PDA

View Full Version : HEX is coming to Steam!



Pages : [1] 2

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:23 AM
Hey everyone,

We are going to be on Steam soon, so I wanted to give you all a heads up. If you have questions or concerns about this, please feel free to post and I'll do my best to answer:

http://store.steampowered.com/app/410380/

Tazelbain
04-05-2016, 10:26 AM
Zomg

Saeijou
04-05-2016, 10:26 AM
wohoo! that's great news :)

Hatts
04-05-2016, 10:26 AM
<checks date> No, Not April 1st... Great news!

incitfulmonk21
04-05-2016, 10:27 AM
Well there goes our great community but hopefully it will benefit HEX and continue to allow for the game to be awesome! I give it a 6/10 with possible 7/10 if they don't increase the price of everything to make up for steams cut.

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:28 AM
<checks date> No, Not April 1st... Great news!

Would be a pretty elaborate April Fools to submit a game to Valve and get it approved on their store :)

Zubrin
04-05-2016, 10:28 AM
Will you have Steam trading cards?

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:29 AM
Well there goes our great community but hopefully it will benefit HEX and continue to allow for the game to be awesome! I give it a 6/10 with possible 7/10 if they don't increase the price of everything to make up for steams cut.

I think we have a very strong nucleus and its our hope is that the existing community shapes new members by continuing to be friendly and welcoming.

havocattack
04-05-2016, 10:30 AM
HYPE!
please let us know what features will be used... eg. will at some point trading be done via the steam interface?

Kasbark
04-05-2016, 10:30 AM
Awesome! This could be big :D

Everyone, be sure to leave a positive review on the store once it's up!

Saeijou
04-05-2016, 10:30 AM
do you know anything about the release of HL3 ? or... set 4? :P

Poetic
04-05-2016, 10:31 AM
Interesting news, probably exciting. Can't tell. Should bring in lots of new folks I'd imagine.

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:39 AM
Will you have Steam trading cards?

Not initially for achievements or trading cards. We have to be careful to think through how these types of incentives affect the game.

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:40 AM
do you know anything about the release of HL3 ? or... set 4? :P

Yes on both counts.

Eetabee
04-05-2016, 10:40 AM
Will Steam automatically know we have the game downloaded on the 12th or do we have to sync somehow? I'm not too familiar with how Steam works but this is great news!

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:41 AM
Interesting news, probably exciting. Can't tell. Should bring in lots of new folks I'd imagine.

We are hoping to get a lot of new folks. We hope that some of them will spend money on the game :)

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:41 AM
Will Steam automatically know we have the game downloaded on the 12th or do we have to sync somehow? I'm not too familiar with how Steam works but this is great news!

You have the option (but are not required) to link your current account to a steam account. You can choose to do nothing and have the exact same experience you currently have.

havocattack
04-05-2016, 10:44 AM
You have the option (but are not required) to link your current account to a steam account. You can choose to do nothing and have the exact same experience you currently have.

How will this effect players with multiple accounts? Can I link my main account to steam but still log into other accounts when needed ?

Thoom
04-05-2016, 10:45 AM
If I link my account to Steam do they start getting a cut of the money I spend on Hex?

Valve has enough of my money, I want to make sure I'm still giving the maximum percentage to HexEnt.

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 10:45 AM
We are hoping to get a lot of new folks. We hope that some of them will spend money on the game :)

And to complete the mass-market implementation you're adding phantom limited you say? Huzzah!

;P

Vorsa
04-05-2016, 10:49 AM
We are hoping to get a lot of new folks. We hope that some of them will spend money on the game :)

Sounds like a plan. :D

http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/33/3330ba64bf06180997ebd15700fbe18c8cc888f4ec3a2846b4 ac0da12ee14e24.jpg

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:50 AM
How will this effect players with multiple accounts? Can I link my main account to steam but still log into other accounts when needed ?

Yes, I believe that's how it'll work.

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:52 AM
If I link my account to Steam do they start getting a cut of the money I spend on Hex?

Valve has enough of my money, I want to make sure I'm still giving the maximum percentage to HexEnt.

If you link your account to Steam, they will in fact get their cut of the money you spend on Hex. If you choose to do nothing to your account, then your experience (and our revenue from you) doesn't change.

Varranis
04-05-2016, 10:52 AM
This is awesome! I'm excited to see the growth this will bring to the game.

Vorsa
04-05-2016, 10:54 AM
Maybe take down the hoax micro-transaction articles a.s.a.p. though - they aren't obvious jokes to people unfamiliar with Hex/cynical of FTP card games on Steam (could be a fatal first impression). :confused:

Varranis
04-05-2016, 10:54 AM
If you link your account to Steam, they will in fact get their cut of the money you spend on Hex. If you choose to do nothing to your account, then your experience (and our revenue from you) doesn't change.

Sounds like I won't be using Steam for Hex then! ;)

Will Steam change any of the UI or how transactions are processed (ie - through Steam instead of Gameforge)?

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:54 AM
Maybe take down the hoax micro-transaction articles a.s.a.p. though - they aren't obvious jokes to people unfamiliar with Hex/cynical of FTP card games on Steam. :confused:

Updated at the end, with April Fools

hammer
04-05-2016, 10:59 AM
What's steam?

Chark
04-05-2016, 10:59 AM
Sounds like I won't be using Steam for Hex then! ;)

Will Steam change any of the UI or how transactions are processed (ie - through Steam instead of Gameforge)?

No significant UI changes, but transactions will be processed differently. There's a payment processor through gameforge and through Steam. Depending on how you have hex set up, you'll get one or the other.

Chark
04-05-2016, 11:01 AM
What's steam?

