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Kami
05-19-2015, 07:23 PM
Been lurking on various Chinese HEX forums lately and watching some of their streamers and videos. As I stated elsewhere, it's rather surreal to watch new players explore Set 1 for the first time after we've already had it for over a year. Interestingly, they've also been watching us for a while now too - pulling videos and articles from various sources and I suspect even playing here as well.

How much interaction between the regions do you think there will be by the international communities? Do you think the communities will reach out to each other beyond the eventual global tournament servers?

Do you think their meta will evolve differently than NA/EU? Will their Set 1 also be dominated by Gore Feast decks? :P

I wonder if their concerns or excitement for the game differs from the NA/EU communities too. I know they've already had discussions about MTG vs HEX, potential bots/scripts (including AH), and the value of gold vs platinum (and inflation).

What do you think? Would you rather see the communities grow separately or together (other than separation by garden)? Maybe we should have garden ambassadors? Fan sites sharing globally even. :)

Fun links:

http://hex.wanmei.com/ - Official Chinese HEX site
http://hex.bbs.wanmei.com/forum.php - Official Chinese HEX forum
http://hex.tgbus.com/ - One of their major HEX fan sites
http://www.douyutv.com/search/HEX?type=new - HEX streamers (when they go live anyway)
http://tieba.baidu.com/f?kw=hex&ie=utf-8 - HEX group(?)

(Yes, I am totally hyped that HEX is going international - even moreso than it was!)

Zubrin
05-19-2015, 07:55 PM
It was pretty amusing the whole host of plagiarized fiveshards articles we found a few weeks ago. They have been watching for a bit. :)

MatWith1T
05-19-2015, 08:15 PM
Maybe they'll crack that undiscovered Tier 1 deck.

It'll be interesting to check out how the meta evolves there... I imagine its gotta be slightly skewed by their ability to 'look into the future' and see entire sets that are heading their way; plus the game theory of peeking over into our garden to see which decks counter popular decks (ie do you start with Gore Feast deck, or do you immediately start with JJ's counter-Gore Feast deck, or skip straight to mono-sapph?)

Diesbudt
05-19-2015, 08:28 PM
Very complicated topic... I think it'd be interesting to see how their garden evolves from the player base. Kind of like knowing how we humans evolved over X years only to discover life on Mars at the cusp of a humanoid creature and watching it evolve over the millennia.

Of course if they ever asked for help is gladly do what I could, but fair warning I cannot speak Chinese... Actually even English gets me at least every other day, and that's the only language outside Latin I know.

Mejis
05-19-2015, 08:33 PM
Interesting thoughts and quite bizarre to think they can see our meta before they may encounter it themselves. Kinda weird but cool.

Not really related, but do they use different art assets/card layouts? If so, can you post some? I don't have time to go poking through those websites and staring at symbols I don't understand ;)

kaiizza
05-19-2015, 08:44 PM
Interesting thoughts and quite bizarre to think they can see our meta before they may encounter it themselves. Kinda weird but cool.

Not really related, but do they use different art assets/card layouts? If so, can you post some? I don't have time to go poking through those websites and staring at symbols I don't understand ;)

Yes they do as they have very different laws on what can be shown in video games, zombies are a big one that is not allowed so all the zombie cards are redone to make them less zombie looking. They talked about this in a post or update a few months ago I believe. Maybe someone can dig it up.

hex_colin
05-19-2015, 09:00 PM
Yes they do as they have very different laws on what can be shown in video games, zombies are a big one that is not allowed so all the zombie cards are redone to make them less zombie looking. They talked about this in a post or update a few months ago I believe. Maybe someone can dig it up.

There were 10-15 art images that needed to change in Set 1. It wasn't that substantial. Stuff like Vampire King's blood chalice needing to be a different color, Headless Executioner needing a head, etc.

Fyren
05-19-2015, 09:02 PM
Headless Executioner needing a head, etc.

"Headed Executioner" doesn't have the same ring to it, IMO.

Seriously, though, I love the international audience this game is generating. Speaks very well to Hex's future.

MatWith1T
05-19-2015, 09:03 PM
There were 10-15 art images that needed to change in Set 1. It wasn't that substantial. Stuff like Vampire King's blood chalice needing to be a different color, Headless Executioner needing a head, etc.

