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Zophie
07-10-2015, 01:41 PM
Just saw this update on the Gameforge Hex forums:

http://board.hex.gameforge.com/board28-english-section-en/board35-updates-important-information/2327-hex-friday-update-treasures-and-things/


VIP is returning!
That’s right: we’re re-launching the VIP program! This program gives players the opportunity to participate in VIP tournaments where they can win special alternative art cards (AAs).

VIP access can be purchased for the following durations:
• 1 month
• 3 months
• 12 months

You will receive 1 VIP ticket per month, and all tickets are instantly sent to you. These tickets have no expiry date, so you can use them whenever you want. Additionally, for as long as your VIP subscription lasts, you will get 1 booster pack from the latest set every week.
Finally, if you subscribe for a whole year, you will receive a special VIP sleeve as a thank you for supporting HEX. The sleeve will be unlocked directly after purchasing a year's worth of VIP access. If you have already benefited from a year of VIP access in the past, you will receive the sleeve right away. The VIP program will cost 7 euros per month

UPDATE: Official HXE post on main page up now: https://www.hextcg.com/vip-is-returning/

Looks like it will be $8 USD, and an FAQ will follow soon with more details.

fabriazp
07-10-2015, 01:47 PM
i love this ^ hope it can be bought tru plat in game

pjvedder
07-10-2015, 01:47 PM
The VIP tickets don't expire this time around, which is interesting. Plus there's the sleeve (and luckily it's retroactive for past 1-year VIPs!)

ghulzen
07-10-2015, 01:48 PM
Very nice. I wonder when this goes live.

Fyren
07-10-2015, 01:50 PM
So on that pricing it's "Buy packs on a regular basis, get VIP tournament tickets for free as a bonus."

I'm cool with that. I'm glad that it's accessible.

nicosharp
07-10-2015, 01:51 PM
This is very important and great for the longevity of HEX.

Kami
07-10-2015, 01:52 PM
I'll admit I'm a bit disappointed that this is all that VIP is.

I was hoping for less PvP focus and more general something.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 01:52 PM
So on that pricing it's "Buy packs on a regular basis, get VIP tournament tickets for free as a bonus."

I'm cool with that. I'm glad that it's accessible.

Absolutely, I think it's still a pretty good deal even if it's close to cost, plus you are helping support Hex so win-win!

Yoss
07-10-2015, 01:59 PM
Called it!

While the particular suggestion may not work, there can be a subscription model that does work without breaking things like the old VIP did. The old VIP system had multiple problems: (1) it didn't require a large enough commitment to qualify for discounts and (2) the discounts were too large. They could easily rerelease the exact same VIP system (pack per week, VIP ticket per month) with a minimum buy in of 1 year and with a price increase (maybe 20% discount instead of 50% like before).

Grimshaw
07-10-2015, 02:03 PM
I'm inclined to agree with you, Kami. I sort of expected, with how long it's been away, that they were redesigning it a bit.

Do we know whether the program will be offered through the in-game store? Perhaps we'll have this VIPvP program that is a plat purchase, and then they could offer a future VIPvE program purchasable with gold that offers something for the dungeon/arena players.

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:04 PM
Called it!

Except that now there is no discount (7 euro will be around 8$ us) You'll get VIP (which is good) and AA sleeves if you buy a year. (hopefully they change every year)

Now i would like to know if you can buy more than 1x subscription (to get 2 packs a week and 24 vip. ) for those that want to play more VIP :)

darkwonders
07-10-2015, 02:05 PM
I'll admit I'm a bit disappointed that this is all that VIP is.

I was hoping for less PvP focus and more general something.

They might add PvE stuff in the future when we actually have more PvE stuff to do.

Fyren
07-10-2015, 02:05 PM
I'm inclined to agree with you, Kami. I sort of expected, with how long it's been away, that they were redesigning it a bit.

Do we know whether the program will be offered through the in-game store? Perhaps we'll have this VIPvP program that is a plat purchase, and then they could offer a future VIPvE program purchasable with gold that offers something for the dungeon/arena players.

That's kinda what I was thinking. PVE features could be added later or as a separate program when PVE genuinely launches. There's not a lot of reason for a PVE-focused VIP program just this second.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 02:07 PM
I really wish the sub was plat-based. The game needs more plat sinks, judging by the rather abysmal gray market rates for cashing out.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 02:08 PM
Except that now there is no discount (7 euro will be around 8$ us) You'll get VIP (which is good) and AA sleeves if you buy a year. (hopefully they change every year)

Now i would like to know if you can buy more than 1x subscription (to get 2 packs a week and 24 vip. ) for those that want to play more VIP :)

Fair enough. Sorta called it! :p

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:09 PM
I really wish the sub was plat-based. The game needs more plat sinks, judging by the rather abysmal gray market rates for cashing out.

Agreed

pjvedder
07-10-2015, 02:10 PM
I'm inclined to agree with you, Kami. I sort of expected, with how long it's been away, that they were redesigning it a bit.


Well wasn't the whole reason they took it down because people were abusing it to get the packs. They just had to come up with some way to fix that aspect of it. Aside from that, the VIP has been pretty successful i think, so I don't know if they had any real reason to modify THAT much this time around.

Of course, people are suggesting that there could be a PVE-esque VIP down the road, which is entirely possible, but HXE probably just wanted to get the old VIP system back up and running again.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 02:11 PM
That's kinda what I was thinking. PVE features could be added later or as a separate program when PVE genuinely launches. There's not a lot of reason for a PVE-focused VIP program just this second.

Yeah I wouldn't expect anything PVE related yet but it would be neat in the future after the full PVE campaign is released. Maybe they could give a +20% XP/gold gain bonus or something like that.

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:14 PM
Well wasn't the whole reason they took it down because people were abusing it to get the packs. They just had to come up with some way to fix that aspect of it. Aside from that, the VIP has been pretty successful i think, so I don't know if they had any real reason to modify THAT much this time around.

Of course, people are suggesting that there could be a PVE-esque VIP down the road, which is entirely possible, but HXE probably just wanted to get the old VIP system back up and running again.


Its no problem that they give no discount as that was the problem but why wait almost 1 year for the same thing?? They just increased the price to not reflect any discount.

vulture27
07-10-2015, 02:14 PM
I really wish the sub was plat-based. The game needs more plat sinks, judging by the rather abysmal gray market rates for cashing out.

Also agreed. If its plat that's great that its a sink and supports the in game economy.

If its cash only they missed the mark completely.

hex_colin
07-10-2015, 02:17 PM
The VIP sleeves are AMAZING! And unlike any we've seen before! :)

Poetic
07-10-2015, 02:18 PM
I was in already, but I'm excited about the sleeves. Glad it's coming back for more people to get in on.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 02:19 PM
Its no problem that they give no discount as that was the problem but why wait almost 1 year for the same thing?? They just increased the price to not reflect any discount.

Not quite the same thing, they're adding on a bonus sleeve for 1-year subs, and it looks like VIP tickets will no longer expire month to month. Also HXE hasn't confirmed what the USD pricing will be exactly yet, but it looks like it'll still be a slight discount from purchasing individual packs from the store. Even if you can get them cheaper on AH you can't get Primal packs from AH purchased packs but you can from VIP subs so even a small discount is still good.

Poetic
07-10-2015, 02:20 PM
The tournament and chance at winning AAs is always the best part.

Tazelbain
07-10-2015, 02:20 PM
VIP should be all one thing but there should (when PvE is far more developed) a PvE event to spend your token instead PvP event.

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:21 PM
Also agreed. If its plat that's great that its a sink and supports the in game economy.

If its cash only they missed the mark completely.

Its probably Cash..otherwise they would of not say 7 EURO.. they would of said either 8US or x amount of plat..... Which means boosters are actually more expensive (vs AH)

Saeijou
07-10-2015, 02:23 PM
why did they change their mind?

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:23 PM
The VIP sleeves are AMAZING! And unlike any we've seen before! :)

Can we stack the VIPs (buy 2 of them and get 2x boosters 24 vip tickets ?) (i know it wont stack the sleeves :) )

LordGorchnik
07-10-2015, 02:24 PM
Definitely of the mindset with Kami that I was hoping VIP would be more "something for everyone" rather than "something for PvP" players.

Good to see the option there though for those who enjoy it.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 02:26 PM
Can we stack the VIPs (buy 2 of them and get 2x boosters 24 vip tickets ?) (i know it wont stack the sleeves :) )

I would hope they stack. Stacking was the entire problem last time.

FlyingMeatchip
07-10-2015, 02:27 PM
With the lackluster AA's from the last cycle I might not take part in this VIP offer.

Poetic
07-10-2015, 02:27 PM
Makes sense since the PvP side is supposed to be the pay side. (Well aware that PVE players are willing to spend money).

Could alienate new players expecting f2p and missing out on special PVE events, content, etc.

Saeijou
07-10-2015, 02:32 PM
has anyone ever got a primal pack from the VIP?

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:32 PM
Makes sense since the PvP side is supposed to be the pay side. (Well aware that PVE players are willing to spend money).

Could alienate new players expecting f2p and missing out on special PVE events, content, etc.

There should always be a free PVE and a Paying PVE but i think thats against the their vision of paywall that most free to play games offer. Just that Hex needs to make money and at this rate (just draft mostly) I don't think they are making enough to support all the things they want to add ( I am sure they will be more PVE content as time goes by as the structure will already be in place)

Zophie
07-10-2015, 02:32 PM
Its probably Cash..otherwise they would of not say 7 EURO.. they would of said either 8US or x amount of plat..... Which means boosters are actually more expensive (vs AH)

Well we still haven't gotten a full update from HXE on this yet, so we should wait for that before assuming it's cash only. It might be, but I'm not jumping to any conclusions yet until we get more info.


has anyone ever got a primal pack from the VIP?

