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magic_gazz
06-09-2015, 06:27 PM
Not sure if everyone has seen that they have been posted.

https://www.hextcg.com/may-vip-undefeated-decklists/

Nothing too out of the ordinary although I had not seen the mono sapphire with Sigh of the Sun yet. Put 3 people on 4-0 so it must be fairly good. Would be interested in hearing about the deck if any of those guys felt like sharing.

Unfortunatly still nothing that has inspired me for this weekends Blood Cup :(

Saeijou
06-09-2015, 08:03 PM
Unfortunatly still nothing that has inspired me for this weekends Blood Cup :(

there is always the 60 shard tetzok deck! ;)

magic_gazz
06-09-2015, 08:35 PM
there is always the 60 shard tetzok deck! ;)

I should have said that I want to do well.

Nothing beats that deck for consistency though, so it does have that.

havocattack
06-09-2015, 09:22 PM
Nothing too out of the ordinary although I had not seen the mono sapphire with Sigh of the Sun yet. Put 3 people on 4-0 so it must be fairly good. Would be interested in hearing about the deck if any of those guys felt like sharing.

It's what I ran for the cup of fate (was slightly different back then) but basically I made the deck as an evolution of my mono sapphire reese deck, you keep all the best stuff from mono sapphire and then with just sight of the sun added in, you have another must answer threat (in most cases) as well as opening up the sideboard with some more answers.

A turn 3 sight that goes unanswered allows you to potentially stick a threat (dreamer, wrenlocke etc) and protect it (cm, verdict)

Elwinz
06-10-2015, 06:29 AM
I am hapy to see there is a lot of monoblood decks there, in fatecup blood was almost not played. And my collection is definetly strongest of blood so i might join comptetive. Tje first blood deck with almost no troops in main deck is interesting

Herocomplexkid
06-10-2015, 06:53 AM
Ug, they mostly all look about the same. Gamers, am I right?

hammer
06-10-2015, 06:54 AM
It's what I ran for the cup of fate (was slightly different back then) but basically I made the deck as an evolution of my mono sapphire reese deck, you keep all the best stuff from mono sapphire and then with just sight of the sun added in, you have another must answer threat (in most cases) as well as opening up the sideboard with some more answers.

A turn 3 sight that goes unanswered allows you to potentially stick a threat (dreamer, wrenlocke etc) and protect it (cm, verdict)

I copied 75 from your cup of fate deck and made a 4-0 in the May VIP the deck is lots of fun and sight of the sun allows from some miraculous come-backs in the late game. This only tells part of the story I played 3 events all with the same 75 and went 2-2, 4-0 and 1-3 I do agree about wild opening up the sideboard and turbulence caught more than one vampire king off guard :D I have always loved the design of sight of the sun ever since my first omg that's broken knee-jerk reaction. Some great plays include Master of Time holding countermagic (to sight of the sun reset resources and protect with counter) if the Master resolves without a fight then Sight into Zodiac Divination to refuel the hand with buffed cards ready for the free turn is so strong. I lost badly to a very interesting one-eye open deck piloted by bosshoss but other than that all the games were close and I felt like I had a chance and won a couple of games from nowhere thanks to sight :D - fun times thanks for the deck Havoc :D

Salverus
06-10-2015, 06:56 AM
how many battles have each of these decks roughly won?
i mean if they do 1 battle and win it is undefeated too right?

hammer
06-10-2015, 06:58 AM
These decks all went 4-0 in terms of matches. Each match is best of 3

Salverus
06-10-2015, 07:11 AM
let the decks battle each other to find the true and only 'undefeated decklist' :cool:

strawwmann
06-10-2015, 07:14 AM
From a quick look:
21/29 decks had Sapphire
Only 3/29 decks used Wild, and all of those were just splashes
So the lack of balance between shards is as alive as ever,
reeeaally hoping that Myths is biased to Wild to restore balance & diversity.

Of the 21 Sapphire decks, only 7 did NOT use Reese
So ~half of all 4-0 decks managed to go unbeaten without Reese (that's a small achievement :) )

But I'll admit I'm as guilty as anyone - I played Diamond/Sapphire with Reese :(

Thrawn
06-10-2015, 07:34 AM
Gore Feast was in 13% of undefeated deck lists indicating it is a broken card causing a stale meta.

Wait, are we still doing that?

BossHoss
06-10-2015, 07:50 AM
I lost badly to a very interesting one-eye open deck piloted by bosshoss but other than that all the games were close and I felt like I had a chance and won a couple of games from nowhere thanks to sight :D - fun times thanks for the deck Havoc :D

If I had the time I would have loved to attempt 4-0 and get another Wurtil.dek the recognition it deserves but a busy weekend had me drop at 2-0 a couple times instead.

Incindium
06-10-2015, 07:51 AM
My mono wild deck went 3-1 and only lost to Hacky's but still took it the 3rd game... Wild matches up well enough against artifact heavy decks that we are seeing. I wish I'd had more than one compost in my sideboard.

strawwmann
06-10-2015, 07:54 AM
Gore Feast was in 13% of undefeated deck lists indicating it is a broken card causing a stale meta.
Wait, are we still doing that?

Yup fair call, 12/29 (so less than half now) of 4-0 decks played Mirror Knight, and that is paired in combos other than Gore Feast, so things have evolved a good bit, but not as much as some might have hoped.