Chinese Headless Executioner is awesome... I hope it becomes a for-funsies AA card in the US, a la reactor bot or acolyte :)

Nero_Jinous
05-19-2015, 09:24 PM
Applied for the beta with my perfect world cn account and downloaded the client, but have not received an activation code yet. =(

funktion
05-19-2015, 09:33 PM
Headless executioner needing a head is pretty big deal. It breaks the space time continuum... how can Zoltog go back in time to cut off the executioner's head if the executioner still has his head?

Mejis
05-19-2015, 11:04 PM
Can anyone explain why zombies and e.g. Headless Executioner are such a big deal there? Why are such images an issue?

Also, so no Walking Dead for China??

bofedy
05-19-2015, 11:31 PM
As far as i know its due to respecting the dead, traditions and possibly religion. respect is a huge thing in china and asia. We have lost this in america and europe :(

Gwaer
05-19-2015, 11:36 PM
It doesn't actually exist AFAIK. Here's a good article. I think it can be summed up with a single word; expedience.

https://www.techinasia.com/china-doesnt-censor-skeletons-the-truth-about-game-censorship-in-the-middle-kingdom/

Also, China's China.

Jacklau89
05-20-2015, 01:23 AM
Chinese zombie :)
3407

Personally I don't think this is a big deal in any part of the Chinese culture nowadays. It's restrictive mainly because of unreasonable China's law than simply taboo.

The only things remain is that the number FOUR is consider bad luck because of its pronunciation coincides with death in Chinese, gifting someone a clock because it translates directly into "go to hell", etc. Of course all of these are nothing but superstition, much like how the old afraid of talking about cancer yet having all the salt fish they could find :rolleyes:(which is likely the mutagen of nasopharyngeal cancer).

bootlace
05-20-2015, 01:28 AM
It was pretty amusing the whole host of plagiarized fiveshards articles we found a few weeks ago. They have been watching for a bit. :)

That 'fan site' Kami linked took our Arena guide and made like 25 separate posts (half their site) with exact copy of everything including the strategy tips and even watermarked over the images we prepared for it. :/

KingGabriel
05-20-2015, 01:33 AM
That 'fan site' Kami linked took our Arena guide and made like 25 separate posts (half their site) with exact copy of everything including the strategy tips and even watermarked over the images we prepared for it. :/
Just do what we're planning to - make several baby yeti articles and call them the greatest decks ever created then wait for them to be copied :P

nickon
05-20-2015, 01:36 AM
That's just what Chinese are good at, copying stuff ;)

Armies
05-20-2015, 02:13 AM
Just do what we're planning to - make several baby yeti articles and call them the greatest decks ever created then wait for them to be copied :P

Genius! and when the baby yeti deck wins a tournament we will all have a good laugh :)

Ertzi
05-20-2015, 02:17 AM
Has the overall reception and vibe been positive in Asia though? That is all I want to know. I hope HEX makes a lot of new fans in there, so CZE can hire more people and we get more content and faster ^^

Is the game accepted, or just ignored? Is it already gaining momentum? Is there hype? That sort of thing.

bootlace
05-20-2015, 02:18 AM
Just do what we're planning to - make several baby yeti articles and call them the greatest decks ever created then wait for them to be copied :P

Operation YetiOpium?

KingGabriel
05-20-2015, 02:45 AM
Operation YetiOpium?
Operation ConfusedYeti! :P


Has the overall reception and vibe been positive in Asia though? That is all I want to know. I hope HEX makes a lot of new fans in there, so CZE can hire more people and we get more content and faster ^^

Is the game accepted, or just ignored? Is it already gaining momentum? Is there hype? That sort of thing.
Xiao/Tachithelion seems to think it's getting an overwhelmingly positive reception, which is nice to hear.

Ertzi
05-20-2015, 05:19 AM
Xiao/Tachithelion seems to think it's getting an overwhelmingly positive reception, which is nice to hear.

That's awesome!