I have once, many moons ago.

Hadry
07-10-2015, 02:37 PM
I wish they do the VIP tickets tradeable and not only non expiring. They keep going unused month after month for me, as i dont really like PvP :S. That way the VIP system could be a bit more interesting for PvE players, as they cna trade the tickets for gold or plat :<

hex_colin
07-10-2015, 02:37 PM
I wish they do the VIP tickets tradeable and not only non expiring. They keep going unused month after month for me, as i dont really like PvP :S. That way the VIP system could be a bit more interesting for PvE players, as they cna trade the tickets for gold or plat :<

Making them tradable would open it up to so much abuse. That's just not going to happen.

superdax
07-10-2015, 02:39 PM
I wish they do the VIP tickets tradeable and not only non expiring. They keep going unused month after month for me, as i dont really like PvP :S. That way the VIP system could be a bit more interesting for PvE players, as they cna trade the tickets for gold or plat :<

Then why would you subscribe to the VIP if you don't like PVP????

Hadry
07-10-2015, 02:44 PM
Making them tradable would open it up to so much abuse. That's just not going to happen.

Ye i suppose its not easy to manage it when you can get multiple accounts moving packs and tickets to just one, and the resources to track it just dosnt worth it. It just something i would find nice, but its hard to get pretty things when ppl is just thinknig how to xploit it :<.

@superdax the discount in the packs was nice enough, but i feel a bit sad about the tickets. I will rather have something PvE related.

Saeijou
07-10-2015, 02:44 PM
Then why would you subscribe to the VIP if you don't like PVP????

because you get valuable AA ;)

hammer
07-10-2015, 03:34 PM
The VIP sleeves are AMAZING! And unlike any we've seen before! :)

Dynamic? showing the date you joined vip? - that would be amazing and unlike what we've seen

hammer
07-10-2015, 03:36 PM
With the lackluster AA's from the last cycle I might not take part in this VIP offer.

really ? I like the new VIP AA especially Carnasaurus AA I have a feeling he will be better than people expect :)

Yoss
07-10-2015, 03:36 PM
Making them tradable would open it up to so much abuse. That's just not going to happen.

Maybe I just don't have a criminal mind, but how would it be abused? The system hopefully already will allow stacking, at which point I don't see much left to worry about. If it won't allow stacking, then I don't see how this new VIP is any better than the old one in regards to fixing the problems it had.

Oli
07-10-2015, 03:36 PM
I would really like to see a VIP-sealed-gaunlet.
The usual tournaments require just too much time at once.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 03:38 PM
Official HXE update on main page: https://www.hextcg.com/vip-is-returning/

Looks like it's $8 USD, and an FAQ will follow soon with more details.

hammer
07-10-2015, 03:40 PM
Official HXE update on main page: https://www.hextcg.com/vip-is-returning/

Looks like it's $8 USD

Thanks Zophie, still no picture of dat sleeve though - curious if sleeve is annual or a one-off

Zophie
07-10-2015, 03:46 PM
The VIP sleeves are AMAZING! And unlike any we've seen before! :)

Oooh, Animated Blue Wheel of Death sleeves with lightning effects that shoot off the cards and lights up the gameboard dynamically?! :cool:

Yoss
07-10-2015, 03:46 PM
Not a plat sink. Too bad.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 03:47 PM
Not a plat sink. Too bad.

I'm still gonna wait for the FAQ for confirmation of this, we'll see. Not a deal breaker for me if they don't though.

Peseto
07-10-2015, 03:51 PM
I'm glad its back, but i really hope they allow it to be purchasable with plat through the in-game store.
I understand, that there are reasons for them to only allow real money purchases, but i feel like there are so many downsides of that approach:


For one, we will hear tons of f2p players complaints, that the biggest ingame event is out of their reach indefenitely.


Also it punishes all the players that go infinite, through either drafting or auction house trading, since they can't use their hard earned platinum for these events.


And worst of all, it sends the message that they don't value their in-game currency as much as its real world equivalent. This could cause less confidence in plat.


Not to forget, it could also confuse new players: For instance, lets assume a new player liked the game so much that he spent his entire gaming budget e.g. 100$ on plat. Later he finds out about VIP-tourneys and wants to join them, but unfortunately cant use his plat on it. This might turn him away from buying plat in the future.

Incindium
07-10-2015, 03:55 PM
Hmm so you pay $96 for $104 worth of packs(can Primal packs drop from VIP packs?) but you get tickets to play in VIP tourneys where you can earn VIP AA's which won't be worth near as much as current ones(but probably still decent value).

Fyren
07-10-2015, 04:01 PM
Thanks Zophie, still no picture of dat sleeve though - curious if sleeve is annual or a one-off

Unless it's the vixen in the picture accompanying, in which case I'm in. :3

Do the packs have a primal proc chance? Probably should at full price.

Zophie
07-10-2015, 04:03 PM
Do the packs have a primal proc chance? Probably should at full price.

Yes VIP packs can proc a primal just like packs bought from the store.

hammer
07-10-2015, 04:05 PM
Unless it's the vixen in the picture accompanying, in which case I'm in. :3

Do the packs have a primal proc chance? Probably should at full price.

Nope that's Brown Fox Scout AA from set 3 wheels of fate

Fyren
07-10-2015, 04:14 PM
Nope that's Brown Fox Scout AA from set 3 wheels of fate

I know, I was just ... Oh wait, that IS a sleeve, isn't it. Wheels of Fate. XD Okay, then I'm just curious still!

plaguedealer
07-10-2015, 04:36 PM
I fine with this being a non plat sink, will be purchasing 1 year even though I have alot of time left on my current vip.

FlyingMeatchip
07-10-2015, 04:44 PM
If VIP overall value is going to be lowered by increased cost....can we get the packs all at once with the tickets?

DanTheMeek
07-10-2015, 05:16 PM
Overall I rather like the change, you're basically agreeing to not only buy packs at full price, but receive them on a delay, in exchange for VIP tournament tickets (and one time for sleeves as well if you go for the full year). The value is no longer such that it encourages making false accounts to buy extra VIPs and trade the packs to your main account, instead it mainly functions as a reward for people who want to buy packs at full price with real money to support the game by giving them access to a special monthly tournament which itself still have an entree but has the potential, but not guarantee, of winning unique alternate art cards which have no inherent advantage over their regular counter parts.

I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I'm a little disappointed that it doesn't appeal to pve players like myself, this is definitely not something I ever see myself signing up for again since my VIP tickets mostly just expire unused as it is, but I think the VIP is a REALLY cool pvp experience that I'm extremely happy that all players can now take part in if they wish.

Jonesy
07-10-2015, 05:20 PM
I'm glad its back, but i really hope they allow it to be purchasable with plat through the in-game store.
I understand, that there are reasons for them to only allow real money purchases, but i feel like there are so many downsides of that approach:


For one, we will hear tons of f2p players complaints, that the biggest ingame event is out of their reach indefenitely.


Also it punishes all the players that go infinite, through either drafting or auction house trading, since they can't use their hard earned platinum for these events.


And worst of all, it sends the message that they don't value their in-game currency as much as its real world equivalent. This could cause less confidence in plat.


Not to forget, it could also confuse new players: For instance, lets assume a new player liked the game so much that he spent his entire gaming budget e.g. 100$ on plat. Later he finds out about VIP-tourneys and wants to join them, but unfortunately cant use his plat on it. This might turn him away from buying plat in the future.


Its a VIP program, its for VIPs, F2P people aren't VIPs. It doesn't offer access to any aspect of the game that is closed off from others. Anyone who doesn't want to pay the money for it isn't entitled to what it provides.

katkillad
07-10-2015, 06:04 PM
Its a VIP program, its for VIPs, F2P people aren't VIPs. It doesn't offer access to any aspect of the game that is closed off from others. Anyone who doesn't want to pay the money for it isn't entitled to what it provides.

Yea I don't understand the comments about people wanting a VIP/Subscription option for PVE when PVE is the free to play aspect of the game, so why would they make a program that costs money for the free to play part of the game? Even if it did make sense, what exactly could they offer without dungeons and raids being in the game yet?

The new VIP program does exactly what it needed to do compared to the last one, solve the problem with people gaming the system and letting more people in now that the majority of peoples VIP time would be running out in the next couple of months.

IronPheasant
07-10-2015, 07:11 PM
The value is no longer such that it encourages making false accounts to buy extra VIPs

Of course it does, unless you can have multiple concurrent subs going on the same account.

Receiving boosters on a delay is a pretty hard roadblock after the amount of time you have to wait exceeds your remaining life span. Assuming they don't cure aging/death in the meantime. And even if they did, still, decades to receive a $2 booster is a bit much, no?

Biz
07-10-2015, 07:45 PM
the devs sold this game on the premise that cards/collections would have value and not just be virtual dust

making this purchasable with platinum would do a little bit to substantiate those claims

Fyren
07-10-2015, 07:46 PM
the devs sold this game on the premise that cards/collections would have value and not just be virtual dust

making this purchasable with platinum would do a little bit to substantiate those claims

Er... not that I feel particularly heavily about cash vs. plat on VIP, but... how?

Yoss
07-10-2015, 08:07 PM
Er... not that I feel particularly heavily about cash vs. plat on VIP, but... how?