Probably not helped that there are so few people being really creative in driving the meta (with most people, myself included, being more followers than creators).

Kami
06-10-2015, 08:21 AM
You'll not see a grand shift in the meta in tournaments like this solely due to the reward structure. The majority of people will not take risks because the AA cards are too valuable.

The majority of people will take what's been proven to work, maybe very slightly modify it, and run it to win for the sake of winning.

Part of the problem is that the AA card are only awarded to players who achieve 2-2 or better. In other words, some competitors earn nothing (beyond boosters for cards they likely already have) while having paid for VIP and the entry fee. The other part of the problem is that the deck lists from other tournaments are all posted in fairly close proximity to each other (i.e. within weeks).

People will want to just keep running whatever works, not necessarily what is experimental due to prizes.

Not a bad thing to want to win but if you really want to see a grand shift in meta, you'll need two things: 1. New cards, 2. No 'penalty' for trying something new.

Nearly every deck I faced in the VIP was some variation of a Fate Cup deck and the majority were running control/Reese. You cannot take into account only the 4-0s.

Stormlight
06-10-2015, 09:08 AM
Part of the problem is that the AA card are only awarded to players who achieve 2-2 or better. In other words, only half the competitors (or less).

A minor quibble (I'm not disagreeing with any of the rest of your post), but 2-2 or better is actually MORE than half of the competitors. Short explanation: 0-4 and 1-3 DON"T get AA, 2-2, 3-1, and 4-0 all DO get AA.

Longer explanation:

Out of 16 players, after 1 round: 8 at 1-0, 8 at 0-1
After 2 rounds: 4 at 2-0, 8 at 1-1, 4 at 0-2
After 3 rounds: 2 at 3-0, 6 at 2-1, 6 at 1-2, 2 at 0-3
After 4 rounds: 1 at 4-0, 4 at 3-1, 6 at 2-2, 4 at 1-3, 1 at 0-4

So roughly 11/16 players will go 2-2 or better. (Half would be if you needed two wins after only three rounds, but after four rounds half of the people who were 1-2 are able to get that second win.)

Kami
06-10-2015, 09:16 AM
A minor quibble (I'm not disagreeing with any of the rest of your post), but 2-2 or better is actually MORE than half of the competitors. Short explanation: 0-4 and 1-3 DON"T get AA, 2-2, 3-1, and 4-0 all DO get AA.

Longer explanation:

Out of 16 players, after 1 round: 8 at 1-0, 8 at 0-1
After 2 rounds: 4 at 2-0, 8 at 1-1, 4 at 0-2
After 3 rounds: 2 at 3-0, 6 at 2-1, 6 at 1-2, 2 at 0-3
After 4 rounds: 1 at 4-0, 4 at 3-1, 6 at 2-2, 4 at 1-3, 1 at 0-4

So roughly 11/16 players will go 2-2 or better. (Half would be if you needed two wins after only three rounds, but after four rounds half of the people who were 1-2 are able to get that second win.)

Sorry, you're right. Math failure. Heh.

Bmon
06-10-2015, 09:21 AM
The May 4-0 VIP list includes 9 distinct deck archetypes and features the resurgence of Blood control, dwarves taking a significant portion of the wins, only a single Mono S deck going 4-0, more players switching to S/x for added flexibility, and no single deck archetype representing more than 17% of the winning deck lists.

A quick glance at the list plus confirmation bias might lead you to believe the metagame is stale. The metagame is not stale if you take the time to look at the actual statistics.

Quick plug: If you want in depth constructed deck lists and statistics and you're looking for a guild, consider joining us over at TeamClockwork.

Ditsch
06-10-2015, 09:28 AM
In my eyes it was more varied then ever with a low amount of gorefeast decks and a bit more dwarves decks then before but I don't see dwarves dominating the meta so it's okay. (I only lost to dwarves once and that was due to a crappy draw and insane luck for them).

Feegert
06-10-2015, 02:45 PM
Glad to see that Wild is having such a strong presence in the tournament scene. I saw "Seeker of the Sun" and "Wild Shard" in some of the decks. Someone even had 3 or 4 Wild action cards in their reserve.

f5shooter
06-11-2015, 12:36 PM
I love looking at this stuff....

The most popular Champ/shards were:

5: Sapphire/Ruby - Poca
4: Sapphire/Ruby - Bertram
4: Sapphire/Ruby - Tetzot
3: Blood/Diamond - Dimmid
3: Sapphire/Wild - Bertram
2: Sapphire/Diamond - Dimmid
2: Mono Blood - Zared
1: Mono Sapphire - Bertram
1: Mono Blood - Kranok
1: Mono Blood - Bunoshi
1: Sapphire/Blood - Bertram
1: Sapphire/Blood - Zared
1: Blood/Ruby - Zared

Saeijou
06-11-2015, 01:07 PM
I love looking at this stuff....

The most popular Champ/shards were:

5: Sapphire/Ruby - Poca
4: Sapphire/Ruby - Bertram
4: Sapphire/Ruby - Tetzot
3: Blood/Diamond - Dimmid
3: Sapphire/Wild - Bertram
2: Sapphire/Diamond - Dimmid
2: Mono Blood - Zared
1: Mono Sapphire - Bertram
1: Mono Blood - Kranok
1: Mono Blood - Bunoshi
1: Sapphire/Blood - Bertram
1: Sapphire/Blood - Zared
1: Blood/Ruby - Zared

either saphire or blood it is :D