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View Full Version : Another PvE experience/perspective with thoughts.



Huuyah
02-12-2016, 12:13 PM
Since there is a fairly long and very well written feedback thread a few posts down I will try not to cover too much of the same ground. Also I know this is a work in progress and things will change but I can only comment on what I see now compared to other games I have played.

Firstly I want to start off by saying keep up the good work! I backed the game on kickstarter and have been waiting for the PvE experience to arrive. So far I have enjoyed myself, I must have since my Shin hare cleric is now almost lvl 8 and I got round to killing the piranhas and the 2nd version of the killipede (although it bugged and didnt drop the card for me, give me a long error in the 5th loot section/box) I have plans on the Worm Queen at some point once I think of how, and as a side note without wanting to spoil too much whoever came up with the required volume for that quest totally made my list. I am looking forward to further PvE content.

As a background I have pretty much been a gamer forever across most platforms; Magic back when legends was released, quite a few things that have been on tabletop (especially pandemic), pen and paper DnD and of course multiple MMOs WoW (Vanilla through to end of pandas), Rift and now FFXIV. So from this perspective I would like to just cover a few things.

Character customisation. All the characters currently have the same portrait option. When you make a character in an MMO these days you create a distinct and (relatively) unique character for you. I hope this will be an option in the future, not just a choice of one of 5 portraits but maybe a 3D model (not going as far as to customise iris colour but a universal mannequin you can show off your cool armour you got from that dungeon that one time) that you can see on your own Character/Talent/Equipment screen at least? Or if that is not a realistic option how about letting you choose a card from your collection to represent you? Or for example as a basic option have all Race X Class Y wear stylised armour that you can dye each piece of in a picture?
Want to buy 1 Hop'Hiro in Electric Pink Armour! ... Well maybe not to that degree, afterall hes not a paladin.

In terms of feel I like the starting zone it gives each race that unique feel that is needed in an MMO, but once you get on the world map it is a little bit of a shame that all the races are apparently originating in the very same spot. I mean its supposed to be a big world out there and yet all the races just happen to be clumped together on the same starting map? That's not exactly ideal (And yes I know this is only the first bit of PvE but thats kinda the impression it gives at the moment) Are there plans to maybe move each race to a different corner of the globe a little further down the line?

The other thing that's very much missing from an MMO is the"MM", the very core essence of an MMO is feeling part of the world with other people who you meet, help, talk and possibly adventure with. Currently it feels very much like a single player experience, you go into a town and there is literally just you and the quest givers. What would be nice here would maybe be a window you can open that shows who is sharing the zone with you, even if you can't see them depicted in town it would be nice to know someone is in the area, maybe even allow you to inspect or examine them. It would be nice to be able to go "Wow that Race X Class Y has a nice weapon" or "That's an interesting talent choice maybe I should give that a try myself?"

Also I noted that the quest givers in the city leave once a quest has been handed in, basically making the town a ghost town afterwards. This kind of takes away from the atmosphere and immersion a little aswell, in my MMO experience there is always someone in town, even if all the have to say is "Nice weather" at least you feel like you are in a real populated town. Generally these NPCs would discuss local lore or your particular recent adventures "Hey aren't you that bunny that stabbed that evil monster that one time?";) or maybe traders who can buy/sell common level equipment (nothing OP but again something that feels like you have made an upgrade until you do get a nice piece of gear). For example if a new player has no gloves maybe a common quality glove that gives the first troop you play in a game +0/+1 -> Or something relatively small and not balance breaking. Or maybe you can sell duplicate gear to a vendor for dust to buy expanded art with? (If this is there at the moment I never saw it so it was not obvious to me- I know there's an auction house I'm just throwing out ideas)