Pretty simple, actually. If players do not spend enough plat, it piles up and becomes worth less compared to $US. As of today, it's a paltry 55% ($0.55 per 100p) on the gray market. In other words, anyone who buys plat from the official store is losing 40% of their money compared to the market-based exchange rate. Compare that to MTGO where tickets retain over 90% value relative to real money.

EDIT:
Updated numbers from actual deal on the market.

Sparrow
07-10-2015, 08:11 PM
I'm kind of mixed about it. Pay retail for 4 packs every month and then spend more money to enter a special event every month. So, if you want to get value from the VIP membership you have to spend much more than $8 AND do somewhat well in the VIP event?

I'm sure I'll sign up for VIP, don't get me wrong, but I'm a little underwhelmed by it.

Fyren
07-10-2015, 08:11 PM
Pretty simple, actually. If players do not spend enough plat, it piles up and becomes worth less compared to $US. As of today, it's a paltry 60% (60p per dollar) on the gray market. In other words, anyone who buys plat from the official store is losing 40% of their money compared to the market-based exchange rate. Compare that to MTGO where tickets retain over 90% value relative to real money.

Ahh, would do a little BIT to substantiate those claims. Okay, that makes sense.

Gwaer
07-10-2015, 08:22 PM
Yoss, you keep mentioning this incredible gray market discount. But hiding behind it being gray market so not substantiating the claim at all. Right this second the best discount I can find is 11% from g2a.com If you PM me and let me verify this claim I'll stop giving you a hard time about it, but until then. Kindly stop spouting nonsense, ty.

Fyren
07-10-2015, 08:29 PM
Yoss, you keep mentioning this incredible gray market discount. But hiding behind it being gray market so not substantiating the claim at all. Right this second the best discount I can find is 11% from g2a.com If you PM me and let me verify this claim I'll stop giving you a hard time about it, but until then. Kindly stop spouting nonsense, ty.

40% is more than I've managed, but I have consistently seen a decent 30% from G2A's site.

EDIT: Redacted until can verify rules: re posting of grey-market links

At the time of this writing, it's showing a price of $51.79 from the primary offer, and offers at $47.09 - which G2A fees will bump up to around $49-50 anyway, so 30% seems like a reasonable estimate. Yoss may have better, but I'll admit to not having seen that.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 08:39 PM
Yoss, you keep mentioning this incredible gray market discount. But hiding behind it being gray market so not substantiating the claim at all. Right this second the best discount I can find is 11% from g2a.com If you PM me and let me verify this claim I'll stop giving you a hard time about it, but until then. Kindly stop spouting nonsense, ty.

Last I checked, we're not allowed to post links to gray market in these forums. Will send PM.

EDIT: sent

Gwaer
07-10-2015, 08:39 PM
40% is more than I've managed, but I have consistently seen a decent 30% from G2A's site.

https://www.g2a.com/gameforge-e-pin-50-euro-game-card-eu.html

At the time of this writing, it's showing a price of $51.79 from the primary offer, and offers at $47.09 - which G2A fees will bump up to around $49-50 anyway, so 30% seems like a reasonable estimate. Yoss may have better, but I'll admit to not having seen that.

after fees you're looking at 50usd for 50euro. 50 euro is worth in todays exchange 55usd. so for 50usd you're getting around $55, which is a savings of around 9%.

Fyren
07-10-2015, 08:43 PM
after fees you're looking at 50usd for 50euro. 50 euro is worth in todays exchange 55usd. so for 50usd you're getting around $55, which is a savings of around 9%.

The prices I listed >were< in USD, For a code that generates 7000 platinum.


Last I checked, we're not allowed to post links to gray market in these forums. Will send PM.

EDIT: sent

Ah, removed link then, if that's the case. It wouldn't be hard to find, though.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 08:44 PM
Updated my previous post with actual deal from the site I was talking about (no links). Deal was 45% discount for a peer-to-peer trade.

katkillad
07-10-2015, 08:46 PM
I'm not going to post any links, but the grey market site I'm aware of has 4k plat for $21 is the cheapest I'm seeing it. I don't necessarily think it should have much to do with if hex has a plat option for VIP though. Hex would probably never see any money from myself and players in a similar situation if everything was available for plat.

Gwaer
07-10-2015, 08:47 PM
Updated my previous post with actual deal from the site I was talking about (no links). Deal was 45% discount for a peer-to-peer trade.

I checked out yoss' link, and a trade did happen at the prices he stated, but it's not available for anyone to take. Afaik no one can go and get a 40% discount right now. The fact that a trade has happened at that price is not indicative of those kinds of trades being available regularly, so your statement of people losing out on 40% for buying from the official store is provably false.

^it is also the place katkillad is talking about most likely, since that is the most recent trade, but it has already completed, and was apparently a one time offer and is no longer available.

Gwaer
07-10-2015, 08:51 PM
if 50 euro gets you 7000 platinum, the issue is that the euro is a lot weaker than it was when prices were set and they need to be redone to reflect the current market. if 50 euro got you 5500plat as it should it wouldn't be an issue.

Yoss
07-10-2015, 08:54 PM
I checked out yoss' link, and a trade did happen at the prices he stated, but it's not available for anyone to take. Afaik no one can go and get a 40% discount right now. The fact that a trade has happened at that price is not indicative of those kinds of trades being available regularly, so your statement of people losing out on 40% for buying from the official store is provably false.

^it is also the place katkillad is talking about most likely, since that is the most recent trade, but it has already completed, and was apparently a one time offer and is no longer available.

The deal still has 8000p available out of the original 16000p.

Rather than put this in PM (link removed):


<link removed>

Scroll down to hex. First one I saw for plat said "4000 plat for 22$ and primal pack".

All of those are completed/very old. I can't go today and buy plat for a 40% discount. At least at g2a i can actually go get a discount right now, I'll concede 11%, which is being generous. But this site doesn't actually seem to have any stock. Just because a couple of people have sold out for a loss doesn't mean that you can get plat at that steep of a discount reliably/at all.
I'll agree it's not unlimited supply. However, there's another deal that just popped up today (as they do regularly) for "Selling 4,000 Platinum for $21 (16,000 for sale)". Yes, there are caveats. Yes, you might have to wait a day or two to hit the best deals. Yes, there's risk of scam. Factor all that in and some players will want to go with something safer like a 15% discounted gift card deal (like I did a while back for Sports Authority). Still, the fact is that when a player wants to cash out (who does not own a major store) he has to take a 40% cut in order to hit marketable rates.

Gwaer
07-10-2015, 09:03 PM
a 40% cut on a site that doesn't even list things like mtgo tickets in an unknown corner of the internet is not a good indicator for how plat will maintain value. It's a datapoint not a trend. As the secondary market gets stronger with better competition these numbers should increase. It will be easier and more reliable to turn plat into cash, via cards or whatever mechanisms are available, and different 3rd parties will be competing for your business. But yes, that deal does exist in limited quantity, I concede. I just don't think it means what you think it means.

Alamand
07-10-2015, 09:46 PM
The new ViP doesn't seem like the best deal, You're pretty much paying a premium on the booster packs and being forced to wait for them in exchange for ViP tickets, which are only worth anything if you really like bigger tournaments or can consistently do well in them. Not to mention that the AAs will probably be worth quite a bit less since more people will be getting them now.

I think I'll be passing on this despite how much I wish I had been playing early enough to get in on the first ViP unless the sleeve is something I absolutely love. Though I'll agree with others, if this was available for plat I'd sign up for it without a second thought.

Sparrow
07-10-2015, 11:47 PM
MTGO is backed by hard currency -- physical cards, in other words. MTGO tix will always have closer to 1:$1.00 correlation because of this. So, comparing Hex to MTGO in this regard isn't a fair comparison.

Oli
07-10-2015, 11:58 PM
I would be soo hyped for VIP if they could open gaunlets (maybe lasting a week) in addition to the tournaments.
I bought into VIP, but didn't have the time to play in even one tourney.

katkillad
07-11-2015, 12:08 AM
The new ViP doesn't seem like the best deal, You're pretty much paying a premium on the booster packs and being forced to wait for them in exchange for ViP tickets, which are only worth anything if you really like bigger tournaments or can consistently do well in them. Not to mention that the AAs will probably be worth quite a bit less since more people will be getting them now.

I think I'll be passing on this despite how much I wish I had been playing early enough to get in on the first ViP unless the sleeve is something I absolutely love. Though I'll agree with others, if this was available for plat I'd sign up for it without a second thought.

How is it paying a premium for packs? A month costs $8 and you get a pack a week and the packs are $2 retail. You are getting the VIP ticket for free basically.

Fyren
07-11-2015, 12:17 AM
How is it paying a premium for packs? A month costs $8 and you get a pack a week and the packs are $2 retail. You are getting the VIP ticket for free basically.

The argument that those are more expensive stems from the fact that 200 platinum isn't equivalent to $2.00USD, because it is relatively easy to get significant discounts (Slightly less than 30%) on platinum from certain external sites such as G2A.com, which is advertised by one of our major streamers.

EDIT: To be entirely mathematically fair, if a full year of subscription indeed encompasses 52 weeks, then what you're paying over the long run is 96/52 or about $1.85 a pack.

Based on a comparison to a 30% discounted platinum rate, that means that each VIP ticket is costing a premium of just under $2.00 if my 2:30AM Math is right.

Ertzi
07-11-2015, 01:32 AM
(I have only read the first page of the thread before posting. Too many thoughts, gotta reply.)

