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JohnDruitt
07-29-2014, 05:58 AM
Hello

I have a question - will we have an additional release queues with bigger EV for future released sets like in MTG?

Lawlschool
07-29-2014, 08:32 AM
No idea. Don't think we've heard much about the draft / sealed queues for Set 2, except that we will have 2 Set 2 / 1 Set 1 packs for Draft (I think).

Svenn
07-29-2014, 08:48 AM
No idea. Don't think we've heard much about the draft / sealed queues for Set 2, except that we will have 2 Set 2 / 1 Set 1 packs for Draft (I think).
Did they ever actually say that or was that just suggestions/guesses from the forums? I haven't seen that officially stated.

Lawlschool
07-29-2014, 08:51 AM
Did they ever actually say that or was that just suggestions/guesses from the forums? I haven't seen that officially stated.

I feel like we did get some confirmation a month or so ago in one of the threads, but I'm too lazy to go hunt it down.

Scammanator
07-29-2014, 09:06 AM
Colin confirmed that the 2of2/1of1 distribution was being used for internal testing.

hex_colin
07-29-2014, 09:49 AM
Colin confirmed that the 2of2/1of1 distribution was being used for internal testing.

And it was confirmed when they announced the Set2 drafting plans for GenCon too. :) (just in case Orange verification was required...)

pinkshirtbadman
07-29-2014, 10:13 AM
And it was confirmed when they announced the Set2 drafting plans for GenCon too. :) (just in case Orange verification was required...)

I missed the confirmation on draft at gencon, could you point me to the announcement?

Saeijou
07-29-2014, 11:00 AM
What can I do with all my set1 draft packs? T.T

poizonous
07-29-2014, 11:05 AM
What can I do with all my set1 draft packs? T.T

What do you mean draft packs? If you are referring to tickets, you will be able to use those tickets in any draft mode

Saeijou
07-29-2014, 02:41 PM
Sorry, I meant my normal packs out of set 1. I still have 250+ of them. I can't draft all of them :D

Yoss
07-29-2014, 02:58 PM
Sorry, I meant my normal packs out of set 1. I still have 250+ of them. I can't draft all of them :D

Either open them or put them on the AH. Or give them to friends. I'm your friend. :D

Saeijou
07-29-2014, 03:09 PM
If trading would be active i would have a lot of friends instantly i think :D

Mejis
07-29-2014, 04:43 PM
If trading would be active i would have a lot of friends instantly i think :D

Yes ... ;)

I only have 3 packs left at the moment :-/

Werlix
07-29-2014, 05:13 PM
Sorry, I meant my normal packs out of set 1. I still have 250+ of them. I can't draft all of them :D

Sell them on the AH! That's what I did with over 100 packs. You can get around 130 plat for each which gives you a massive boost for buying singles for constructed :)

Gwaer
07-29-2014, 06:07 PM
I have over 1000 set one packs still =(

hex_colin
07-29-2014, 06:12 PM
Apparently they don't magically disappear from your inventory when Set 2 drops! ;) And... at some point we won't be able to buy them anymore and folks like me pay a premium for "out of print" packs. :)

Gwaer
07-29-2014, 06:13 PM
Apparently they don't magically disappear from your inventory when Set 2 drops! ;) And... at some point we won't be able to buy them anymore and folks like me pay a premium for "out of print" packs. :)

Smiley face means they do magically disappear when set 2 drops! Nooooooooo.

Gorgol
07-29-2014, 06:15 PM
Smiley face means they do magically disappear when set 2 drops! Nooooooooo.

really? damn

hex_colin
07-29-2014, 06:18 PM
really? damn

Nope. Gwaer's joking that any smiley means someone is being sarcastic. I was not, in fact, being sarcastic in this case.

Littlejon24
07-29-2014, 06:34 PM
i been selling my set 1 packs for a while. down to around 90 now. it's not a huge profit, but it's relevant. it'll let you buy the rest of your singles and possibly singles from set 2

pinkshirtbadman
07-29-2014, 07:38 PM
And it was confirmed when they announced the Set2 drafting plans for GenCon too. :) (just in case Orange verification was required...)