Steam is the vapor into which water is converted when heated, forming a white mist of minute water droplets in the air. It's also a Internet-based digital distribution platform. Kind of like a cloud but hotter.

Tazelbain
04-05-2016, 11:03 AM
What's steam?

This classy game distribution platform.

http://store.steampowered.com/app/359050/

hammer
04-05-2016, 11:04 AM
Do steam get a cut when plat is purchased or when plat is spent? Must be the first right?

Angmar
04-05-2016, 11:07 AM
Updated at the end, with April Fools

Unless I'm missing it, this is the only change?

"We hope you enjoy these and many other exciting updates and have a wonderful April 1st experience!"

Given how many Hex players completely missed the joke and seemed angry on Twitch; it might need to be a little more obvious. I'll second Vorsa on just taking it down all together.

lightreaper
04-05-2016, 11:08 AM
Am I right in assuming that if you use the standalone client, transactions (and a cut) goes to GameForge, and if I link it to steam, a cut *INSTEAD* goes to Steam?

Rodick
04-05-2016, 11:09 AM
Great news very good i wanted this, for so long!!!!

Vorsa
04-05-2016, 11:10 AM
Do steam get a cut when plat is purchased or when plat is spent? Must be the first right?

Chark answered on page 3:

"If you link your account to Steam, they will in fact get their cut of the money you spend on Hex. If you choose to do nothing to your account, then your experience (and our revenue from you) doesn't change."

And regarding purchasing:

"No significant UI changes, but transactions will be processed differently. There's a payment processor through gameforge and through Steam. Depending on how you have hex set up, you'll get one or the other."

~ Sorry, didn't read the question properly! :o
~ I'd also guess purchase of platinum with real-money is the only action that is relevant.

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 11:15 AM
Couple of questions.

Will this have an effect on the value of platinum? We already have the unsolved issue of exchange rates having different purchasing power, does bringing steam and whatever discounts/gift cards they offer further reduce the value of platinum?

Is this why we don't have set 4?

Chark
04-05-2016, 11:20 AM
Do steam get a cut when plat is purchased or when plat is spent? Must be the first right?

It's when it's purchased, if your account is linked to steam.

ghulzen
04-05-2016, 11:22 AM
Oh goody. Since steam tracks played time I can finally see how many hundreds of hours I've played Hex :)

Chark
04-05-2016, 11:24 AM
Am I right in assuming that if you use the standalone client, transactions (and a cut) goes to GameForge, and if I link it to steam, a cut *INSTEAD* goes to Steam?

That's not correct. Gameforge is not a distribution platform (or a payment processor). They are our publisher in Europe and North America. If you choose to go through steam, Valve gets a portion of the transactions. It doesn't somehow cut out Gameforge.

lightreaper
04-05-2016, 11:27 AM
That's not correct. Gameforge is not a distribution platform (or a payment processor). They are our publisher in Europe and North America. If you choose to go through steam, Valve gets a portion of the transactions. It doesn't somehow cut out Gameforge.Thankyou for the clarification.

Badmoonz
04-05-2016, 11:28 AM
This is amazing and well overdue!

Chark
04-05-2016, 11:31 AM
Couple of questions.

Will this have an effect on the value of platinum? We already have the unsolved issue of exchange rates having different purchasing power, does bringing steam and whatever discounts/gift cards they offer further reduce the value of platinum?

Is this why we don't have set 4?

Steam gift cards sold at a discount can affect the value of platinum--yes. But gift cards are part of the ecosystem, so if we want to exist on Steam, we have to accept that. We hope that the disruption is minimal, because the volume of "full price" sales increases with Steam exposure.

Discounts: Internally, I strongly recommend against discounting platinum (both in forms of bulk discounts and in form of gift with purchase). I strongly believe that our product benefits from players never having to guess when the best time or best quantity to buy platinum or boosters may be. The answer is always right now and as much or as little as you want.

It's complicated, but the decision to release on Steam certainly to some extent affected set 4.

Tazelbain
04-05-2016, 11:35 AM
I am excited that this combined with Set 04 launch and new round of IQs could really launch Hex into the big leagues.

wolzarg
04-05-2016, 11:42 AM
Interesting choice hope it pans out well for you guys.

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 11:47 AM
Steam gift cards sold at a discount can affect the value of platinum--yes. But gift cards are part of the ecosystem, so if we want to exist on Steam, we have to accept that. We hope that the disruption is minimal, because the volume of "full price" sales increases with Steam exposure.

Discounts: Internally, I strongly recommend against discounting platinum (both in forms of bulk discounts and in form of gift with purchase). I strongly believe that our product benefits from players never having to guess when the best time or best quantity to buy platinum or boosters may be. The answer is always right now and as much or as little as you want.

It's complicated, but the decision to release on Steam certainly to some extent affected set 4.

Gameforge's payment platform already accepts giftcards, a wide variety of giftcards which can be purchase at pretty big discounts. I don't think steam's giftcard discounts will approach the ~30% savings that you can currently get through gameforge for the shrewd buyer and should actually support the value of plat.

Lyckan
04-05-2016, 11:47 AM
Sounds like a good way to get in a lot of people in!
I have a strong suspicion that set 4 is released at the same time :D *crossing fingers*

The_Lannisters
04-05-2016, 11:51 AM
Many people have questioned in the past the reasoning behind not being on Steam. Well, I guess that's not relevant any longer ... HEX is finally on Steam :)

I believe the number of active Steam users is north of 100 million players? That's a big market!

Best of luck with the move HEX!

Filesile
04-05-2016, 11:54 AM
So I just read the minimal specs and I was wondering are they true? Haven't played in few weeks but my laptop that meets those requirements wasn't able to run it without the game crashing in post battle loading screen in Adventure zone.
Was that fixed or is Hex in for some bad reviews?

