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IronPheasant
03-04-2016, 11:12 AM
My personal opinion is that PvP champions are more interesting than Campaign Champions are. Each one basically has a charge power that's the equivalent of some fraction of a card, and each has a place for a different type of deck. A particular Campaign Champion on the other hand is rather fixed and monolithic in what it can do.

For example - the Elf Warrior. Its charge power not only can Burn a troop or champion, it also grants energy ramp. You wanted to give that class combination utility other Warriors don't get, but in the end it's a case of a (generally) strictly-better race combination. Ramp OR Burn would be fine, but not both.

A thorough critique of each class:

Warrior - In the case of the Shin'Hare racial bonus, the loss of a card is nothing in exchange for 3 guaranteed, 0 resource lightning bolts. My personal experience with a simple charge deck (Dream Stag + Genesis Pool + Inductocopter, with equipment) is basically no fair encounter can keep anything on the board versus it. Charge powers that can kill troops are extremely powerful (as we've seen with our PvP friend Venomscorn) - it's effectively the equivalent of a Time Walk whenever it kills something. You guys have to treat them with kids gloves.

Cleric - Charge power is just too slow to ever actually matter. Completely irrelevant in my experience - the enormous number of constants and artifacts it can start the game with matter much more. In my opinion, it's primarily a Robot tribal class thanks to the Soul Vessel.

Mage - Actually feels somewhat fair.


My personal suggestion, if you really want this to feel more like a MMO, redesign things to be a little more like the Mage class. In an MMO, a character has a myriad of abilities they're able to call on, but not spam, throughout a battle. Broadening the base of possibilities so to speak: It would be cool if Necrotic Warriors could get something like Gozzog's charge power, which would be vastly better for linear lifegain decks. Seriously consider threshold-specific requirements - my monogreen deck burning everything to cinders seriously throws the concept of separation of color powers out the window.

Additional suggestion: Don't grant characters free passive perks that don't cost skill points. You want Elf Warriors to be able to ramp? Okay, but make them pay some skill points for it. It shouldn't just be a free thing. The game is five turns long and every ounce of (real) power granted to the player serves to shorten it and decreases the chance of losing a fight substantially.

Turtlewing
03-04-2016, 04:11 PM
Regarding the elf warrior, It is an either or, in that you either burn the champion (for an amount if damage that often doesn't matter) so you can ramp or you burn a troop for removal. You don't get to remove a troop and ramp.

Regarding warriors in general, they probably do have the strongest charge power, but they start with a smaller hand I don't think they get as much raw power out of the rest of their talent tree as the cleric.

The cleric's charge power can get pretty nuts if you build around it. (I'm going to play this Blessing of the Immortals I drew because you cast extinction last turn and I had Mirror Knight, which is doubled because of Lady Devonsire, and I'm going to target these two blessings in the crypt to replay which also get copped, and one of the 6 cards I drew was another blessing...)
Though, I think most cleric builds accept that the charge power somewhat vestigial for most decks and instead go for the Steadfast + Lifedrain-ing clerics combo which is also pretty nuts but in a wider range of decks.

Mage, I think is pretty unimpressive unless you want to build a burn/agro deck. Then it's about as good as warrior or cleric but with a different style.

Kamino72
03-05-2016, 06:20 AM
Cleric charge power in not fun to play. This could/should be an automatic skill as there is no reason to not play it.

Steadfast + Lifedrain is totally insane for sure, as well as the cost-1 quick +2/+2 for all your clerics.

Yoss
03-06-2016, 08:39 AM
There is a reason not to play the cleric charge power sometimes. If you've taken the troop buff blessing talent and you have no troops yet, you'd rather wait for a troop before you risk drawing blessings (that you wouldn't want to use without a troop on board).

Turtlewing
03-07-2016, 02:43 PM
Cleric charge power in not fun to play. This could/should be an automatic skill as there is no reason to not play it.

There are cases where that's not true. Wormoids come to mind.

And there are potentially cases where you'd want to control the timing of putting the blessings into your deck. Admittedly the only example of that I can think of where it matters a lot is a somewhat overly complex use of Angle of Foresight (you want exactly 2 blessings in deck, and them to be your only actions in deck/hand when angle hits play; then after you attack with your angels you want to put 2 more in the deck before playing the blessings you pulled from the deck with angle's weapon equip and putting more angels in play).