Nobody really answered this when I asked before.
Where can I find official news about what Hex will be doing at GenCon? It looks like I'll be able to be there this year so I'm definitely interested in reading what the'll be doing there.

hex_colin
07-29-2014, 08:37 PM
Nobody really answered this when I asked before.
Where can I find official news about what Hex will be doing at GenCon? It looks like I'll be able to be there this year so I'm definitely interested in reading what the'll be doing there.

Quick search for "GenCon" finds this: http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=36511&highlight=GenCon

Littlejon24
07-29-2014, 09:45 PM
need to get to Gencon next year... on a related topic, if someone gets a code for sleeves at Gencon, i want one

JohnDruitt
07-30-2014, 01:46 AM
Another quetion: will draft event tickets be the same for future draft? Can i stockpile mine now and use them to play set 2 drafts later?

I hope some dev will answer this and OP questions.

Werlix
07-30-2014, 02:15 AM
Draft tickets usually expire after one week, that's for the ones that are generated weekly anyway

JohnDruitt
07-30-2014, 03:32 AM
Yeah, but Im talking about draft tickets from other sources. Do they also expire?

Parzival
07-30-2014, 04:55 AM
The ones from compensation for bugged tournaments do not expire nor do the 3 x free ones some KS accounts received. (Purple no expiry, red weekly expiry)

pinkshirtbadman
07-30-2014, 07:06 AM
Quick search for "GenCon" finds this: http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=36511&highlight=GenCon

Thank you very much, I'm really sorry I don't know how I missed that when I searched before. ):

Yoss
07-30-2014, 10:58 AM
The ones from compensation for bugged tournaments do not expire nor do the 3 x free ones some KS accounts received. (Purple no expiry, red weekly expiry)

True, but be aware that the system forces you to consume all tickets before it lets you use packs/plat for entry. So the only way to hoard them is to not play any paid drafts. (Annoying, I know.)

Scammanator
07-30-2014, 11:05 AM
True, but be aware that the system forces you to consume all tickets before it lets you use packs/plat for entry. So the only way to hoard them is to not play any paid drafts. (Annoying, I know.)

No it doesn't. You can select packs/plat from the dropdown menu when entering a tournament.

jonsnow2000
07-30-2014, 11:17 AM
Yes, you can choose if you want to use tickets or pay normally. But you need to click on the text instead of the dropdown arrow. It's another case of wrongly placed hitbox, like when you want to access your stash in the AH to sell boosters.

Ebynfel
07-30-2014, 12:55 PM
Yes, you can choose if you want to use tickets or pay normally. But you need to click on the text instead of the dropdown arrow. It's another case of wrongly placed hitbox, like when you want to access your stash in the AH to sell boosters.

The only thing it forces is it auto uses the "Permadraft" tickets before your weekly.

thegreybetween
07-30-2014, 01:00 PM
The only thing it forces is it auto uses the "Permadraft" tickets before your weekly.

Not true. At least, it wasn't for me. I've been holding a purple (non-expiring) draft ticket for quite some time while continuing to do my weekly drafts. Each time I enter, the system automatically uses my red (expiring) ticket without any prompting or manual reallocation required on my part.

Ebynfel
07-30-2014, 01:51 PM
Not true. At least, it wasn't for me. I've been holding a purple (non-expiring) draft ticket for quite some time while continuing to do my weekly drafts. Each time I enter, the system automatically uses my red (expiring) ticket without any prompting or manual reallocation required on my part.

Hmm, I may have gotten it backwards then. It's been a while since I've had one of each and thought that was the way it happened. But. I'm more than happy to be wrong :)

Yoss
07-30-2014, 01:55 PM
So I could have kept my non-expiring ones? :(

I specifically asked and was told (I thought by Chark himself) that it was not possible (without just abstaining from draft). Sad days. Those tickets would sure have been useful to kickstart my set 2 war chest.

Gwaer
07-30-2014, 01:59 PM
There was a time long ago that there was no way to manually select your entry fee. That was quite a few patches ago.

Yoss
07-30-2014, 02:06 PM
There was a time long ago that there was no way to manually select your entry fee. That was quite a few patches ago.

Ah. That's a good change. Still sad I didn't know it was coming, but not the end of the world.

Ebynfel
07-30-2014, 02:09 PM
Ah. That's a good change. Still sad I didn't know it was coming, but not the end of the world.