ManofPeace
04-05-2016, 12:02 PM
As noted by Cory himself on the 2TA podcast, the game's business model isn't well understood by new players (mainly because the game currently doesn't explain it in any fashion) and they usually only learn because other users have to explicitly outline it. Our main play format (tournaments) also isn't explained in-game but only on the main website that takes some clicking and searching. There's also several other similar "issues" but yeah.

Will this Steam launch see a marketing campaign and/or improved new user experience accompanying it or will this just be another "silent" feature launch?

WalkingEye
04-05-2016, 12:10 PM
If you are going to steam could you add a new player guide to the Steam Community to give a rundown of shortcuts and any basic hints or tips for new players.

Gregangel
04-05-2016, 12:10 PM
A bit worry about one thing : it seems the steam lauch will be on the same day of set 4 release.

If it is the case, are the servers ready to manage the very big increase of players or we need to expect some awful lag during a week or so ?

Gregangel
04-05-2016, 12:11 PM
If you are going to steam could you add a new player guide to the Steam Community to give a rundown of shortcuts and any basic hints or tips for new players.

I just did a review/guide on the steam/forum for french players. I hope it will help

Cernz
04-05-2016, 12:16 PM
good decision, thumbs up ;)

Khazrakh
04-05-2016, 12:18 PM
Mh.

I trust your decisions Chark and I'm sure you guys thought it through a lot. Still, personally, I don't like it.
A lot of (F2P) players will not understand what's going on, how the business model is meant to work and will downvote it into oblivion. I'm predicting a mixed rating of 50% at best - that's something almost impossible to recover from in the Steam universe. We'll get an huge influx of new players at first, but they might leave scorched earth behind when they leave.
Maybe I'm too pessimistic here and should put a little more trust into humanity and all, but I've seen this happen too often already.
At least make sure your servers can handle the masses of players ;)

WalkingEye
04-05-2016, 12:18 PM
I just did a review/guide on the steam/forum for french players. I hope it will help

Great stuff. You should put it on the Guide part of the steam community page for hex when you can because I have a feeling the forum post will be pushed far down on release date.

Gregangel
04-05-2016, 12:20 PM
Great stuff. You should put it on the Guide part of the steam community page for hex when you can because I have a feeling the forum post will be pushed far down on release date.

I look into it. Not familiar with the steam community environment

WalkingEye
04-05-2016, 12:24 PM
I look into it. Not familiar with the steam community environment

Here is a link (http://steamcommunity.com/guides) to the basics of posting a guide on steam. You will need to wait for the game release because you can only publish a guide to a game you own.

essif
04-05-2016, 12:26 PM
Mh.

I trust your decisions Chark and I'm sure you guys thought it through a lot. Still, personally, I don't like it.
A lot of (F2P) players will not understand what's going on, how the business model is meant to work and will downvote it into oblivion. I'm predicting a mixed rating of 50% at best - that's something almost impossible to recover from in the Steam universe. We'll get an huge influx of new players at first, but they might leave scorched earth behind when they leave.
Maybe I'm too pessimistic here and should put a little more trust into humanity and all, but I've seen this happen too often already.
At least make sure your servers can handle the masses of players ;)

I have to agree here. I think there is a really big risk new players will see a "extremely expensive pay to win game", and downvote.

Players that find hex because they know and love other tcgs know how the model works, but random stream players likely does not.

I hope at least the community can help soften the blow with initial reviews and guides explaining what to expect.

Gregangel
04-05-2016, 12:33 PM
Here is a link (http://steamcommunity.com/guides) to the basics of posting a guide on steam. You will need to wait for the game release because you can only publish a guide to a game you own.


Merci !
I also write a guide about Hex economy on the forum.
After the release i will put it on the guide page too

Khazrakh
04-05-2016, 12:36 PM
Merci !
I also write a guide about Hex economy on the forum.
After the release i will put it on the guide page too

I don't understand a word of what you posted there but thank you so much for taking the time to write all this.
We should try and have a guide in each major language up prior to the release.

Warrender
04-05-2016, 12:38 PM
There better be an achievement for winning a match with Baby Yeti or I will be disappointed.

Great news, CZE. Now nothing will stand in the way of total Hex domination.

Superjuice
04-05-2016, 12:46 PM
I've been launching through steam (as a non steam game) for a long time now, glad that we can finally do it legitimately. I am, however, worried that the servers may struggle with the massive influx that is always inevitable with steam releases. I've seen it so many times, and it will absolutely kill the ratings and drive away players if this happens for any extended period of time. Oh and RIP chat, wall of spam incoming :)

GobBluth
04-05-2016, 12:54 PM
I'm also concerned about the new players understanding how the game is F2P and how to navigate gold vs. plat and the economy in general. The new player explanations on Hex's official website are very out of date and frankly convoluted. The videos are of the old client which will in no way help a new player with the current one. I hope Hex has put some work into taking an objective look at how a new player would react to this game.

ossuary
04-05-2016, 12:56 PM
I'm glad to see you guys will be getting the added exposure / visibility of being on Steam. I, personally, will not be linking my account to Steam, to ensure the maximum amount of money from plat purchases still ends up in your guys' pockets... but I'm glad this exists. :)

Refugee
04-05-2016, 12:57 PM
Is there a way to get access to the game early in order to put guides up? I don't believe we can make a guide without "owning" the game and I think having them would be a good idea on launch day.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 12:59 PM
I was wondering how long it would take tbh

Warrender
04-05-2016, 01:05 PM
I'm also concerned about the new players understanding how the game is F2P and how to navigate gold vs. plat and the economy in general. The new player explanations on Hex's official website are very out of date and frankly convoluted. The videos are of the old client which will in no way help a new player with the current one. I hope Hex has put some work into taking an objective look at how a new player would react to this game.