Kami
05-20-2015, 06:37 AM
That 'fan site' Kami linked took our Arena guide and made like 25 separate posts (half their site) with exact copy of everything including the strategy tips and even watermarked over the images we prepared for it. :/

On the flip-side, it also means they respect your skills enough to use your guide. But yeah, they should've asked. Either that or they weren't sure how to contact you or they thought it was free game? *has no idea*

I'd wager once the communities get large enough, there will be a lot of back-and-forth regardless.

vickrpg
05-20-2015, 06:45 AM
Not really related, but do they use different art assets/card layouts? If so, can you post some? I don't have time to go poking through those websites and staring at symbols I don't understand ;)

I would love to see someone post these as well. Someone please do this.

Kami
05-20-2015, 07:47 AM
I kinda wonder if our KS codes are redeemable in other gardens. I'm semi-tempted to toss a random streamer one of the 30-booster pack codes.

Nero_Jinous
05-20-2015, 08:13 AM
I got this off the Chinese hex channel QQ chat: http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g66/NeroJinous/Image_1432134527107_zpsne9xc01z.png

tecnophi
05-20-2015, 09:16 AM
On the flip-side, it also means they respect your skills enough to use your guide. But yeah, they should've asked. Either that or they weren't sure how to contact you or they thought it was free game? *has no idea*

I'd wager once the communities get large enough, there will be a lot of back-and-forth regardless.

No... it's flat-out plagiarism.

Xenavire
05-20-2015, 09:23 AM
I got this off the Chinese hex channel QQ chat: http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g66/NeroJinous/Image_1432134527107_zpsne9xc01z.png

If we could get that art as an AA, it would be the greatest thing ever.

Kami
05-20-2015, 09:26 AM
No... it's flat-out plagiarism.

I never disagreed that it is.

Gwaer
05-20-2015, 09:34 AM
No... it's flat-out plagiarism.

If you don't want other countries/languages/people to take your articles your only recourse is don't post articles. This will happen a lot as the game gets more popular and more gardens open. It's not a big deal. Plagiarism isn't illegal. And if you want to go the copyright infringement route good luck trying that in other countries. It's not worth the time or effort to get upset about. If you really want that traffic get to translating all your articles into various languages and promoting them.

Chark
05-20-2015, 09:58 AM
I kinda wonder if our KS codes are redeemable in other gardens. I'm semi-tempted to toss a random streamer one of the 30-booster pack codes.

They are not. Each garden has their own code redemptions.

In any case, the current Chinese client is essentially in 'alpha' in a sense that we give them 300 boosters, 10,000 plat and 10x of each tournament ticket just for logging into the game. So don't worry about them getting product for a while.

Kami
05-20-2015, 10:10 AM
They are not. Each garden has their own code redemptions.

In any case, the current Chinese client is essentially in 'alpha' in a sense that we give them 300 boosters, 10,000 plat and 10x of each tournament ticket just for logging into the game. So don't worry about them getting product for a while.

Nifty. :P

nicosharp
05-20-2015, 10:13 AM
They are not. Each garden has their own code redemptions.

In any case, the current Chinese client is essentially in 'alpha' in a sense that we give them 300 boosters, 10,000 plat and 10x of each tournament ticket just for logging into the game. So don't worry about them getting product for a while.
When are we getting that in the beta client? :D

tecnophi
05-20-2015, 10:54 AM
If you don't want other countries/languages/people to take your articles your only recourse is don't post articles. This will happen a lot as the game gets more popular and more gardens open. It's not a big deal. Plagiarism isn't illegal. And if you want to go the copyright infringement route good luck trying that in other countries. It's not worth the time or effort to get upset about. If you really want that traffic get to translating all your articles into various languages and promoting them.

This might derail things... so fair warning to everyone...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagiarism

Sure it's not a crime, but it is dishonesty and overall quite scummy. The Hex community has been too tolerate of plagiarism and copying of user created content without any credit to the original source or originator. I'm sure there are may more cases, but here are some instances that I have noticed in the past...

First is HexTech copied FiveShards' Google form for decklist submission, publicly seen first used for the Diamond Cup in January 2015. No credit. Personally found it amusing that at that time HexTech's form had misspellings for champion names.

There's the Chinese fan site that copy/translate/paste articles from multiple English fansite, no idea how accurate the translation is. Again no credit.