I'd say the same, but I'd have used them anyways.

pinkshirtbadman
07-30-2014, 03:13 PM
This has probably been answered elsewhere, but when Set 2 drops will tournament prizes be all set 2 or mixed if so at the ratio of the entry packs? Or would we get to choose which set we want our prize from? I did a few searches on the forums here but the keywords are all generic enough to trigger an avalanche of results.

Yoss
07-30-2014, 03:18 PM
I don't have a link for you, but I'm pretty sure prizes are always 100% latest set (unless specifically stated otherwise for a specific event).

pinkshirtbadman
07-30-2014, 03:19 PM
I don't have a link for you, but I'm pretty sure prizes are always 100% latest set.

You're a trustworthy guy, I don't need a link. (:

Yoss
07-30-2014, 03:29 PM
You're a trustworthy guy, I don't need a link. (:

Now that you've said that, I'm sure someone will show up with the original source showing I'm wrong.

mach
07-30-2014, 06:44 PM
Prizes being 100% latest set would cause big problems with the economy.

Vorpal
07-30-2014, 06:57 PM
Prizes being 100% latest set would cause big problems with the economy.

It would cause zero problems with the economy.

In fact, I consider it a necessary facet to help keep packs from 'older' sets from losing value dramatically. The demand for them will be slashed wholesale, if there is still a massive influx of them from draft rewards that is an enormous problem.

Additionally attempting to figure out which places get saddled with the useless set 1 rewards packs would be a royal pain.

How would you even do it in swiss? You're supposed to get a pack per win.

What about in single elimination? You should get 2 set 2 packs for one win. Then if you win another game you get.... a set 1 pack? Pretty disappointing addition for making it to second place, at least.

mach
07-30-2014, 07:05 PM
It would cause zero problems with the economy.

In fact, I consider it a necessary facet to help keep packs from 'older' sets from losing value dramatically. The demand for them will be slashed wholesale, if there is still a massive influx of them from draft rewards that is an enormous problem.

Additionally attempting to figure out which places get saddled with the useless set 1 rewards packs would be a royal pain.

How would you even do it in swiss? You're supposed to get a pack per win.

What about in single elimination? You should get 2 set 2 packs for one win. Then if you win another game you get.... a set 1 pack? Pretty disappointing addition for making it to second place, at least.

Take a look at how MTGO does it. The current payouts are a result of trial and error: they've had big problems in the past with payouts being too heavy towards the most recent set, causing its value to crash.

Vorpal
07-30-2014, 07:08 PM
MTGO is abjectly horrible and Hex should not be copying them in anything.

-also, unless things have changed, it doesn't even have an auction house, so attempting to compare it's economy to that of Hex (which even uses a differing pricing structure!) is a terrible idea on multiple levels.

mach
07-30-2014, 07:14 PM
MTGO is abjectly horrible and Hex should not be copying them in anything.

-also, unless things have changed, it doesn't even have an auction house, so attempting to compare it's economy to that of Hex (which even uses a differing pricing structure!) is a terrible idea on multiple levels.

Economics still works even when the client sucks.

And Hex basically uses the same pricing structure, just with everything at half price.

Werlix
07-30-2014, 07:52 PM
Prizes being 100% latest set would cause big problems with the economy.

How would giving a pack of set 2 as a prize instead of a pack of set 1 "cause big problems with the economy"? Set 2 will be in high demand, increasing the supply by providing them as rewards for tournaments would help stabilise the price of packs/singles on the AH so they don't skyrocket.

Do you have any specific reason why this would cause problems?

Yoss
07-30-2014, 07:59 PM
And Set 1 will still be on sale in the Store if for some reason the player supply were to dry up.

mach
07-30-2014, 08:19 PM
How would giving a pack of set 2 as a prize instead of a pack of set 1 "cause big problems with the economy"? Set 2 will be in high demand, increasing the supply by providing them as rewards for tournaments would help stabilise the price of packs/singles on the AH so they don't skyrocket.

Do you have any specific reason why this would cause problems?

Increasing the supply reduces the price. Sure, at first this will "stabilize the price." But what then? Once the price has "stabilized", continuing to add that much supply will keep putting downward pressure on prices.

Note that I don't have problems with events paying out in just the new set for a limited time (release events). But as a permanent policy it would be disastrous for the economy. I've seen similar happen on MTGO and there is no reason why the basic rules of economics won't apply to Hex.