I plan on making the Steam Hex forums a regular stop on my Internet journeys. Hopefully, the community can step up its game and help out any new players there as well.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 01:08 PM
I won't download it as I already have it but I'll certainly write a review.

Chark
04-05-2016, 01:14 PM
A bit worry about one thing : it seems the steam lauch will be on the same day of set 4 release.

If it is the case, are the servers ready to manage the very big increase of players or we need to expect some awful lag during a week or so ?

Steam launch and set 4 release are not scheduled to be on the same day.


Mh.

I trust your decisions Chark and I'm sure you guys thought it through a lot. Still, personally, I don't like it.
A lot of (F2P) players will not understand what's going on, how the business model is meant to work and will downvote it into oblivion. I'm predicting a mixed rating of 50% at best - that's something almost impossible to recover from in the Steam universe. We'll get an huge influx of new players at first, but they might leave scorched earth behind when they leave.
Maybe I'm too pessimistic here and should put a little more trust into humanity and all, but I've seen this happen too often already.
At least make sure your servers can handle the masses of players ;)

Bad reviews are always a fear. We of course worry about this too, but at some point we have to have some faith in the product. We believe we're ready for the server load.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 01:15 PM
Wonderful news guys. I already played hex as a non-steam game through steam, so I'll certainly download through steam for real.

I hope this brings in a ton of new players and customers willing to spend $. I also hope that newbies don't get confused and rate it negatively if they perceive it as f2p with micro transactions.
I will certainly leave a glowing review.

So will this coincide with set 4 releasing? Has good affected set 4? (Haven't read the thread yet sorry)

Edit: I see the above has been answered.

bootlace
04-05-2016, 01:18 PM
I'm glad to see you guys will be getting the added exposure / visibility of being on Steam. I, personally, will not be linking my account to Steam, to ensure the maximum amount of money from plat purchases still ends up in your guys' pockets... but I'm glad this exists. :)

Hear, hear!

BKCshah
04-05-2016, 01:19 PM
Steam launch and set 4 release are not scheduled to be on the same day.



Bad reviews are always a fear. We of course worry about this too, but at some point we have to have some faith in the product. We believe we're ready for the server load.

So you're saying there is a schedule. Impressive

Superjuice
04-05-2016, 01:23 PM
Can someone post that internal schedule? I missed the memo :cool:

KeplerVerge
04-05-2016, 01:29 PM
Awesome, this will be huge exposure! I'm guessing some of the updates to the new player experience will go live with or before this?

Kami
04-05-2016, 01:34 PM
:stormcloud: THIS IS AWESOME!

Now my Steam account will have value!

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 01:36 PM
Steam launch and set 4 release are not scheduled to be on the same day.



Bad reviews are always a fear. We of course worry about this too, but at some point we have to have some faith in the product. We believe we're ready for the server load.

I'd agree that the content portion of the product is ready, but an explaination of what to do with gold, how to approach the AH, how to become engaged in limited, and a legible chat system under heavy load, are all pretty big concerns that could hurt those reviews.

Yoss
04-05-2016, 01:41 PM
I'd drop this from the Steam blurb:
"◾Win amazing prizes in daily tournaments with up to 128 players "

I'd stick with talking about the on-demand tournaments and Gauntlet.

I also echo the worries about the NPE (new player experience). I assume you've done your research and believe you're ready. Here's hoping!

Hawke
04-05-2016, 01:42 PM
I think the game should get some quality of life patch before going to Steam. Chat need to be better(like alowing to copy text and click on links. Auction House is just terrible the way it is now. It need massive and complete overhaul. Game need a good optimization. Options in video section are almost non existant...
On the side I understand why the game go to Steam. As DelBoy said in Only fools and horses: Who dare wins. This time next year we will be a millionairs :) Good luck Hex. I will write a positive review couse I LOVE this game.

Kami
04-05-2016, 01:50 PM
I think the main concern with this game will be how vitriolic the Steam Community can be if the game isn't 'polished'. Even moreso if the game isn't listed as Early Access - since we're not feature complete.

Especially considering how much bashing the direct competitor to this game took on Steam.

Showsni
04-05-2016, 01:57 PM
Especially considering how much bashing the direct competitor to this game took on Steam.

Really? Looks like the user reviews for that "other game" are Very Positive: http://store.steampowered.com/app/213850/?snr=1_7_7_151_150_1#app_reviews_hash

Kami
04-05-2016, 01:59 PM
Really? Looks like the user reviews for that "other game" are Very Positive: http://store.steampowered.com/app/213850/?snr=1_7_7_151_150_1#app_reviews_hash

You're looking at the old one which was polished.

The new one: http://store.steampowered.com/app/316010/ - That used to be NEGATIVE. And it's only recently turned Mixed after a year or so of updates.

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 02:00 PM
Lot of good points being brought up.

Hopefully they have the set 4 patch with a MUCH better new player guide and then launch to steam. As it is most new people have no idea what they are doing, I don't think the steam crowd are know for their patience and doing their own research.

Kami
04-05-2016, 02:05 PM
It also occurs to me that Steam users are likely to be up in arms about the Kickstarter rewards too. Look at what happened to the Armello launch on Steam.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 02:08 PM
Lot of good points being brought up.

Hopefully they have the set 4 patch with a MUCH better new player guide and then launch to steam. As it is most new people have no idea what they are doing, I don't think the steam crowd are know for their patience and doing their own research.

I have to agree here.
There really needs to be a ton of info on the landing page of the game to explain everything.
PvE is great and all, but not everyone will head to the campaign and so may miss out on some mechanics.