Very disappointed with this implementation. This forces people to PvP if they want value from the VIP, which I never liked. This is also a surprisingly boring solution, given CZE's track record of coming up with something cool and fun for all. If there were no sleeves, I might not participate at all, but there is, so they will get my money again. So, congratz and well played I guess.

I really hope you can only buy the VIP with real money. The goal is to make money for CZE, and if you can buy the VIP with plat, all those backers with millions of packs and hundreds of thousands of plat at all times can just buy it without contributing anything further.

I really hoped for something much more inventive.

RanaDunes
07-11-2015, 02:38 AM
(I have only read the first page of the thread before posting. Too many thoughts, gotta reply.)

Very disappointed with this implementation. This forces people to PvP if they want value from the VIP, which I never liked. This is also a surprisingly boring solution, given CZE's track record of coming up with something cool and fun for all. If there were no sleeves, I might not participate at all, but there is, so they will get my money again. So, congratz and well played I guess.

I really hope you can only buy the VIP with real money. The goal is to make money for CZE, and if you can buy the VIP with plat, all those backers with millions of packs and hundreds of thousands of plat at all times can just buy it without contributing anything further.

I really hoped for something much more inventive.

But why don't you try and participate in the tournament?
Especially if it was Sealed, what are you going to lose? Just hop in make some deck and have fun doing that deck and play a few games. Who knows maybe you can pull off a win or two? It's not impossible to do honestly. Especially for Sealed. Sometimes you might even get a drop.

Poetic
07-11-2015, 02:46 AM
Why does everything have to be about getting the best value? Why not just support the company/game you supposedly love. $8 is fair.

Metronomy
07-11-2015, 03:08 AM
Just 1 ticket per month seems harsh...its either win your aa's or bust. Was it the same with the old VIP model ?
I'm hesitating. I dont need the packs but I want those AA's. But just 1 Ticket per month makes it a huge gamble.

Cainhu
07-11-2015, 03:16 AM
Nice try HEX, but you won't get my money until at least most of the original KS promises for PVE - already payed by the backers years ago - are implemented.

When (and IF) that happens I jump on the boat.

israel.kendall
07-11-2015, 03:33 AM
I'm extremely happy to see VIP's return! Glad to see the sleeves also!

Voormas
07-11-2015, 03:42 AM
I think this is a great way to bring VIP back - looking forward to it!

Reeplay
07-11-2015, 04:04 AM
I'm hyped for this. I always felt left out whenever VIP's were on and all the other queue's got so lonely but now I can join in with the AA tournament fun

yoyogod
07-11-2015, 05:25 AM
I'll probably pass on this. Since I usually work on weekends, I can't take part in the VIP tournaments, and without those it's not worthwhile paying $96 for $110 packs annually and a sleeve.

nekoangel
07-11-2015, 05:59 AM
i its great to see it back and its value is fine. id suggest adding some gold to it though (not sure how much) as i feel anything you pay for subscription based should have at least a small bonus, i know we have sleeves but after that it doesn't feel to exciting. even a free random item of sorts would be cool like full art dust.

heck going on the above a random drop table only available from VIP would be cool

Cernz
07-11-2015, 06:04 AM
Sounds fine since i only have 3 Tickets left ;) getting all Tickets right after the subscribtion is also nice... i only play in vip sealed... so i will spend 2 Tickets every 2 month.

im glad they found a solution for this case, many New people were upset not having the chance to play or buy vip.

superdax
07-11-2015, 06:13 AM
Even if i'm not a big fan of the new VIP, I will buy into it even if you cannot pay with plat. Anything that can help HEX make money so it can continue in the long run is worth it. They always put the players first, they always made the best to please the community. + I get cool sleeves :)

magic_gazz
07-11-2015, 06:29 AM
I cant believe people are complaining about this.

If you don't want to pay money or you don't like PvP, then VIP is not for you. That is not a reason to complain or be disappointed.

I am very happy with this offer and am happy to give Hex $8 a month towards making a great game. Especially as I get more sleeves :)

Koz
07-11-2015, 07:00 AM
Can someone explain to a new player how the VIP program works exactly? Specifically:

1.) How many VIP tournaments are there per month?
2.) What are the formats? Just constructed, or sealed/draft too?
3.) How many players are in these tournaments?
4.) If there are sealed/draft, I assume I have to provide my own packs as normal right?
5.) How is the prize support structured? Does only the winner get an AA?

darkwonders
07-11-2015, 07:06 AM
Can someone explain to a new player how the VIP program works exactly? Specifically:

1.) How many VIP tournaments are there per month?
2.) What are the formats? Just constructed, or sealed/draft too?
3.) How many players are in these tournaments?
4.) If there are sealed/draft, I assume I have to provide my own packs as normal right?
5.) How is the prize support structured? Does only the winner get an AA?

Both Constructed and Sealed. They alternate each month.

https://www.hextcg.com/june-vip-dates/

That provides details of a standard sealed. Each time period can hold up to 256 people. Recently it hasn't been filled since remaining old VIP tickets are dwindling.

superdax
07-11-2015, 07:32 AM
Can someone explain to a new player how the VIP program works exactly? Specifically:

1.) How many VIP tournaments are there per month?
2.) What are the formats? Just constructed, or sealed/draft too?
3.) How many players are in these tournaments?
4.) If there are sealed/draft, I assume I have to provide my own packs as normal right?
5.) How is the prize support structured? Does only the winner get an AA?

1) Once per month always the last weekend of the month (if a sunday is a beginning of the other month then its the weekend before it always has to be the last full weekend of the month)
2) Constructed once, Sealed the other rince and repeat
3) Max 256. At the beginning those were almost full each time ( Vip launches around 8 times inthe weekend at specific times)
4) Yes you must provide plat + packs like a normal sealed + your vip ticket. The vip gives you the right for the event but does not discount the event itself)
5) See the link In previous post for full payout

Koz
07-11-2015, 07:35 AM
Thanks for the answers!

nicosharp
07-11-2015, 07:43 AM
I'll probably pass on this. Since I usually work on weekends, I can't take part in the VIP tournaments, and without those it's not worthwhile paying $96 for $110 packs annually and a sleeve.
$96 for $104 in packs.
It's not a great value if you are looking at it only from the pack perspective. You really need to be interested in the AA's. There are two things I'd like to see stem from this price increase:

#1 - Allow players to pay with Plat equivalent.
#2 - VIP tournament entry fees minimized....

DocX
07-11-2015, 07:57 AM
Not a plat sink. Too bad.

Agreed. If I could use plat for this, I'd buy a year's sub in a heartbeat. If I need to spend cash, that's a different thing to me.

RCDv57
07-11-2015, 08:11 AM
I had no problem recommending the VIP sub to everyone when it was 4:USD a month.
At 6:USD I may have considered keeping a current subscription myself while cautiously recommending it to friends.

8:USD per month is very disappointing to me. I will now actively warn my friends and colleges avoid VIP at all costs. Unless they really want to waste money on sleeves.

While I do understand why that has to be the price, I can not be happy with that purchase. Everything that made VIP cool, is now gone. No discount, and no draft tickets. The only benefit to the VIP program now is the access to the tournaments. The VIP tournaments always seemed like the Icing on the cake for the program. Now we just have a big bowl of Icing.
Have you ever tried to eat large amounts of raw icing? It's not fun.

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 08:21 AM
Errr. Tournaments are definitely the best part of VIP. By far. I'll gladly pay 8 bucks a month for tournament with special rewards, even without a single pack.

Grimshaw
07-11-2015, 08:45 AM
Agreed, Gwaer. They're sealed and constructed tournaments that are nearly guaranteed to fire, which are fairly rare in-client. I appreciate the variety these tournaments provide. With non-expiring tickets, those who hate one format or the other will be able to avoid it without feeling like they've lost value.

Do well enough in the tournament and you can cover the $8 per month for VIP. More than 50% of players go 2-2 or better, earning 2 AAs, each of which has been historically worth 1k+ plat. Still plenty of value to be had in the VIP program.

YourOpponent
07-11-2015, 09:57 AM
I'm the sort that I'll get a year VIP membership no matter what even though I still have 7 VIP tickets left that I was saving for when my one year VIP expired. However, I do wish that instead of it being $8/month that they would have it be platinum instead (like they did for that one week where you could buy a year of VIP for 4800 platinum from the store.)

Sure the grey market exists where people sell platinum for cash at rates varying 35%-50% off, but purchasing from some of those people is really "let the buyer beware" and those kinds of sites are often prone to having viruses and stuff to get your passwords to clean up your account months later when you forgot about them. That's not why I suggest platinum for buying VIP...that's so that the free to play people can get VIP too. Also there's often a considerable markdown anyway from doing Constructed tournaments on packs since it's a 1500 total platinum entry for eight people to get 2400 (store price) for packs...which is a 37.5% mark down on each pack.

israel.kendall
07-11-2015, 10:19 AM
You guys are nuts, I love me a big bowl of icing nom nom nom

Fyren
07-11-2015, 10:24 AM
You guys are nuts, I love me a big bowl of icing nom nom nom

Overall, I absolutely agree that it's a good thing. I'm delighted that the tournaments are not history-exclusive anymore, which reduces the feeling that not having been here at the beginning is a bigger disadvantage/turnoff for new players than necessary. The debate is whether this is necessarily as good a deal as it looks like on its surface and over availability for F2P, and there's some valid discussion to be had, but this is unquestionably a vast improvement over a situation in which VIP is unpurchasable.