Scaerow
03-09-2016, 09:34 AM
Forcing my lvl6 Vennen Warrior to wait for the one match, that the Killipede (second clash) has no resources, isn't the best idea of game design, really...
Isn't the first enemy, that seem trying to force me grinding weak enemies for XP.
Yeah, i just started the campaign for the first time, but i won't bow my head and farm lower enemies. I will keep running against them walls, nothing else such enemies are. Walls to stop you and buy time.

Don't get me wrong, i LOVE the campaign so far, but this attempt to force grinding is horrible. Just like it was with the Arena before...

P.S.: Do they really use more than 3 copies of the same cards in their decks? Why do devs intent to create close-to-unfair enemies ?

Yoss
03-09-2016, 11:34 AM
Have you exhausted all other AZ1 quests? You can do the Killipede last if you want since it's just an optional encounter. Perhaps go finish some other story lines first?

Scaerow
03-09-2016, 12:53 PM
Have you exhausted all other AZ1 quests? You can do the Killipede last if you want since it's just an optional encounter. Perhaps go finish some other story lines first?
Killipede is only way to go on, if i am not totally blind.

But i just learned, that i can farm packs from already beaten enemies.
So maybe i found a reason to stop running into Killipede, rofl.

Aradon
03-09-2016, 02:02 PM
The killipede quest is the only thing in that direction. If there is another objective, you can get to it through another path.

Yoss
03-09-2016, 02:49 PM
Is your quest log empty except for the killipede quest? Also, yes, you can go back and farm any dungeon for its packs. You cannot really farm the overworld encounters, though.

Scaerow
03-10-2016, 11:28 AM
Was blind, but now found the way to follow the burning undead storyline (Deonshire Keep).
However, same ending: Spitfire Elemental and Wiktor are hard as unicornpoop (can't beat) witht the Vennen Warrior.

Sadly wise this is so frustrating, that i will (again) stop playing. For now.

Yoss
03-10-2016, 12:01 PM
Yes, Wiktor is quite hard to beat. If you need help, please use the Strategy forum, not the Suggestions forum. You can have your own thread over in Strategy for people to help you out. Thanks.

IronPheasant
03-11-2016, 09:26 AM
In case I wasn't clear, I roughly order the power level of the classes as warrior - cleric - mage. Mage in particular is basically spending ~8 points of life in order to have an additional card.

(Mages in particular have some really sketchy skills. Affinity:Mages, "yer mages give you one third a charge" is rather a complete joke to the comparable talent for warriors and especially clerics.)

Ideally, the classes would be roughly equal in power level. Let alone class+race combinations. The game is currently no where near that.

That is probably my largest complaint. Thank you.

Turtlewing
03-11-2016, 11:43 AM
In case I wasn't clear, I roughly order the power level of the classes as warrior - cleric - mage. Mage in particular is basically spending ~8 points of life in order to have an additional card.

(Mages in particular have some really sketchy skills. Affinity:Mages, "yer mages give you one third a charge" is rather a complete joke to the comparable talent for warriors and especially clerics.)

Ideally, the classes would be roughly equal in power level. Let alone class+race combinations. The game is currently no where near that.

That is probably my largest complaint. Thank you.

Yeah, the seem to be planning to do a "linear fighters quadratic mages" thing where mages will get better relative to the otter's at higher tiers.

I think the rng in spellpower is my biggest complaint about the mage class. Followed by not having much real choice on what spells you take in tier 1. Making the spellpower talents more reliable and replacing one or two of them wth new relatively week (and therefore cheap to cast) spells would make the class a lot more appealing IMO. The Vennen racial spell is about the power level I'm thinking of. Something that can cost like 2 sp and is useful but week enough you have to look for the right moment to use it.

The other thing I found unintuitive, but ultimately can accept, is that mage isn't the class for someone who wants to play control. Mages are aggro/burn.

Scaerow
03-13-2016, 07:49 AM
Yes, Wiktor is quite hard to beat. If you need help, please use the Strategy forum, not the Suggestions forum. You can have your own thread over in Strategy for people to help you out. Thanks.
Oh ok, thanks for the adice.