There needs to be an explanation of what drafting is, what gauntlet is, what sealed gauntlet and constructed gauntlet are, what "sets" are and how there are currently (I'm hoping we get Set 4 before Steam) 2 legal sets for drafting but in constructed everything is game (save for TitM, but prob don't need to say that).
The AH needs to be described (outside of the campaign) and that you can buy almost EVERYTHING on there.
Etc.

I'm sure HXE have done their research well and have already incorporated some changes into the version that will go live with Steam (again, hoping that means Set 4 is coming before then), but it's definitely worth discussing all these things here.
I'm pumped for the Steam release, but I do worry that Steam reviews can come in very rapidly and negatively given how many people have zero patience to investigate a game properly but are happy to slap a (negative) review down on a game.

Warrender
04-05-2016, 02:08 PM
TBH, MTG Duels of the Planeswalkers isn't really a direct competitor to Hex.

Kami
04-05-2016, 02:16 PM
Gameforge's payment platform already accepts giftcards, a wide variety of giftcards which can be purchase at pretty big discounts. I don't think steam's giftcard discounts will approach the ~30% savings that you can currently get through gameforge for the shrewd buyer and should actually support the value of plat.

While that may be the case, Steam will support my currency which means I will save a not insignificant amount by not having to do foreign exchange.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 02:16 PM
TBH, MTG Duels of the Planeswalkers isn't really a direct competitor to Hex.

Exactly

Marsden
04-05-2016, 02:17 PM
Nothing useful to add at all, other than being very happy to see this.

Tazelbain
04-05-2016, 02:18 PM
Feel like this pushes Set 04 out to the 26th. A company like Hex doesn't push a major patch within a week before they open flood gates. And after they open flood gates, they'll need to give it a few weeks to stabilize.

the_artic_one
04-05-2016, 02:42 PM
Feel like this pushes Set 04 out to the 26th. A company like Hex doesn't push a major patch within a week before they open flood gates. And after they open flood gates, they'll need to give it a few weeks to stabilize.

Why don't you think they'd push steam release to the 26th instead?

superdax
04-05-2016, 02:47 PM
Hmmm I really don,t know what to think of this. It could be good but it could be bad.

What i Wonder the most, is why was this hidden from everyone? I mean most companies are happy to say and they announce in advance that they will launch with steam. It could of even been on Cory's update last week. I see this as a last resort type of thing.

It feels like you had 2 choices.
1- Invest alot in publicity and hope for the best.
2- Put it on steam (no immidiate investment since its just when there is a purchase that there is a commission)

Also, you said that you need to trust your product and go ahead with it. The prodcut is not the problem. Its a great one actually and it gives you a million possibilities (what other CCG don't offer). But without proprer instructions and a way to streamline all what you can do, I believe it will be difficult to maintain people. Most CCG's (which are your target audience) are used to
1- Play the tutorial
2- Play normal games in ranked matches
3- win gold to buy packs in the STORE or launch a type of draft WITH GOLD

Hex
1- Play the PVE for fun and free (which is cool)
2- Win gold
3- Wonder what to do with gold because i can't buy anything in the PVE section with it (which has no sense since i win it there)
4- Finish the PVE and Wonder whta to do next.. maybe buy packs
5- Get recommendations from players TO NOT OPEN PACKS.. but draft.. (which is the contrary of CCG's normally)
5- Wonder whats is draft... is there a tutorial in the game?? ah no ..ok twich you say.. ok ..Can i buy a draft with my gold... NO!! why not ? I need to buy packs on AH for it.. ok ..
6- WHAT.. 20,000 GOLD FOR 1 PACK AND I NEED 3 OF THEM PLUS PLATINUM.. i win one match for 200 to 400 gold..not fun.... how do i get platinum for free ?.. Trade you say .. ok can i post in auction house.. NO!!! ok .. how then.. oh the trade chat... ok .
7- This is long.. how can i get gold faster... GRIND the Arena you say... oh but I need a faster deck ... and grind.. thats no fun.
8 - this is too long... back to F2P CCG's where i can play for 1 hour and get a draft.

I know this is a TCG but the world if full of CCG.

I really hope this is a strategy and not a last resort type of thing.

Now... where is set 4 ;)

Tazelbain
04-05-2016, 02:53 PM
I don't think they would have the 4/12 date listed unless they were confident of that date.

Chark
04-05-2016, 02:53 PM
Hmmm I really don,t know what to think of this. It could be good but it could be bad.

What i Wonder the most, is why was this hidden from everyone? I mean most companies are happy to say and they announce in advance that they will launch with steam. It could of even been on Cory's update last week. I see this as a last resort type of thing.


Not sure why you think we hid anything. The specific approval timing window for games on steam varies. We weren't ready to talk about it in Cory's update on Friday. We are ready to talk about it now. I felt like this was the most straight-forward way to engage our existing players. Sure, we could have wrote an announcement about it, but I wanted to talk to people directly and alleviate some of their concerns.

Cernz
04-05-2016, 02:54 PM
i took a short look in the future ... guess what i saw... daily quests ;) :(

Saeijou
04-05-2016, 03:01 PM
thanks for all the answers chark!

will there be any "bonus" for linking the account? or will it be basically the same, just more convinient, if you want to use steam

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 03:02 PM
Hmmm I really don,t know what to think of this. It could be good but it could be bad.

What i Wonder the most, is why was this hidden from everyone? I mean most companies are happy to say and they announce in advance that they will launch with steam. It could of even been on Cory's update last week. I see this as a last resort type of thing.