MugenMusou
07-11-2015, 11:29 AM
I'd also like to cast my vote. $8/month for general scheme is not bad, and in fact probably fair as it is not devaluing booster packs. However, if it is not purchasable by the means of platinum, it is now making VIP players to pay more than market value for the return of VIP ticket and potentially a sleeve. So yes. I think it is fair if they can make it purchasable by the means of platinum.

Kolokee
07-11-2015, 11:31 AM
For the min-maxers,

If you can indeed proc primal packs from the VIP, considering the primal pack will proc approximately 1.5% of the time and be worth about 1800p, that adds an average 27p per pack hidden value. So it's more like you're getting the packs at a value of 158p (185p-27p).

In regard to the fact that the VIP program costs hard currency instead of platinum, I'd like to say that towards the end of the Angry Joe interview from E3, Cory jokingly mentioned that Hex is "nowhere near profitable yet". That statement stuck out and concerned me because I love playing Hex. And even though to me it's all fun and games, to their employees, it's their livelihood. These guys can't work for free. With how easy it is to go infinite from all the value being thrown at us, (primal procs, chest spins and content, AA promos, etc) and an auction house for us to easily turn that value into in-game currency, Cryptozoic needs a way to generate recurring real world revenue that is optional to the player. VIP is just that.

So if you're looking for value regarding Hex, I don't know whats worth more than the continued existence of the game itself. Every VIP memberships monetary support, goes towards sustaining and growing Hex, generating new content for continued entertainment while also providing sufficient in game product value.

To me, the VIP program is a win-win. Count me in.

On a side note, I'm also for more, creative plat sinks.

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 11:32 AM
Having to make an additional purchase out of game for VIP seems okay to me. Setting up a recurring external payment to the game is a thing I'd do for what VIP offers me.

chromus
07-11-2015, 12:16 PM
Well said Kolokee (Small correction: Primal Pack % is actually about 2% so that would -36 plat). People wanting this program to be available in Platinum expect and want to go 'infinite' thanks to the immense value they have gotten through their KS pledges as well as through all of the game's features (Cheap boosters, Primal Packs, playing the AH, F2P Arena, etc). It's not reasonable (nor beneficial to Hex Ent.) for you to expect that what you have invested into this game until now will carry you for the entire lifetime of Hex (very few exceptions here).

These people need to adapt their expectations according to today's realities: KS money has probably run out, Hex Ent. now has 50+ employees (many of them top of talent pool in their respective fields), and they are still fighting an expensive legal battle against the Evil Empire. A subscription model that generates guaranteed $ Revenue is a great initiative that every person still believing in the long-term success of Hex should highly consider being a part of - without, for once, making their personal "value" gained be the priority. It's not only up to the new players to pay $$$ to fund the economy. We should all do what we can to contribute. (By the way, this isn't even bad value at all. You get slightly discounted boosters and an entry to a tournament you have a 50% chance to win 2 cards that are worth $10-20 each. It's still insane value that is much much harder to exploit.).

Well done Hex Ent. Thanks for bringing VIP back and giving everyone the opportunity to take part in the most exciting Hex tournaments.

hex_colin
07-11-2015, 12:28 PM
Well said Kolokee (Small correction: Primal Pack % is actually about 2% so that would -36 plat). People wanting this program to be available in Platinum expect and want to go 'infinite' thanks to the immense value they have gotten through their KS pledges as well as through all of the game's features (Cheap boosters, Primal Packs, playing the AH, F2P Arena, etc). It's not reasonable (nor beneficial to Hex Ent.) for you to expect that what you have invested into this game until now will carry you for the entire lifetime of Hex (very few exceptions here).

These people need to adapt their expectations according to today's realities: KS money has probably run out, Hex Ent. now has 50+ employees (many of them top of talent pool in their respective fields), and they are still fighting an expensive legal battle against the Evil Empire. A subscription model that generates guaranteed $ Revenue is a great initiative that every person still believing in the long-term success of Hex should highly consider being a part of - without, for once, making their personal "value" gained be the priority. It's not only up to the new players to pay $$$ to fund the economy. We should all do what we can to contribute. (By the way, this isn't even bad value at all. You get slightly discounted boosters and an entry to a tournament you have a 50% chance to win 2 cards that are worth $10-20 each. It's still insane value that is much much harder to exploit.).

Well done Hex Ent. Thanks for bringing VIP back and giving everyone the opportunity to take part in the most exciting Hex tournaments.

/applause Well said.

RCDv57
07-11-2015, 12:37 PM
Errr. Tournaments are definitely the best part of VIP. By far. I'll gladly pay 8 bucks a month for tournament with special rewards, even without a single pack.

If I am talking with someone who greatly enjoys tournaments, then I would recommend it.
However there are other groups of players out there, and VIP no longer appeals to those groups.
That is why I am sad.

wolzarg
07-11-2015, 12:40 PM
Agreed, Gwaer. They're sealed and constructed tournaments that are nearly guaranteed to fire, which are fairly rare in-client. I appreciate the variety these tournaments provide. With non-expiring tickets, those who hate one format or the other will be able to avoid it without feeling like they've lost value.

Do well enough in the tournament and you can cover the $8 per month for VIP. More than 50% of players go 2-2 or better, earning 2 AAs, each of which has been historically worth 1k+ plat. Still plenty of value to be had in the VIP program.

Expect vip AV totalt go down in price as availability goes up.

hex_colin
07-11-2015, 12:46 PM
Expect vip AV totalt go down in price as availability goes up.

Not necessarily. You have to factor in growth in player numbers too. And that fact that there will always be folks joining the game who missed many sets worth of these VIP AAs. Like most markets, you just don't really know. There's likely to be a depression in prices solely because people THINK they'll be worth less, but only time will actually tell.

Ertzi
07-11-2015, 12:49 PM
I was going to buy the VIP anyway (as I have done with every previous VIP packages), but there are some really important points in the recent posts. Nothing is more important than the longevity of HEX and the well-being and security of its incredible dev team. This is the time to show your support.

I will buy the year-long VIP on day one.

And I hate PvP :P

Poetic
07-11-2015, 12:59 PM
Well said Kolokee & Chromus.

Rieper
07-11-2015, 01:08 PM
I just wanna say i am happy with this solution to VIP. Yeah the first time VIP was released i did join it for cheap packs. But now i played game for some time, i learned the best part about VIP was actually the tournements. (hell most my VIP packs are sold instantly, since i am done with set 2. Same happen with set 1 VIP packs)

Same time you made em none expiring, so if we miss a VIP we arenīt actually losing out, fixed my biggest problem with VIP tournement. (Last problem i have is sealed. But that has more to do with my luck in sealed :P)
Also i am getting a "free" sleeve, yup i am without doubt getting 1 year VIP. And good to have a way to support Hex ent a bit, since so far i am doing fine in draft and havenīt used money for long time (Saying that also makes it make sense, that Hex Ent wants to earn a bit more money of VIP)

Xenavire
07-11-2015, 01:15 PM
My only question - will there eventually be more sleeves, and will they be given to you if you have a recurring sub that ends up lasting a year total (or you just hit 12 months of VIP at any time, regardless of breaks etc)?

I mean, I am going in on VIP either way, but if I only get bonus sleeves for doing year subs (I say bonus since I already qualify for the first lot) then I would try very hard to get a year sub payed off in short order. However, if I can just relax and pay it at 7 euros per month, thats a lot less stressful, and is probably what I would prefer to do.

Definitely don't want to have any regrets. ;) But hooray for VIP coming back!

Fyren
07-11-2015, 01:29 PM
I... think that the chipper 'let's support Hex' thing, specificially with regard to a paid subscription program, deserves just a bit of caution, because supporting Hex isn't going to be a draw on everyone's wallets. I intend to 'show my support,' certainly, and the optimism is nice - hell, it's one of the things I love about this community - but that optimism alone isn't going to cause widespread adoption among people who don't, say, hang out around these forums. Hex is, after all, a business and not a charity, so it seems to me that it is important to make the money spent seem like a good deal to someone who isn't necessarily as invested in Hex's future.

I'm not arguing that the program as written is or is not a good deal, but I want that kept in mind.

nicosharp
07-11-2015, 01:33 PM
I... think that the chipper 'let's support Hex' thing, specificially with regard to a paid subscription program, deserves just a bit of caution, because supporting Hex isn't going to be a draw on everyone's wallets. I intend to 'show my support,' certainly, and the optimism is nice - hell, it's one of the things I love about this community - but that optimism alone isn't going to cause widespread adoption among people who don't, say, hang out around these forums. Hex is, after all, a business and not a charity, so it seems to me that it is important to make the money spent seem like a good deal to someone who isn't necessarily as invested in Hex's future.

I'm not arguing that the program as written is or is not a good deal, but I want that kept in mind.
Well, it is a "good deal" ish...
52 packs for 48 packs in $.
I still think they need to allow players to pay for this with plat.
free sleeve
vip tickets to queues that have more forgiving payouts and exclusive AA's.

It's just not something we can ever compare to AH priced packs, or the former VIP.

ThomasHunter
07-11-2015, 02:54 PM
Errr. Tournaments are definitely the best part of VIP. By far. I'll gladly pay 8 bucks a month for tournament with special rewards, even without a single pack.

I will probably continue my VIP. However, isn't it the cost of the VIP ($8/mo) plus the tournament entry fee that you have to factor in? Maybe the entry fees will be reduced!

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 03:04 PM
Let me add for access to a tournament with special rewards that I still have to pay entry fees for. I like the exclusivity and high level of competition in the vip tournaments and am happy to pay for them even though I've never sold a VIP AA, and have no plans to sell them.