Then I guess to the world map and dungeons. Some of the quests and dungeons as you get further down the line are kind of challenging, but if you have ever been in an MMO that's the point you say "hey guildmate/friend/scared stranger, you want to go kill Mob Z with me?" I think that is sorely lacking here in the case of harder optional challenge enemies. Maybe reduce the loot results/XP reward if you go as a group, but it allows you to progress quests and play together, what keeps people playing MMOs is their community network they build. It would be cool to be able to party up and take on dungeon bosses, there are multiple formats in TCGs for team multiplayers and I can go into lots of ways this can be done, Im sure you don't need me to though. It would be great to say pair up for non dungeon things or even for dungeons that exist currently (I do appreciate this comes with balancing issues etc to resolve, but lets face it if I invite a friend of mine to the game I want to be able to say "You're stuck on the killipede? I will come help you get it" rather than "I can talk you through the idea" lets face it that wont sell anyone.

Dungeons, again the ones here are unique and I like they are all well done thematically. My concern here is with the lives issue (and bear with me here). I had trouble with the Rose knight Dungeon, I had to multiple Mulligan on the last boss of that instance 3 times on my first run in there and it ended badly. Now in an MMO when you do a dungeon, if you fail at a boss 3 times the trash does not all instantly respawn, can you imagine the rage if it did? even in old school wow there was a 90 minute timer on respawns in dungeons (ahhh shadow labrynth...). I like the lives system in theory but it hurts when you get to the last boss and you lose 3 times then have to clear THE WHOLE dungeon again. Lets assume you do Devonshire and get all the way to the last boss you have cleared 4 "trash mobs" to get there (and they are essentially trash mobs, low exp, low gold, no item reward) and you fail on Wiktor by being shard shafted for one of your 3 tries. The motivation to go back and solo that again is often coming in close balance with the frustration of going back and soloing that again. My thoughts are that the scales need to be tipping in favour of "Lets go back" rather than "Player smash!". Perhaps you could get an allotted time frame on the last boss dependent on time taken so far or lives remaining? I don't know, just a thought.
As a side note I totally lucked out on Wiktor my Orsons Dream became the flying artifact guardian that prevents damage- This was some way into the fight. I have never been so RNG fortunate, I don't think, and I probably wont be again.

How about crafting? something for the future maybe? Chefs can turn beaten piranhas from the piranha fight into Fish soup-> +2 life next dungeon, or Armourworkers who can turn killipede scales into Shiny gloves the give insects of a particular type "lethal" - Whatever is not game breaking but still involves you further with your character and gives them something that they can do. Lets face it in the one small zone so far there are quite a few possibilities :)

Spoiler alert- Old ground being covered below
Mana screwed, shard shafted, however you want to refer to it I wont go into massive detail but anytime you lose a close game through no fault of your own is bad and very frustrating, and if you are a new person trying to learn its immediately going to put you on a negative footing regarding your impression of the game. I think there was a post further down about semi randomized shuffling (which my be of help for the first lets say 10 cards I don't know, just to let you play something without having to drop to 5 cards on the final boss of a dungeon). This has been debated and covered lots lets leave it there.

All in all like I said at the start I am enjoying Hex so far and I look forward to more PvE, I have never been a massive PvP fan. I hope you can make sense of my ramblings since I pulled them straight out of my head as they came into it. I look forward to playing more and if I have covered lots of old ground you have my apologies. I look forward to the adding of muscular structure onto the current bones of PvE with great anticipation.

Ankara - Shin Hare Cleric

Xavon
02-12-2016, 12:33 PM
I suggested a number handful of ways to customize your character's appearance w/o even having to go with the 3D model route. Some people support the idea, but many other said they would rather have Hex Ent work on other things.

Yoss
02-12-2016, 01:56 PM
Excellent review, thanks for posting it. :)


Character customisation. All the characters currently have the same portrait option. When you make a character in an MMO these days you create a distinct and (relatively) unique character for you. I hope this will be an option in the future, not just a choice of one of 5 portraits but maybe a 3D model (not going as far as to customise iris colour but a universal mannequin you can show off your cool armour you got from that dungeon that one time) that you can see on your own Character/Talent/Equipment screen at least? Or if that is not a realistic option how about letting you choose a card from your collection to represent you? Or for example as a basic option have all Race X Class Y wear stylised armour that you can dye each piece of in a picture? Want to buy 1 Hop'Hiro in Electric Pink Armour! ... Well maybe not to that degree, afterall hes not a paladin.
Sounds good to me, though not at all a high priority on my list. (And I do have a list, see my sig.)