It feels like you had 2 choices.
1- Invest alot in publicity and hope for the best.
2- Put it on steam (no immidiate investment since its just when there is a purchase that there is a commission)

Also, you said that you need to trust your product and go ahead with it. The prodcut is not the problem. Its a great one actually and it gives you a million possibilities (what other CCG don't offer). But without proprer instructions and a way to streamline all what you can do, I believe it will be difficult to maintain people. Most CCG's (which are your target audience) are used to
1- Play the tutorial
2- Play normal games in ranked matches
3- win gold to buy packs in the STORE or launch a type of draft WITH GOLD

Hex
1- Play the PVE for fun and free (which is cool)
2- Win gold
3- Wonder what to do with gold because i can't buy anything in the PVE section with it (which has no sense since i win it there)
4- Finish the PVE and Wonder whta to do next.. maybe buy packs
5- Get recommendations from players TO NOT OPEN PACKS.. but draft.. (which is the contrary of CCG's normally)
5- Wonder whats is draft... is there a tutorial in the game?? ah no ..ok twich you say.. ok ..Can i buy a draft with my gold... NO!! why not ? I need to buy packs on AH for it.. ok ..
6- WHAT.. 20,000 GOLD FOR 1 PACK AND I NEED 3 OF THEM PLUS PLATINUM.. i win one match for 200 to 400 gold..not fun.... how do i get platinum for free ?.. Trade you say .. ok can i post in auction house.. NO!!! ok .. how then.. oh the trade chat... ok .
7- This is long.. how can i get gold faster... GRIND the Arena you say... oh but I need a faster deck ... and grind.. thats no fun.
8 - this is too long... back to F2P CCG's where i can play for 1 hour and get a draft.

I know this is a TCG but the world if full of CCG.

I really hope this is a strategy and not a last resort type of thing.

Now... where is set 4 ;)

This is exactly why better new player experiences are needed. When people see how hard it is to get to draft (in comparison to CCG's(even though they don't have real drafts)) they often flip. The concept of cards having value is often foreign to them and possibly something they don't care about.

Even worse is that CCGs have taught people that they should be grinding constructed and opening packs to improve their deck. With no ladder matchmaking system in place they either play random opponents for no gain (they expect gain) or have to pay to enter tournaments where they will get stomped by tier 1 decks.

superdax
04-05-2016, 03:03 PM
thanks for all the answers chark!

will there be any "bonus" for linking the account? or will it be basically the same, just more convinient, if you want to use steam

The best would not to link your account, since linking the account will diminish their income if you buy anything.

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 03:04 PM
Not sure why you think we hid anything. The specific approval timing window for games on steam varies. We weren't ready to talk about it in Cory's update on Friday. We are ready to talk about it now. I felt like this was the most straight-forward way to engage our existing players. Sure, we could have wrote an announcement about it, but I wanted to talk to people directly and alleviate some of their concerns.

Would like to say I and others (I assume) appreciate your openness in discussing these matters. No matter what our thoughts are on individual subjects we all want whats best for the game.

bofedy
04-05-2016, 03:06 PM
chark dident you or an employee say whats good being on page 32 of steam hiden a way? so my question is what happened? is this a hail mary to try to get profits up to save the game i know you cant say it is even if it was as it would be stupid and a bad thing for a company to do. So comaneys say hey whe have 100k people login in were not dead but dont share that only 4-500 people spend cash and leaves out the details that say if the game is in trouble or not.

Chark
04-05-2016, 03:14 PM
thanks for all the answers chark!

will there be any "bonus" for linking the account? or will it be basically the same, just more convinient, if you want to use steam

No bonuses for being a Steam players are currently planned. Of course things may change in the future, but there would have to be some very compelling reasons.

BKCshah
04-05-2016, 03:16 PM
---Yes, it should bring an influx of new players via steam.

---But, those players will cost a high percentage of any future platinum sales. Also, previous customers may use steam tie-in cutting the 'revenue' further.

---Also, the steam world is fickle. Having a product without regular updates, a robust (non-player) tournament scene, will quickly turn players off, likely never to return. The next two sets have already been stated to likely fall outside the ideal timeline.

This early integration feels short-sighted towards the long term finances of the game. The TCG market is a niche market to begin. Giving away a percentage of player sales seems reasonable at a later date once you have on-boarded the main 'market'. Given basic marketing, a solid product with frequent updates and $$$ tournaments those users will come. Steam is great for what it is, but I'd compare it to Groupon which many business ventures regret later.

Biz
04-05-2016, 03:17 PM
steam is pretty popular. more players will be good

it seems unusual to launch a MMO without any MMO gameplay, but good luck with whatever you have planned

bofedy
04-05-2016, 03:18 PM
what was the reason going on steam btw?

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 03:19 PM
I'm not sure adding Hex to steam means they need players or they go bankrupt a bit paranoid imo to go there.

Deathlock
04-05-2016, 03:21 PM
Congratulations! It's a big step forward.
But here some things that I wish to be implemented before Steam release:
1. Video quality settings.
2. A very detailed in-game guide of everything HEX provides.
3. Overall UI and stability improvements.
Hopefully, this launch will be a huge success! :)

Chark
04-05-2016, 03:22 PM
chark dident you or an employee say whats good being on page 32 of steam hiden a way?

I don't recall saying that and I am not specifically aware of a statement like this from a Hex employee. But I am sure the internet has a record and someone will find



so my question is what happened? is this a hail mary to try to get profits up to save the game i know you cant say it is even if it was as it would be stupid and a bad thing for a company to do. So comaneys say hey whe have 100k people login in were not dead but dont share that only 4-500 people spend cash and leaves out the details that say if the game is in trouble or not.

It's not a hail mary. We know what steam can do in terms of exposure for games and want to take advantage of it. I mean, you can draw whatever conclusions you want from this move in terms of game health. Obviously I can't stop you, but comments on DAU or percentage of paying players, or ARPPU in our game is outside of scope of this discussion.