Then there's the Clan BlackBlade Pauper's tournament copying most of Kroan's Rock League text. No credit. Not related plagiarism, but I find it amusing that both tournaments are occurring in the exact same time frame, down to the start time of "Monday 4th May - 0.01AM GMT (Runs 4 weeks)".

Gwaer
05-20-2015, 11:07 AM
They're fulfilling a market need. There were no chinese articles, they have a huge fan base that's interested in these articles, and translating them to chinese will help a lot of people get onboarded into the game, it's nothing but positive. I appreciate that many artists and creators hate their works to be used in any way other than by themselves, look at the sampling debates that happen over people using extremely small portions of others music to create wholly original works. Make a chinese site if you like, and drive traffic to it, and a spanish one as well. Otherwise getting up in arms over people translating articles for others and making them available in a site wholly dedicated to that language and release of the game is just petty.

Also, the rock league tournament decided to start at that same time after the CBB tournament posted its starting time using a similar form layout that people are used to. They didn't take the start time from them, there wasn't a rock league scheduled to start at the time they started their pauper tournament. Not that it's a problem they're both running at the same time, it's two different formats with two different groups, those groups may largely overlap, but it's not a problem.

As far as using the layout to describe the tournament, as I said in that thread it's a good layout, it's clear, people are used to it, and I hope most community run tournaments use one very much like it, rather than intentionally reinventing the wheel over and over again.

Example of sampling : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WoHxoz_0ykI
There are tons of articles dedicated to that guy you can read that delve into all manner of copyright, and fair use. This is a very complex subject that I follow very closely, it is a keen interest of mine. Your situation is definitely not that. It's more foreign language rights. But it doesn't have to be anything, since as I said above it is a net positive for the community to have these things available in other languages, If you want to make a stink about it, it will only color the opinions of people negatively against you, and perhaps the entire us/eu shard. And it's just not worth it.

Superjuice
05-20-2015, 12:07 PM
This might derail things... so fair warning to everyone...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plagiarism

Sure it's not a crime, but it is dishonesty and overall quite scummy. The Hex community has been too tolerate of plagiarism and copying of user created content without any credit to the original source or originator. I'm sure there are may more cases, but here are some instances that I have noticed in the past...

First is HexTech copied FiveShards' Google form for decklist submission, publicly seen first used for the Diamond Cup in January 2015. No credit. Personally found it amusing that at that time HexTech's form had misspellings for champion names.

There's the Chinese fan site that copy/translate/paste articles from multiple English fansite, no idea how accurate the translation is. Again no credit.

Then there's the Clan BlackBlade Pauper's tournament copying most of Kroan's Rock League text. No credit. Not related plagiarism, but I find it amusing that both tournaments are occurring in the exact same time frame, down to the start time of "Monday 4th May - 0.01AM GMT (Runs 4 weeks)".

Welcome to the internet, where people disregard morality for popularity.

MatWith1T
05-20-2015, 12:09 PM
As put so eloquently elsewhere, China is China

Ertzi
05-20-2015, 12:38 PM
"China China is"

-Yoda

Chark
05-20-2015, 02:22 PM
When are we getting that in the beta client? :D

You want wipes? Because that's how you get account wipes. ;)

Kroan
05-20-2015, 04:03 PM
Also, the rock league tournament decided to start at that same time after the CBB tournament posted its starting time using a similar form layout that people are used to.
I don't want to go into all the details how I feel about the re-use of my post (I can see technopi's point, but I rather have people use work I did to help the community than not help at all... I tried to stay out of that discussion as much as possible) but wanted to respond that the Rock League was slated for May before the CBB tournament was announced.
https://twitter.com/KroanNL/status/584429985882046464

Of course that wasn't an official announcement, so no-one of CBB could've know that, but just wanted to make it perfectly clear that I did not start up the next season of the Rock League to "compete" with any other tournament / league. :)

That is all. Sorry for further derailing this topic :P

Gwaer
05-20-2015, 04:12 PM
I didn't mean to imply that you had, simply that the CBB people didn't wholecloth copy your post with dates included as technophi alluded to.

Kroan
05-20-2015, 04:14 PM
I didn't mean to imply that you had
Intentions are often hard to read through the posts we make, so I just wanted to respond on that point. Not directed directly to you, but to anyone who might have thought differently :)

tecnophi
05-20-2015, 04:30 PM
Sorry for the further off-topic post...