Sparrow
07-11-2015, 03:45 PM
I... think that the chipper 'let's support Hex' thing, specificially with regard to a paid subscription program, deserves just a bit of caution, because supporting Hex isn't going to be a draw on everyone's wallets. I intend to 'show my support,' certainly, and the optimism is nice - hell, it's one of the things I love about this community - but that optimism alone isn't going to cause widespread adoption among people who don't, say, hang out around these forums. Hex is, after all, a business and not a charity, so it seems to me that it is important to make the money spent seem like a good deal to someone who isn't necessarily as invested in Hex's future.

I'm not arguing that the program as written is or is not a good deal, but I want that kept in mind.
I'm not thrilled about it either, but I always keep in mind that everything is subject to change. What may (or may not) be a good fit now for Hex given the current user base, may not (or may) be a good fit a year from now.

I agree with your sentiments regarding the argument that we should love it because we want to support Hex. In my mind, we're well past that stage -- at least a year past. I've done my bit of investing hundreds of $$'s into an alpha/beta game that's behind schedule, so now I'm choosier about what appeals to me.

DocX
07-11-2015, 05:49 PM
In regard to the fact that the VIP program costs hard currency instead of platinum, I'd like to say that towards the end of the Angry Joe interview from E3, Cory jokingly mentioned that Hex is "nowhere near profitable yet". That statement stuck out and concerned me because I love playing Hex. And even though to me it's all fun and games, to their employees, it's their livelihood. These guys can't work for free. With how easy it is to go infinite from all the value being thrown at us, (primal procs, chest spins and content, AA promos, etc) and an auction house for us to easily turn that value into in-game currency, Cryptozoic needs a way to generate recurring real world revenue that is optional to the player. VIP is just that.

While a single player may go "infinite", the economy as a whole will need more platinum to funnel to those players. Platinum is never created in the system (outside the weekly draft tickets for Pro Players and KS Tiers above it which I'll wager is a rounding error in the overall economy). All the plat in the economy comes from someone, somewhere spending money. Even if one person is able to, through skillful play or market speculation, go infinite there are hundreds of others who are feeding real world money into the economy.


On a side note, I'm also for more, creative plat sinks.

While I would support this, I also remember Cory saying a long time ago the only thing you'd need to spend plat on would be boosters and tournament fees. Thinking about that, I can see this as being one of the reasons for not making VIP something that can be paid via plat (though it was previously, so it's not like there's not a precedent for it).


These people need to adapt their expectations according to today's realities: KS money has probably run out, Hex Ent. now has 50+ employees (many of them top of talent pool in their respective fields), and they are still fighting an expensive legal battle against the Evil Empire. A subscription model that generates guaranteed $ Revenue is a great initiative that every person still believing in the long-term success of Hex should highly consider being a part of - without, for once, making their personal "value" gained be the priority. It's not only up to the new players to pay $$$ to fund the economy. We should all do what we can to contribute. (By the way, this isn't even bad value at all. You get slightly discounted boosters and an entry to a tournament you have a 50% chance to win 2 cards that are worth $10-20 each. It's still insane value that is much much harder to exploit.).

Well done Hex Ent. Thanks for bringing VIP back and giving everyone the opportunity to take part in the most exciting Hex tournaments.

Thinking about it this way, I agree with the sentiment. This is a direct way to support Hex as a company and a good one that keeps the VIP tournaments firing for the foreseeable future (which was going to be a problem soon-ish as VIP subscriptions expired). While I'm still caught up on the precedent of being able to use plat previously (though there's also a precedent for half-price boosters and that turned out to be a bad idea) and the idea that our plat is supposed to have value, I can see the argument that this is a way to add a source of recurring revenue for HexEnt. I keep coming back to the friction of having to do transactions outside the client which is a big barrier for me. Then again, I'm not a normal person, so it's possible this is not for me.

I look forward to the FAQ and any clarification it can bring to this topic.

Mandalore
07-11-2015, 07:21 PM
I understand why people want to use plat to purchase VIP. Its easy to convert a few cards into platinum. The one issue with this is that HEX Ent does not make any money out of it. I Personally want to see the game live and am fully aware it takes money to pay your employees. Because of this i will gladly buy VIP with cash so that this game and awesome community can continue to move forward.


Thanks you HEX Ent Team. We appreciate your efforts.

Xexist
07-11-2015, 08:37 PM
I dont see the issue with taking platinum... I mean yes I understand them potentially needing an influx of cash, that does make sense.. but as more and more platinum is used for these kinds of purchases, well the plat still has to keep coming from somewhere and if people run out then... well they have to buy more, right?

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 08:50 PM
I dont see the issue with taking platinum... I mean yes I understand them potentially needing an influx of cash, that does make sense.. but as more and more platinum is used for these kinds of purchases, well the plat still has to keep coming from somewhere and if people run out then... well they have to buy more, right?

Likewise I don't see a problem with the occasional external purchase/subscription. As long as it doesn't become a huge thing where everything has to be bought out of game VIP started out of game, and is fine to continue that way.

plaguedealer
07-11-2015, 08:50 PM
Cory said hex is currently not profitable. VIP may need to be nonplat. Support Hex imo. I just wish there was some pve incentives in vip. In order for hex to be profitable pve needs to be a main focus.

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 08:52 PM
Cory said hex is currently not profitable. VIP may need to be nonplat. Support Hex imo. I just wish there was some pve incentives in vip. In order for hex to be profitable pve needs to be a main focus.

there is no PVE to focus on yet. Next major patch after set 3 then we can talk, but I'm pretty sure they're against pve costing anything. Meaning a sub like this is probably off the table for pve.

plaguedealer
07-11-2015, 08:58 PM
there is no PVE to focus on yet. Next major patch after set 3 then we can talk, but I'm pretty sure they're against pve costing anything. Meaning a sub like this is probably off the table for pve.

Next major patch, I will already have the next one year vip. When campaign hits, I hope there are ways for people to buy something for pve. If pve is completely free (which may be a weird business model absent poe mechanics) gold should be very valuable.

Regardless, people should not complain about vip being nonplat. The kickstarters have so much value, not sure if I will need to buy plat for awhile.

Fyren
07-11-2015, 09:42 PM
Cory said hex is currently not profitable. VIP may need to be nonplat. Support Hex imo.

I will reiterate that I think sentiment cannot reasonably be the principle behind which a purchase system designed for general distribution is based and balanced.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of it as a plat sink, but in the end, I will also reiterate that this is vastly superior to a situation without purchasable VIP.

Gwaer
07-11-2015, 09:44 PM
I will reiterate that I think sentiment cannot reasonably be the principle behind which a purchase system designed for general distribution is based and balanced.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of it as a plat sink, but in the end, I will also reiterate that this is vastly superior to a situation without purchasable VIP.

Sentiment is not why I'll buy a year of vip the second it is available. Sentiment, is not why they're only offering it for $$$ instead of plat. The less people who buy into vip, the more valuable the AA's are, so it's pretty self correcting. Sentiment is just a strawman.

plaguedealer
07-11-2015, 09:46 PM
I will reiterate that I think sentiment cannot reasonably be the principle behind which a purchase system designed for general distribution is based and balanced.

The more I think about it, the more I like the idea of it as a plat sink, but in the end, I will also reiterate that this is vastly superior to a situation without purchasable VIP.

We need a plat sink, it will come when we start drafting newer sets. Right now, I want to see hex make some more money, nonplat vip is a way for this to happen.

Gold being valuable will also be a plat sink.

Fyren
07-11-2015, 09:59 PM
We need a plat sink, it will come when we start drafting newer sets. Right now, I want to see hex make some more money, nonplat vip is a way for this to happen.

Yes, YOU Want to see more Hex make more money. >I< want to see Hex make more money. But I wonder if they'll make more money relying on that goodwill versus using a system with broader appeal?

plaguedealer
07-11-2015, 10:03 PM
Yes, YOU Want to see more Hex make more money. >I< want to see Hex make more money. But I wonder if they'll make more money relying on that goodwill versus using a system with broader appeal?

Broader appeal? If you are a kickstarter you should have no problem paying some money for vip. If you are a new player it should make no difference at all.

Xexist
07-11-2015, 10:07 PM
Broader appeal? If you are a kickstarter you should have no problem paying some money for vip. If you are a new player it should make no difference at all.

No all kickstarter backers are rich bro.

Also re: Hex not currently profitable.. its not even officially released yet, its still in beta, its not really being advertised much (that I am aware of), and there is no PVE and a small user base (relatively speaking). Not being profitable currently is probably not at all unexpected. I hope (and assume) that those in charge have run the numbers and still see a bright future for Hex once things release.

plaguedealer
07-11-2015, 10:18 PM
Unless you are some draft god or ah god, you shouldnt be swimming in plat if you kickstarted low. If you have so much plat you shouldnt complain about vip being non plat, because all that plat you have should have you sitting pretty.

Xexist
07-11-2015, 10:27 PM
Unless you are some draft god or ah god, you shouldnt be swimming in plat if you kickstarted low. If you have so much plat you shouldnt complain about vip being non plat, because all that plat you have should have you sitting pretty.

I think it should be available for plat != complaining

Mandalore
07-11-2015, 11:18 PM
I think it should be available for plat != complaining

I understand why players want it to be available for platinum because we already are sitting on piles of platinum. But do you not want to see this game have a good source of funding? KS Funds can only get you so far. Im sure those are all depleted or almost to that point.

magic_gazz
07-11-2015, 11:57 PM
I have plenty of platinum and might be easier for me if it was available for plat but $8 a month is a pretty small price to pay. It is still good value.