Kurposkano
04-05-2016, 03:25 PM
Hmmm I really don,t know what to think of this. It could be good but it could be bad.

What i Wonder the most, is why was this hidden from everyone? I mean most companies are happy to say and they announce in advance that they will launch with steam. It could of even been on Cory's update last week. I see this as a last resort type of thing.

It feels like you had 2 choices.
1- Invest alot in publicity and hope for the best.
2- Put it on steam (no immidiate investment since its just when there is a purchase that there is a commission)

Also, you said that you need to trust your product and go ahead with it. The prodcut is not the problem. Its a great one actually and it gives you a million possibilities (what other CCG don't offer). But without proprer instructions and a way to streamline all what you can do, I believe it will be difficult to maintain people. Most CCG's (which are your target audience) are used to
1- Play the tutorial
2- Play normal games in ranked matches
3- win gold to buy packs in the STORE or launch a type of draft WITH GOLD

Hex
1- Play the PVE for fun and free (which is cool)
2- Win gold
3- Wonder what to do with gold because i can't buy anything in the PVE section with it (which has no sense since i win it there)
4- Finish the PVE and Wonder whta to do next.. maybe buy packs
5- Get recommendations from players TO NOT OPEN PACKS.. but draft.. (which is the contrary of CCG's normally)
5- Wonder whats is draft... is there a tutorial in the game?? ah no ..ok twich you say.. ok ..Can i buy a draft with my gold... NO!! why not ? I need to buy packs on AH for it.. ok ..
6- WHAT.. 20,000 GOLD FOR 1 PACK AND I NEED 3 OF THEM PLUS PLATINUM.. i win one match for 200 to 400 gold..not fun.... how do i get platinum for free ?.. Trade you say .. ok can i post in auction house.. NO!!! ok .. how then.. oh the trade chat... ok .
7- This is long.. how can i get gold faster... GRIND the Arena you say... oh but I need a faster deck ... and grind.. thats no fun.
8 - this is too long... back to F2P CCG's where i can play for 1 hour and get a draft.

I know this is a TCG but the world if full of CCG.

I really hope this is a strategy and not a last resort type of thing.

Now... where is set 4 ;)

I too worry about this scenario. The new player experience appears to be a leaky faucet with much room for players to leak out.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 03:25 PM
If my opinion counts for anything. I'd like to say I was wondering in all honesty when Hex would put up on steam.

bofedy
04-05-2016, 03:27 PM
im just wondering how long hex as been deciding to be on steam ect and draw conclusions :) ofc i want hex to be a bilion $ game as i love it but i like being informed about the things i like/ LOVE like hex.

Ditsch
04-05-2016, 03:35 PM
Finally it's on steam i did suggest it all the time from the beginning. I did almost not back it because the hex people were saying it won't be on steam. I would have taken this so hard as a april fools joke a few days ago. :) Great job i will recommend it to all my steam friends and will write a positive review asap when it's out on steam. :)

bootlace
04-05-2016, 03:40 PM
My only question is, why now?

You guys have been extremely meticulous about not making any marketing push until you really felt the new player experience and features to support them were perfectly in place. In Cory's last interview on the 2TA podcast I remember him saying you guys were still nailing that part of the experience down before committing more to a strong marketing push.

This, frankly, seems to come a bit out of nowhere. It would have been nice to see at least a small 'test' of general new player feedback through some marketing through a popular streamer like Trump to see what were the common complaints/confusions/hurdles that would come and how vehement/significant of problems they actually would be. We've been a well protected bubble thus far and new players usually came at a slow and manageable phase in which they could almost be individually addressed.

Are you guys really satisfied at this point with new player experience/on-boarding and the retention rate? As others have mentioned there's still a lot of quirkyness and complexity for new players and some kind of streamlining/direction seems would be beneficial.

I feel this is a move that has no going back. You can't simply cut off the marketing budget, count those players and money invested as a loss and recoup. This is a big irreversible direction and I just hope it's not rushed.

Chark
04-05-2016, 03:40 PM
what was the reason going on steam btw?

We believe that it will increase our acquisition of players. We are happy with the percentage of players who currently monetize and want to increase the funnel of overall players.

We believe that the alternative methods to acquire players (other marketing efforts) will cost us more than steam's cut on a lifetime value of a paying player.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 03:40 PM
Re: all the comments about the new player experience.
Check out this post for example over on the sub reddit.


https://www.reddit.com/r/hextcg/comments/4dgoan/newbie_so_many_questions_help/

This person was good enough to seek help properly, but I worry many steam users won't!

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 03:41 PM
Finally it's on steam i did suggest it all the time from the beginning. I did almost not back it because the hex people were saying it won't be on steam. I would have taken this so hard as a april fools joke a few days ago. :) Great job i will recommend it to all my steam friends and will write a positive review asap when it's out on steam. :)

Can you explain this to me? I still cant understand this thought process and im seeing a lot of it.

What difference does the game being on steam make? It doesn't make the game better, so I wonder what the draw is.

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 03:44 PM
We believe that it will increase our acquisition of players. We are happy with the percentage of players who currently monetize and want to increase the funnel of overall players.

We believe that the alternative methods to acquire players (other marketing efforts) will cost us more than steam's cut on a lifetime value of a paying player.

Do you have a get out plan?

If being on steam is not as big a help as planned is it easy to get out of?

Alternatively, say you acquired a million new paying players (made up number), would it/is it possible to then take the game off of steam and get those players to download the normal client and give 100% of their funds to hex or are you tied in for a set time?

fido_one
04-05-2016, 03:45 PM
I've got a bad feeling about this and not that Hex is going to Steam, but how it is being presented on Steam.

It's not an MMO yet, but it is listed as one.

