinations to visit that don't specifically include direct relations. I mean CZE would be my third family (first and second being my fiancee and her family, and my blood relatives) but I doubt I will ever get a chance to meet them.

Dammit I wish I could find a way to work there. I would be the CM, no problem, if it was a possibility and I could train on the job. I would go into armed combat to fight for the right to work at CZE, and I am a pacifist!

funktion
04-28-2014, 03:59 PM
I am sorry you are having a bad experience. Competitive constructed play will require a heavy investment, that is the nature of the beast. However as Gwaer mentioned limited formats (sealed and draft) are much more wallet friendly because everyone starts at an even playing field and it comes down to mostly skill. So if you still have some packs left safe them for draft or sealed and if not play constructed more casually and then wait for draft tournaments to work again and invest a few bucks there.

Actually I would go so far to say that competitive constructed can be extremely wallet friendly as well...

The real problem here is that the OP opened packs with the intention of building a competitive deck. If your goal is to be able to compete then you probably shouldn't be opening packs. You might spend 100's of dollars on packs before you have everything you wanted for a deck in the meantime you could have just spent 15-20 on singles and built a pretty competitive one instead.

Dropbear
04-28-2014, 06:22 PM
On the flip side of all this, I'm winning almost every game with two ork decks to make 4-ofs of all the good cards. I've only opened my 2 primal boosters which I haven't added into the ork deck (added a few into the human deck to make it better), and I've only lost three out of 15+ games.

If you have the ork deck, might not hurt to buy the second one to get all the good 4-ofs in it.

Warrender
04-29-2014, 06:13 AM
Welcome to the wonderful world of TCG's where those who spend money will always have an edge over those who don't. The digital implementations tend to follow suit with some notable exceptions like Scrolls.

Zomnivore
04-29-2014, 06:28 AM
Drafting and sealed are where the power of money stops affecting game balance, and is where the game is most balanced, and designed for imo.

Constructed is a game mode for those who've got collections and want to make hyper awesome decks...so of course its going to favor the collectors, traders, and people who draft and get near infinite and can open huge numbers of packs through drafting.

Become a good drafter, and eventually you will be able to get a lot of packs very cheaply, and be able to open a lot more packs through drafting, and get big honking collections.