In terms of feel I like the starting zone it gives each race that unique feel that is needed in an MMO, but once you get on the world map it is a little bit of a shame that all the races are apparently originating in the very same spot. I mean its supposed to be a big world out there and yet all the races just happen to be clumped together on the same starting map? That's not exactly ideal (And yes I know this is only the first bit of PvE but thats kinda the impression it gives at the moment) Are there plans to maybe move each race to a different corner of the globe a little further down the line?
Yeah, this one bothers me too. I'd expected more difference in faction storylines.


The other thing that's very much missing from an MMO is the"MM", the very core essence of an MMO is feeling part of the world with other people who you meet, help, talk and possibly adventure with. Currently it feels very much like a single player experience, you go into a town and there is literally just you and the quest givers. What would be nice here would maybe be a window you can open that shows who is sharing the zone with you, even if you can't see them depicted in town it would be nice to know someone is in the area, maybe even allow you to inspect or examine them. It would be nice to be able to go "Wow that Race X Class Y has a nice weapon" or "That's an interesting talent choice maybe I should give that a try myself?"

Also I noted that the quest givers in the city leave once a quest has been handed in, basically making the town a ghost town afterwards. This kind of takes away from the atmosphere and immersion a little aswell, in my MMO experience there is always someone in town, even if all the have to say is "Nice weather" at least you feel like you are in a real populated town. Generally these NPCs would discuss local lore or your particular recent adventures "Hey aren't you that bunny that stabbed that evil monster that one time?";) or maybe traders who can buy/sell common level equipment (nothing OP but again something that feels like you have made an upgrade until you do get a nice piece of gear). For example if a new player has no gloves maybe a common quality glove that gives the first troop you play in a game +0/+1 -> Or something relatively small and not balance breaking. Or maybe you can sell duplicate gear to a vendor for dust to buy expanded art with? (If this is there at the moment I never saw it so it was not obvious to me- I know there's an auction house I'm just throwing out ideas)
Agreed. If it wouldn't lag the game too much, I'd love to see everyone's 2-D avatar bubbles floating around the overworld map and also in the panoramas. I think I'd prefer the dungeons to feel isolated though.


How about crafting? something for the future maybe? Chefs can turn beaten piranhas from the piranha fight into Fish soup-> +2 life next dungeon, or Armourworkers who can turn killipede scales into Shiny gloves the give insects of a particular type "lethal" - Whatever is not game breaking but still involves you further with your character and gives them something that they can do. Lets face it in the one small zone so far there are quite a few possibilities :)
Crafting is definitely on the official road map for the future.

Huuyah
02-13-2016, 11:10 AM
Agreed. If it wouldn't lag the game too much, I'd love to see everyone's 2-D avatar bubbles floating around the overworld map and also in the panoramas. I think I'd prefer the dungeons to feel isolated though.


Crafting is definitely on the official road map for the future.

Thanks for the reply
Its good to know crafting is on the list, in terms of the dungeons I meant purely separate instances for your group of 2-3 people (ie as it is currently but rather than just your icon floating through it would be a party icon of some description, probably moved by the party leader or something like that)

I do agree with people in terms of customization being more of a secondary objective, the first being playability and content of course.

btw, that is one hell of a list O.o, pretty sure that covers almost everything.

Yoss
02-13-2016, 12:41 PM
btw, that is one hell of a list O.o, pretty sure that covers almost everything.

Thanks. I've spent a fair amount of time maintaining it. I doubt it's complete, but I'd guess I have most of the key items.

IronPheasant
02-13-2016, 02:39 PM
It would be kind of cool if every or nearly every card art that syncs with your class could be used. Any female Human Mage for a female human mage for example. Though I know that overlaps heavily with mercenaries.

Meh.