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View Full Version : What's resolved first? Constants, or Troop effects?



skalapunk
04-27-2015, 12:44 PM
Enemy had in play - Inferno: at the beginning of your turn, you might take X dmg
I had in play - Turreted wall: at the beginning of your turn, do 1 dmg to enemy champions

I had 1 hp left.
Enemy had 1 hp left.

Who wins? :)

Gwaer
04-27-2015, 12:48 PM
It depends which was played first. If you played the turreted wall after he played the inferno, it would go off FILO, so turreted wall kills.

if you played the wall before, then the inferno may kill you before it goes off.... *I think* This is another one of those situations that would benefit greatly from being able to order effects that go off simultaneously.

Xenavire
04-27-2015, 12:48 PM
I believe it depends on the order played. First in last out, at a guess I would say the turret fires first.

AdamAoE2
04-27-2015, 12:49 PM
Great Question!

I'm not sure, but I believe the order in which they came into play determines which triggers first. (First in triggers first?) I could be totally offbase on this, though.

Kami
04-27-2015, 12:50 PM
This is another one of those situations that would benefit greatly from being able to order effects that go off simultaneously.

I agree. I'm still of the opinion it was better being able to order simultaneous effects. Otherwise, you have to keep an invisible tally in your head of what got played when, etc.

Tazelbain
04-27-2015, 12:51 PM
This is another one of those situations that would benefit greatly from actually having rules spelled out.

LNQ
04-27-2015, 01:28 PM
This is another one of those situations that would benefit greatly from actually having rules spelled out.

Exactly. It's enraging to have to know all of this stuff by heart. Maybe one day ...

ossuary
04-27-2015, 01:42 PM
LIFO is the correct answer. Whichever of those two cards was played second during the course of the game, will be the first to be processed at the start of the turn.

Saeijou
04-27-2015, 03:02 PM
LIFO is the correct answer. Whichever of those two cards was played second during the course of the game, will be the first to be processed at the start of the turn.

Is there any reason it's LIFO and not FIFO? oO

ossuary
04-27-2015, 03:13 PM
Is there any reason it's LIFO and not FIFO? oO

Because if it were FIFO then it would be impossible to counter a spell, since the one played first would have already resolved? ;)

All chain resolution in TCGs is LIFO, it wouldn't work otherwise.

Tazelbain
04-27-2015, 03:17 PM
They really should give you a menu to order these effects in your main phase if you so choose.

Zophie
04-27-2015, 05:39 PM
In addition it would be nice to get a verbose combat log to be able to see exactly how different situations like this are played out. Wouldn't help you at the time of course if you didn't have the full rules available beforehand, but would at least be great for postmortems when you get those "wtf just happened?" moments.

strylght
04-27-2015, 05:59 PM
In addition it would be nice to get a verbose combat log to be able to see exactly how different situations like this are played out. Wouldn't help you at the time of course if you didn't have the full rules available beforehand, but would at least be great for postmortems when you get those "wtf just happened?" moments.

I second this wholeheartedly, I get those moments all the time when I miss things.

Also, Tazelbain, I'm not understanding what is meant by being given a menu to order things. Surely the order they are in should not be adjustable, it just needs to be displayed somehow.

Gwaer
04-27-2015, 06:08 PM
Well, once upon a time, in a situation like this you would be given a window similar to the one you get when someone is blocking a troop with multiple troops, where you can put them in the order that they take damage. You could also respond to these effects, so if you were about to die to someones start of turn turret you could play an instant health gain, or an immortality to cancel it.

Many people still feel quite strongly that you should be able to order these effects if not fully respond to them. We'll eventually just all deal with it with less and less fuss I'm certain, but I'm not a fan.

strylght
04-27-2015, 06:25 PM
I'm inclined to agree that one should have a reaction opportunity. Isn't immortality the only reason to use such an opportunity though? Couldn't life gain always just be played in your own end-step to the same effect?

Xenavire
04-27-2015, 06:31 PM
I'm inclined to agree that one should have a reaction opportunity. Isn't immortality the only reason to use such an opportunity though? Couldn't life gain always just be played in your own end-step to the same effect?

If you have open resources. If not, too bad. :p

strylght
04-27-2015, 06:33 PM
Well of course, countering anything requires holding back resources. The need to do so is a lot more obvious when you're countering a card that's already been in play for a bit though. :)

Ertzi
04-27-2015, 11:02 PM
+1 for combat log

+748 for a chance to order simultaneous effects

RDarkfire
04-28-2015, 09:43 AM
What if it was complicated even further --

Let's say there are 5 effects going to happen at the end of your turn, but 3 of them are controlled by you and 2 of them by the opponent. In order of play, the first two were yours, followed by the next 2 for the opponent, then one for you, then the last for the opponent, then the last 2 for you. How crazy would it be to then create a sub-order for each set of these?

Sounds like a lot of effort.

Gwaer
04-28-2015, 09:51 AM
Who owns the effects shouldn't enter into it at all. All of them that indicate going off at the start of turn should be order able at once by the player whose turn it is, similarly for end of turn or any other period. The player in control of the turn should select the order for simultaneous effects.

Tazelbain
04-28-2015, 09:52 AM
Also, Tazelbain, I'm not understanding what is meant by being given a menu to order things. Surely the order they are in should not be adjustable, it just needs to be displayed somehow.
You could say we shouldn't be able set the order combat damage. But we can and it gives us opportunity to make choices that impact the game and thus an opportunity to have more skill than our opponent. Allowing us to order the beginning of turn effects and end of turn effects on our turn would create another opportunity for skill.

strylght
04-28-2015, 10:14 AM
You could say we shouldn't be able set the order combat damage. But we can and it gives us opportunity to make choices that impact the game and thus an opportunity to have more skill than our opponent. Allowing us to order the beginning of turn effects and end of turn effects on our turn would create another opportunity for skill.

Yeah, I understand it now and it makes perfect sense. Consider me educated. :)