If you cant afford $8 or don't think it is good value, you don't have to have it.

If you really want it you can find a way. Sell $8 of cards each month if you have tons of plat.

Fyren
07-12-2015, 12:25 AM
Broader appeal? If you are a kickstarter you should have no problem paying some money for vip. If you are a new player it should make no difference at all.

And if you are neither of these things?

I have been playing for about four and a half months and have participated and done reasonably in some large tournaments; I can no longer consider myself new. Nor did I back the KS. Don't forget that this window exists and has existed for months, and is only getting larger, so don't forget about us. :p


I understand why players want it to be available for platinum because we already are sitting on piles of platinum. But do you not want to see this game have a good source of funding? KS Funds can only get you so far. Im sure those are all depleted or almost to that point.

And I don't think the appeal to charity is a great basis for a program. I mean, I'll do it. I do want to support Hex, and I'll likely want to keep participating in the VIP events, which have been a lot of fun. But what I think I've been rather clumsily trying to point out is that we here on the forums aren't the only potential customers. The argument you need to be making from a business standpoint is that "$2.00 is/is not a reasonable value to pay for the tournament tickets over discounted platinum," not "Please do it to support Hex."

Gwaer
07-12-2015, 12:29 AM
There is no appeal to charity from the hex developers. It will either be available for usd, and people will find that a good thing to buy into, or it won't/they won't. It is how it is. If you don't feel it's worth the investment in the form it is provided, then don't participate. That's perfectly fine. But saying it's some sort of charity is ridiculous. 8 bucks a month +tournament entry fees, even without packs for the VIP tournaments is well worth it for me. Either there will be enough people that agree, or there won't and they'll do something else.

Fyren
07-12-2015, 12:36 AM
There is no appeal to charity from the hex developers. It will either be available for usd, and people will find that a good thing to buy into, or it won't/they won't. It is how it is. If you don't feel it's worth the investment in the form it is provided, then don't participate. That's perfectly fine. But saying it's some sort of charity is ridiculous. 8 bucks a month +tournament entry fees, even without packs for the VIP tournaments is well worth it for me. Either there will be enough people that agree, or there won't and they'll do something else.

I'm saying that 'charity' seems to be the argument some of the people in this thread are arguing from, and I'm saying >that's< the wrong way to think about designing a program, not necessarily the way it has in fact been designed. That is indeed all I'm saying. I think. It's 2:30AM and it's becoming increasingly difficult to be certain of that.

I suppose I'll also say - because I feel like I have to keep saying this - this is still infinitely superior to a situation where a VIP system exists with historical accessibility only.

Gwaer
07-12-2015, 12:39 AM
If that's all you're saying I don't really see your point. Pretty much any game you play with voluntary payments have members of their community who really like the game, who are only participating because they enjoy the game. They are giving charity to developers who they appreciate. That's totally cool for them, and it's totally fair. People will pay for their own reasons all the time, and they can justify it to themselves and others however they like.

The only real question is 'is it a good deal for you'. if the answer is no, then wait for the next thing, I'm certain eventually we'll have more things that will interest you.

Fyren
07-12-2015, 12:46 AM
The only real question is 'is it a good deal for you'. if the answer is no, then wait for the next thing, I'm certain eventually we'll have more things that will interest you.

Come on, now, if that was the only question, there'd be no need or reason to discuss it on forums, sir! :p No room for the thrust of spirited debate! Or at least awkwardly stumbling debate waving a broom vaguely in the direction of truth. Or the neighbor's cat. The line between the two blurs at this hour.

Sometimes I enjoy speaking the neighbor's cat to power.

Peseto
07-12-2015, 01:50 AM
On a side note: If they are cash-only, i hope they don't award points for the 100k tournament qualifiers.

Gwaer
07-12-2015, 02:05 AM
On a side note: If they are cash-only, i hope they don't award points for the 100k tournament qualifiers.

I don't think they should award points for the 100k tournament no matter how you can pay for them, personally. I guess that depends a little on the structure of the points. if all tournaments everywhere offer the same points then maybe it's okay.

poizonous
07-12-2015, 02:08 AM
Sorry didnt read every page, Gwaer whats your stance on it being offered for in game plat? I know some people get discounted plat but all my money is put straight into hex through them directly. I would really like this option to be available in game for plat

Gwaer
07-12-2015, 02:19 AM
I don't really have a preference. If it isn't available in game for plat, it will definitely be a money infusion, which is fine with me. I don't get plat discounted personally, so it's exactly the same for me either way.

Peseto
07-12-2015, 03:36 AM
I don't think they should award points for the 100k tournament no matter how you can pay for them, personally. I guess that depends a little on the structure of the points. if all tournaments everywhere offer the same points then maybe it's okay.
Yeah i guess your right, as long as they offer the same amount of points as normal scheduled seals/constructed then all is fine. Just please dont have it give out more points then any other event.

Voormas
07-12-2015, 04:40 AM
If you gotta pay an entry fee it should give points towards the 100k tournament, but yea it shouldn't be "enhanced" like the payouts are

DocX
07-12-2015, 05:27 AM
Likewise I don't see a problem with the occasional external purchase/subscription. As long as it doesn't become a huge thing where everything has to be bought out of game VIP started out of game, and is fine to continue that way.

With the one issue being the original VIP was purchasable using plat. Other than that I agree with you.


I think it should be available for plat != complaining

+1


If you really want it you can find a way. Sell $8 of cards each month if you have tons of plat.

Let me know where I send my 800 plat to get $8 to spend on VIP. Though, to be honest, any method of doing that would add even more friction to the process.

Poetic
07-12-2015, 05:31 AM
It was only avaible for plat at the end when it was going away.

YourOpponent
07-12-2015, 09:15 AM
I think most people are looking at things the wrong way. Lots of people seem to be looking at Cory's statement that Hex isn't profitable right now. Of course it's not profitable right now, but I don't think it's why people think that it really is. A lot of people on here seems to think, "Oh no problem. Just pump money into the game with monthly payments using cash, and new sets and things will be alright."

That's very unlikely the case, because you're not thinking about our player base. A small amount of our players are payers and we need to instead of focus on what it takes to get a higher percentage of payers in the player base and not necessarily what it takes to get our current payers to pay more. Don't get me wrong I'm excited that VIP is coming back and will pay cash or in game plat for it without missing a beat. However I do think in game platinum would be better due to it giving more value to the cards due to having an in game platinum sink. As things are lots of people are quitting Hex, because it doesn't have Dungeons/Raids or a better AI so they've been selling their platinum on the Grey Market...that and people are afraid their Hex cards will be having less value due to the game not likely to be successful (those people are wrong of course) or unlikely to win their law suit (which they're wrong on that too)

Why I bring that up is because simply it is relevant to the one major problem Hex has which is essentially, "Where is the real PvE?" I have friends that ARE interested in playing a better and cheaper version of a game type such as MtG and think Hex sounds awesome. However, they quit before putting more money into it, because of two main reasons. 1.) The horrible AI and 2.) Dungeons/Raids aren't out and it's just to boring to only have the Arena. PvE may be free to play, but it's absence are notably upsetting the people that are payers too and that's not good, because it's causing a lot of potential players to not play the game, because as it is without it we're just too "similar" to regular TCG's so they'd rather just keep playing their regular TCG's and putting money into them.

poizonous
07-12-2015, 09:31 AM
As things are lots of people are quitting Hex

I don't know of many people quitting and I am pretty active around all aspects of the game, as far as i can tell there is new blood coming on constantly, I haven't noticed people quitting, and also some people might not be quitting, but just rather taking a break and coming back when the dungeons get released

Biz
07-12-2015, 11:05 AM
Let me know where I send my 800 plat to get $8 to spend on VIP.

lol. i'd be happy if there was even a legit way to trade 1500 plat for $8 without needing to trust some random person on the internet
it won't ever be 100p:$1

i'd understand why VIP could cost more than 800p/month (if they want to confuse people), but not having any platinum purchase option at all just signals that the virtual currency doesn't have value

magic_gazz
07-12-2015, 02:46 PM
lol. i'd be happy if there was even a legit way to trade 1500 plat for $8 without needing to trust some random person on the internet
it won't ever be 100p:$1

i'd understand why VIP could cost more than 800p/month (if they want to confuse people), but not having any platinum purchase option at all just signals that the virtual currency doesn't have value

You send me a card worth 1500 plat every month (selling the plat itself is not allowed) and I will pay your VIP.

Xexist
07-12-2015, 03:26 PM
I understand why players want it to be available for platinum because we already are sitting on piles of platinum. But do you not want to see this game have a good source of funding? KS Funds can only get you so far. Im sure those are all depleted or almost to that point.

What I am saying is that making it available for platinum will not (in my opinion) decrease the source of funding by a significant amount long term, only short term.

Xexist
07-12-2015, 03:33 PM
You send me a card worth 1500 plat every month (selling the plat itself is not allowed) and I will pay your VIP.

Get me in on this action! I will do it for a 1400 plat card!

Gwaer
07-12-2015, 03:54 PM
What I am saying is that making it available for platinum will not (in my opinion) decrease the source of funding by a significant amount long term, only short term.

Short term seems more relevant right now? Can always transition to platinum later.

Yoss
07-12-2015, 04:19 PM
As much as I'd prefer VIP to be a plat sink, one reason for making it $US is they can take credit card numbers and put you on recurring payment (that's how it was last time). That's the only reason I can think of in favor of non-plat, but it's a good reason.