But it doesn't have to be anything, since as I said above it is a net positive for the community to have these things available in other languages, If you want to make a stink about it, it will only color the opinions of people negatively against you, and perhaps the entire us/eu shard. And it's just not worth it.

I think this is where I strongly disagree. I do not believe the ends justifies the means. Net positive to the community is subjective and doesn't convince me of anything. As with the unattributed Chinese translation of English articles, I don't believe it is a positive thing. I would argue that the stealing of the content is possibly discouraging original Chinese Hex content from being made.

Proper citing of sources and re-directs to the original is all that is needed to avoid plagiarism. For the example of the Chinese translation, identify that it is a translation of an article from X site and where to find the original content with a link. To my knowledge none of the fansites have been contacted to get permission to re-host.

And... hmm... I don't exactly know how to respond to the part with people having negative opinions of my opinions. I like my opinions. If I didn't want people to judge me on my opinions, I wouldn't express them.

Showsni
05-20-2015, 04:45 PM
So I clicked the Coyotle: http://hex.wanmei.com/show.htm
and got a video featuring the word "Free" and a picture of the AA Mastery of Time. Can anyone translate?

Gwaer
05-20-2015, 05:51 PM
No one stole anything from you. If they had you'd no longer have access to it anymore.

magic_gazz
05-20-2015, 06:57 PM
It is not hard to give the source of information. Not doing that is just cheap and a mark against the person doing it.

On the other hand thought it is probably better for the game to have it out there in every language. The more content available the more people will see it, the more people that will join etc etc.

ossuary
05-20-2015, 07:33 PM
No one stole anything from you. If they had you'd no longer have access to it anymore.

Yes, it is not thievery, but it's still plagiarism. It's an extremely scummy thing to do without permission and without credit given (especially the sites who add their own watermarks to images and pass them off as original works). If they need content, fine, they can ASK instead of TAKING. That still allows them to fill a "necessary" role in the region without being cocks.

Kami
05-20-2015, 07:35 PM
:/

This thread kinda went the opposite direction of what I had hoped.

ossuary
05-20-2015, 07:42 PM
In the words of the late, great Ryan Davis... "China don't care."

What did you want to talk about, though? Maybe we can try to get back on track... :)

Chocmaw
05-21-2015, 01:13 AM
Have all 10,000 places in alpha been taken?

Jacklau89
05-21-2015, 01:31 AM
So I clicked the Coyotle: http://hex.wanmei.com/show.htm
and got a video featuring the word "Free" and a picture of the AA Mastery of Time. Can anyone translate?

Showsni that particular part of video was referring to you could gem your cards, for free to create your own unique combo. Then again not that an AA mastery of time has any socket.....

In short the video promotes Hex as not your traditional farming-level up MMORPG, but a card game that demand strategic interaction to your opponent's play, receiving constant updates, supporting both PVP and PVE, playable on pc and portable devices. At last it mentioned the Chinese server will be up soon.

To sum up, its nothing that we already know:)

Edit: Oh to be precise the video said its "runes", not gems or socket. So unless its referring to pve equipments, I'd assume they meant gems.

Cowbot
05-21-2015, 01:49 AM
That site still has lots of interesting stuff.

Someone asked what the "free" was while displaying the AA Master of time. It says literally "The free rune embedding system will make your cards even more unique." [免費符文镶嵌系統更能讓你的牌独一无二]

But in this case I'm pretty sure "rune embedding system" is referring to gem sockets.

What does this have to do with AA Mastery of time?

Nothing.

Edit: Beaten by 10 minutes because I can't read simplified Chinese :(

Jacklau89
05-21-2015, 01:54 AM
Edit: Beaten by 10 minutes because I can't read simplified Chinese :(

lol cowbot I never learned simplified Chinese too. Nevertheless they are similar enough for me to understand and speak them. But that also applies to Japanese too so this whole statement makes no sense at all :confused:

Cowbot
05-21-2015, 02:08 AM
I can understand a lot of it Jack, but the simplified + foreign dialect + loud music makes it quite tough for me to keep up.