The worst case in after Set 3 comes out. If events pay out in just Set 3, each event will be adding Set 3 packs to the economy. Limited events are supposed to remove unopened packs from the economy.

poizonous
07-31-2014, 07:20 AM
That is what happens to prices of packs. They eventually continue to drop, geez I have had enough set 1 packs that if they were to give out set 1 packs in set 2 drafts i wouldnt even bother winning.

Vorpal
07-31-2014, 07:32 AM
Having all prizes be the latest set worked just fine for set 1. Indeed, given the huge numbet of ks packs out there, im very surprised that set 1 packs still cost as much as they do.

Absent the huge pile of ks packs, I think set 2 packs will be significantly more expensive than set 1 packs, even if all prizes are set 2.

If the prizes are a mix of set 1 and 2, set 2 packs will be dramatically more expensive than set 1 packs are now.

The supply of set 2 packs will be vastly less than the supply of set 1 packs even if all prizes are set 2.

JohnDruitt
07-31-2014, 07:51 AM
Having all prizes be the latest set worked just fine for set 1. Indeed, given the huge numbet of ks packs out there, im very surprised that set 1 packs still cost as much as they do.

Absent the huge pile of ks packs, I think set 2 packs will be significantly more ecpensive than set 2 packs, even if all prizes are set 2.

If the prizes are a mix of set 1 and 2, set 2 packs will be dramatically more expensive than set 1 packs are now.

The supply of set 2 packs will be vastly less than the supply of set 1 packs even if all prizes are set 2.

And thats where release events come into place. You can there get more product on the market.

Mahes
07-31-2014, 09:49 AM
I think set 2 packs will be significantly more ecpensive than set 2 packs, even if all prizes are set 2.

I disagree. I think Set 2 could be less than Set 2 despite all prizes being Set 2.

Vorpal
07-31-2014, 10:28 AM
Haha, fixed now. :)

wolzarg
07-31-2014, 09:48 PM
I'm not a economic engineer or anything but could someone explain how only paying out in the latest packs is good. In my mind without prior knowledge to base it on it seems bad for later sets. Lets say we are now in set 1a there are plenty of packs to go around no big deal. But once we are in set 2b next block and need 1 set 1b and 2 set 2b won't this cause big problems for people to go infinite on wins if they have to keep reselling their set 2b boosters to buy set 1b so they can join a que? Even worse for set 3b where they still need a set 1b booster to join? Please do set me straight if you think you know better for a fact but try to back it up with a reasonable argument, Thanks!

Vorpal
08-01-2014, 07:21 AM
Are you saying you expect set 2:boosters to be worth less than set 1 boosters?

Yoss
08-01-2014, 09:56 AM
Are you saying you expect set 2:boosters to be worth less than set 1 boosters?

It would be better to discuss in terms of Set 4 through Set 6, since those won't be distorted by KS rewards.

Vorpal
08-01-2014, 10:44 AM
I think wed need to know the longterm plan for set rotations, block duration, size of sets, number of draft queues and the pack fee for each, etc, to really make a guess at prices that far down the road.

I think its safe to say set 2 packs will cost more than set 1 packs.

Vorpal
08-01-2014, 10:59 AM
I think wed need to know the longterm plan for set rotations, block duration, size of sets, number of draft queues and the pack fee for each, etc, to really make a guess at prices that far down the road.

I think its safe to say set 2 packs will cost more than set 1 packs.

Turtlewing
08-01-2014, 11:17 AM
Increasing the supply reduces the price. Sure, at first this will "stabilize the price." But what then? Once the price has "stabilized", continuing to add that much supply will keep putting downward pressure on prices.

Note that I don't have problems with events paying out in just the new set for a limited time (release events). But as a permanent policy it would be disastrous for the economy. I've seen similar happen on MTGO and there is no reason why the basic rules of economics won't apply to Hex.

The worst case in after Set 3 comes out. If events pay out in just Set 3, each event will be adding Set 3 packs to the economy. Limited events are supposed to remove unopened packs from the economy.

They'll be adding set 3 and removing set 1 and 2.

I don't see how that's a disaster. It'll take time to depreciate the new set to a point where it's worth less than the earlier sets and by then there should a new set out to restart the cycle.