Cunning
07-12-2015, 04:40 PM
Infinite players keep the game populated, show them some love:ruby: and make VIP purchasable with plat

Boogaloo
07-12-2015, 05:28 PM
I too would like to see the VIP be purchasable with platinum - to the extent that I won't buy into it if it's not.

I spent a good deal of money on the Kickstarter and am willing to use platinum (that someone had to purchase with real money somewhere down the line) on it, but I won't spend more money on the game at least until it's an actual full game (you know, with the MMO elements that were promised long ago and everything).

Voormas
07-12-2015, 07:11 PM
I've spent a fair amount of money myself, but I don't see a good reason to hold off on utilizing a feature I would really enjoy (more VIP tournaments) just because the game is still under development (we knew going into this that it was gonna take time - them letting us see how the sausage is made by having such a transparent Alpha / Beta probably just gives us a warped view of development timescales)

wolzarg
07-13-2015, 05:47 AM
I've spent a fair amount of money myself, but I don't see a good reason to hold off on utilizing a feature I would really enjoy (more VIP tournaments) just because the game is still under development (we knew going into this that it was gonna take time - them letting us see how the sausage is made by having such a transparent Alpha / Beta probably just gives us a warped view of development timescales)
I agree but you also do have to keep in mind that people are paying for packs and entry, stuff like that. This makes a big difference and while we know its not a finished product will lead to expectations. I'm on neither side in this as the implementation will simply decide if i take part or not but i feel both sides have said what they want and i don't need to chime in further.

The_Lannisters
07-13-2015, 06:11 AM
I feel a bit borderline about this issue. All of the sudden $96 USD seems a sizeable chunk of change. Did we pay 8000 P last time round?

Fred
07-13-2015, 06:14 AM
I understand the general sentiment that people would like to have an option to pay for VIP with plat rather than with their credit card. However, as others have stated before me, using a credit card purchase enables HexEnt to do recurring billing, which should provide a steadier stream of revenue. And while infinite players deserve our respect for what they are able to accomplish, a VIP program doesn't have to cater to everybody all the time, and it definitely doesn't have to be merit based.

VIP is an acronym with an actual meaning... what is very important for HexEnt is to generate revenue. Therefore, VIPs are those that will generate additional revenue.

Otherwise...

https://i.imgflip.com/o592l.jpg (https://imgflip.com/i/o592l)via Imgflip Meme Maker (https://imgflip.com/memegenerator)

RCDv57
07-13-2015, 06:15 AM
I feel a bit borderline about this issue. All of the sudden $96 USD seems a sizeable chunk of change. Did we pay 8000 P last time round?

~5000p

selpai
07-13-2015, 06:15 AM
I feel a bit borderline about this issue. All of the sudden $96 USD seems a sizable chunk of change. Did we pay 8000 P last time round?

More importantly, have they changed anything about VIP? The system seems to be exactly the same as it was, except that it's more expensive now and you get the tickets all at once.

IDK about you, but i paid 4800 last time around.

Fred
07-13-2015, 06:17 AM
I feel a bit borderline about this issue. All of the sudden $96 USD seems a sizeable chunk of change. Did we pay 8000 P last time round?

Last time, it was half that price ($4 a month). However, it was abused by enough people to potentially disturb the in-game economy, and it was removed.

By doubling the cost, we still get the tournaments, but the abuse potential is a lot smaller.

(also, commenting about $96 being a sizeable chunk of change is hilarious coming from a Lannister :p)

Xenavire
07-13-2015, 06:27 AM
I feel a bit borderline about this issue. All of the sudden $96 USD seems a sizeable chunk of change. Did we pay 8000 P last time round?

Don't forget that is a year. A year is a damn long time. :p

katkillad
07-13-2015, 06:36 AM
More importantly, have they changed anything about VIP? The system seems to be exactly the same as it was, except that it's more expensive now and you get the tickets all at once.

IDK about you, but i paid 4800 last time around.

You get sleeves if you buy/bought a year and the tickets don't expire now meaning if you don't like sealed you can do only constructed tournaments if you wish.

The entire reasoning behind why VIP was cancelled was because it only cost 4800 and susceptible to be taken advantage of.

x78089
07-13-2015, 07:20 AM
Has anyone posed the question of whether our current VIP tickets will now be permanent or not?

Warrender
07-13-2015, 07:26 AM
Has anyone posed the question of whether our current VIP tickets will now be permanent or not?

I would imagine they will not be. Part of the VIP restructure was to allow the current VIP perks to expire so they could implement one that wasn't as ripe for abuse. Making the old VIP tickets permanent would not be a smart idea.

darkwonders
07-13-2015, 07:29 AM
I would imagine they will not be. Part of the VIP restructure was to allow the current VIP perks to expire so they could implement one that wasn't as ripe for abuse. Making the old VIP tickets permanent would not be a smart idea.

They never fixed the glitch that allows you to turn your VIP tickets to non-expiring though...

Warrender
07-13-2015, 07:37 AM
They never fixed the glitch that allows you to turn your VIP tickets to non-expiring though...

Actually, they did. If you try and do it now, they expire in a few days even though it initially turns them into non-expiring tickets.

darkwonders
07-13-2015, 07:39 AM
Actually, they did. If you try and do it now, they expire in a few days even though it initially turns them into non-expiring tickets.

Well darn :)

The_Lannisters
07-13-2015, 08:29 AM
(also, commenting about $96 being a sizeable chunk of change is hilarious coming from a Lannister :p)

This is a hard-ass economy :p

Tough choice. On the one hand I want to support the game, and for that I should ship some of my hard-earned money to CZE. On the other hand it feels a tad expensive for what it is. We were spoiled I guess!
Having said that, I wonder how much I've spent in Dota2 hats this year! Just because some of those transactions are rather small we sometimes do not realize the total cost per year.

x78089
07-13-2015, 10:26 AM
I would imagine they will not be. Part of the VIP restructure was to allow the current VIP perks to expire so they could implement one that wasn't as ripe for abuse. Making the old VIP tickets permanent would not be a smart idea.

I agree that they don't need to make the change, but making it would not be overly harmful IMO. I know I have lost a few tickets to other commitments and it would be cool no to lose anymore.

ziggarius
07-13-2015, 10:45 AM
I agree that they don't need to make the change, but making it would not be overly harmful IMO. I know I have lost a few tickets to other commitments and it would be cool no to lose anymore.

I agree with this sentiment, but we'll see what ends up happening I suppose.

f5shooter
07-13-2015, 10:48 AM
I'm loving the evil geniousness of it. Let's say I buy my one year subscription today and get my 12 tickets. 4-5 months down the road I have used all of my tickets by entering more than one tournament per month. Now I have to re-subscribe or wait 8 months to play again! People, myself included are probably going to be pre-paid VIPs well into retirement after a year or two.

thegreybetween
07-13-2015, 10:58 AM
I'm loving the evil geniousness of it. Let's say I buy my one year subscription today and get my 12 tickets. 4-5 months down the road I have used all of my tickets by entering more than one tournament per month. Now I have to re-subscribe or wait 8 months to play again! People, myself included are probably going to be pre-paid VIPs well into retirement after a year or two.

Depends. Assuming you can go at least 2-2 in any given tournament, you only need to enter 4 tournaments every 4 months to hit your playset of the AAs. If you do all four in the same weekend, then you're safe to skip the next three months. Put another way: You will need 4 tickets x 3 AA batches per year = 12 tickets per year. So it works out perfectly, even if you prefer to rush a particular format for a given AA block.

Of course, if you don't get that all-important 2-2 or if your goal is to amass AAs for non-playset purposes, then YMMV.

EccentricFan
07-13-2015, 01:03 PM
Glad to see these tickets are non-expiring. Now I can skip constructed months and spend them all on sealed. Assuming you still have to pay entrance fees to tournaments, that was probably too pricy for me if half of the tickets were constructed only.

As for the plat vs real money issue, I'm a bit confused if platinum is not allowed. At first glance, it would seem it wouldn't hurt Cryptozoic's bottom line at all. I'm not aware of any way to generate platinum short of purchasing it with real money. So all platinum people get had to be purchased by someone.

Throw in the AH cut for people getting their platinum that way and platinum purchases look like they would earn Cryptozoic more cash than real money purchases. Especially since they'd certainly get more sales if plat is allowed. So is something going on I'm not aware of? Because I can think of only three reasons why they would forbid it.

Is there a place to purchase real platinum at less than the market price? (Places that generate new plat that is, not secondary markets.) Is Cryptozoic charged more in fees by companies supporting payment for plat than by companies handling real money purchase? In either of those cases, they could just bump the plat price for VIP higher to make up for the difference. They'd still get the same cash, and make more sales of the program.

The only reason I could see to disallow platinum purchases at any rate is if there's a glut of unspent platinum in the system and they need additional cash purchases now, rather than when it dries up. And I certainly hope their financial situation isn't that bad, even if it is the case.

superdax
07-13-2015, 01:11 PM
The best way would be to offer both
Platinum: pay all up front
Credit card: Recurring pmts.

Everyone is happy :)

magic_gazz
07-13-2015, 01:35 PM
More importantly, have they changed anything about VIP? The system seems to be exactly the same as it was, except that it's more expensive now and you get the tickets all at once.

IDK about you, but i paid 4800 last time around.

And last time the system was open to abuse that could lead to a drop in the value of packs. The price increase protects the value of your boosters and therefore the value of your cards.

This is a good thing.

Any you get sleeves if you pay for a year :)