If anyone else wants to know something about the Chinese site, I'm willing to help. (Unless Jack beats me to it :P)

Cowbot
05-21-2015, 02:58 AM
So here is my very basic guide to the Chinese site. (http://hex.wanmei.com/show.htm)

First: turn off the music in the upper-right hand corner.
The necrotic card leads to some excellent wallpapers.
The dwarf leads to a basic description of the setting.
The elf goes to a description of each race.
The human goes to a really cool video about the history of Entrath with great animated artwork and poetically bad Chinglish subtitles.

"Which caused a disaster and made the peaceful past only exist in history."
"The shards of Hex and their mysterious awoke the corpses"
"the ambitions of the immortals are lit up everywhere"

Overall, still a sweet video.

The coyotle leads to an amusing extremely Asian advertisement with cute cartoon shin'hare that emphasizes "If you're not into PvP, we have a huge world filled with PvE quests: 副本 (all forms of instanced content), BOSS, satisfy your equipment collecting addiction! PC, ipad, anytime, anywhere, you can play!" with big pictures of playing Hex on your phone.

I think the Chinese consumers are going to be disappointed

The orc just goes to information about Hex China. It's recruiting for future employees it seems, and has a bunch of outdated information, inviting people to visit the company on April 11th.


It's pretty high quality, but there are still tons of little errors everywhere.

*Elves don't have three prongs on their ears in any of the cartoons.
*Coyotles are translated as and illustrated as wolf-men. I know that coyote can be shortened to 狼, which is the same character as wolf, but this still makes me sad. They couldn't make it 郊狼人 or something?
*All the race names are capitalized!
*Gozzog has red eyes
*Human card with wild threshold?
*Gems are referred to as "runes" (符文) Which would be OK except for how important gems are to the setting.
*All the cards in the history video are socketed and ruby threshold.
*Hex: 集換英雄 = Hex: Collectible Heroes. (TCG Heroes? Trading Heroes?) Why heroes?

Ertzi
05-21-2015, 07:08 AM
Fascinating. Thanks for the descriptions. I have to check that site out when I have a bit more time.

vickrpg
05-21-2015, 08:43 AM
So here is my very basic guide to the Chinese site. (http://hex.wanmei.com/show.htm)

First: turn off the music in the upper-right hand corner.
The necrotic card leads to some excellent wallpapers.
The dwarf leads to a basic description of the setting.
The elf goes to a description of each race.
The human goes to a really cool video about the history of Entrath with great animated artwork and poetically bad Chinglish subtitles.

"Which caused a disaster and made the peaceful past only exist in history."
"The shards of Hex and their mysterious awoke the corpses"
"the ambitions of the immortals are lit up everywhere"

Overall, still a sweet video.

The coyotle leads to an amusing extremely Asian advertisement with cute cartoon shin'hare that emphasizes "If you're not into PvP, we have a huge world filled with PvE quests: 副本 (all forms of instanced content), BOSS, satisfy your equipment collecting addiction! PC, ipad, anytime, anywhere, you can play!" with big pictures of playing Hex on your phone.

I think the Chinese consumers are going to be disappointed

The orc just goes to information about Hex China. It's recruiting for future employees it seems, and has a bunch of outdated information, inviting people to visit the company on April 11th.


It's pretty high quality, but there are still tons of little errors everywhere.

*Elves don't have three prongs on their ears in any of the cartoons.
*Coyotles are translated as and illustrated as wolf-men. I know that coyote can be shortened to 狼, which is the same character as wolf, but this still makes me sad. They couldn't make it 郊狼人 or something?
*All the race names are capitalized!
*Gozzog has red eyes
*Human card with wild threshold?
*Gems are referred to as "runes" (符文) Which would be OK except for how important gems are to the setting.
*All the cards in the history video are socketed and ruby threshold.
*Hex: 集換英雄 = Hex: Collectible Heroes. (TCG Heroes? Trading Heroes?) Why heroes?
Thanks for the awesome descriptions! but actually, from what I can see the elves DO have 3 prongs, they're just brown and kind of blend into the background a bit. Also, I think they just switched the Human and Elf threshold, since the elf is diamond.

Cowbot
05-21-2015, 06:09 PM
I meant in the cartoon. I checked again, they definitely don't have the prongs.

I agree they probably just switched the elf and human images for some reason.