It's listed as a complete game. It's not. I know HexEnt says it is, but it isn't. Fine in the world it has been in, not fine, at all, in the Steam community. Towns anyone?

Like most people here, I was on steam from day one. I have followed the review system rather intently (though haven't written any myself, Hex will be a first for me), and this listing seems ripe to be torn apart.

I think all of this would be avoided if listed as an early access game. Do that, it meets the general steam community's expectations, don't do it and you're going to have thumbs down after thumbs down of 'the campaign is too short, there isn't enough content here, their site says raids are coming, but I don't see anything resembling that' etc. etc. This is what the Steam community does.

I had thought if it goes to steam, it would be after all the things promised in the KS were delivered. We are far from that day. Early access games are a staple now, people expect that if core elements of the game are still coming, it is an early access game. If I was introduced to Hex via this listing, I would come out with a bad opinion of it.

I don't think I would have that bad opinion if it was listed as Early Access, if anything, I would be more excited about upcoming features on an already super solid and fun base of play.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 03:50 PM
Do you have a get out plan?

If being on steam is not as big a help as planned is it easy to get out of?

Alternatively, say you acquired a million new paying players (made up number), would it/is it possible to then take the game off of steam and get those players to download the normal client and give 100% of their funds to hex or are you tied in for a set time?

I don't think I know of a successful game that went on steam and then went off and survived. If it draws bad reviews, there will always be records of that, and like most of the world, I check a few review systems - Metacritic, Gamerankings, and Steam. I put most of my $$$ on games that draw good Steam reviews, and I would imagine if it goes on the platform, draws bad reviews, any exit created won't be worth much as a search will bring up the bad mojo during its run.

Kami
04-05-2016, 03:50 PM
I've got a bad feeling about this and not that Hex is going to Steam, but how it is being presented on Steam.

It's not an MMO yet, but it is listed as one.

It's listed as a complete game. It's not. I know HexEnt says it is, but it isn't. Fine in the world it has been in, not fine, at all, in the Steam community. Towns anyone?

Like most people here, I was on steam from day one. I have followed the review system rather intently (though haven't written any myself, Hex will be a first for me), and this listing seems ripe to be torn apart.

I think all of this would be avoided if listed as an early access game. Do that, it meets the general steam community's expectations, don't do it and you're going to have thumbs down after thumbs down of 'the campaign is too short, there isn't enough content here, their site says raids are coming, but I don't see anything resembling that' etc. etc. This is what the Steam community does.

I had thought if it goes to steam, it would be after all the things promised in the KS were delivered. We are far from that day. Early access games are a staple now, people expect that if core elements of the game are still coming, it is an early access game. If I was introduced to Hex via this listing, I would come out with a bad opinion of it.

I don't think I would have that bad opinion if it was listed as Early Access, if anything, I would be more excited about upcoming features on an already super solid and fun base of play.

I agree with a chunk of this. However, while I thought about the Early Access issue above, I reconsidered the fact that HEX is free. There is no upfront cost to playing this game at all.

That being said, it is paramount that the game is not misrepresented on the Steam store regardless.

magic_gazz
04-05-2016, 03:58 PM
I agree with a chunk of this. However, while I thought about the Early Access issue above, I reconsidered the fact that HEX is free. There is no upfront cost to playing this game at all.

That being said, it is paramount that the game is not misrepresented on the Steam store regardless.

Free does not stop the current generation of gamer from complaining.

Showsni
04-05-2016, 04:01 PM
What i Wonder the most, is why was this hidden from everyone? I mean most companies are happy to say and they announce in advance that they will launch with steam. It could of even been on Cory's update last week. I see this as a last resort type of thing.


Based on a few orange responses in recent threads I kind of got the idea Hex was headed for Steam; mostly Chark's replies here:
http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=48374&p=561954&viewfull=1#post561954
and here:
http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=48374&p=562012&viewfull=1#post562012

TOOT
04-05-2016, 04:02 PM
This will be a complete disaster if the current new player experience doesn't change before the launch on Steam.

The specifics were already covered by superdax and others. I'll just add that not having a ladder or some sort of basic/free PVP already in place for a flood of new players seems like a terrible idea. And no, "Play Random Opponent" isn't even close to sufficient. At least bring back the 100 gold for a win in that mode at the absolute least until something better is implemented.

ManofPeace
04-05-2016, 04:03 PM
Clarifying and presenting what HEX actually is as always comes down to the community. It has ever been such since closed beta. We can use the steam review and guides section to expand and explain HEX's business model (for the umpteenth time). Explain that the game is being developed piecemeal. Explain tournaments and vip and whatever other scattered information that's been around forever but is in 2 year old forum posts.

At some point though, HEX needs to step up and centralize this information themselves and show how they plan to market it. We have yet to see any of this from them and here's hoping it's coming.

Kroan
04-05-2016, 04:05 PM
I, for one, think this is awesome news :) More players = yay!

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 04:07 PM
I'm sure it'll be fine

fido_one
04-05-2016, 04:07 PM
I agree with a chunk of this. However, while I thought about the Early Access issue above, I reconsidered the fact that HEX is free. There is no upfront cost to playing this game at all.

That being said, it is paramount that the game is not misrepresented on the Steam store regardless.

Many of the F2P games on steam are listed as 'Early Access' games, so I believe there is already a precedent set that F2P doesn't give a free pass on 'complete.'

Our community has been rather forgiving about alpha/beta and errr, 'release'. Steam is notoriously NOT forgiving on that front. I fear HexEnt has projected our reluctant acceptance of the term onto the Steam community, which I think is a major mistake. Hope I'm wrong.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 04:07 PM
I've got a bad feeling about this and not that Hex is going to Steam, but how it is being presented on Steam.

It's not an MMO yet, but it is listed as one.

It's listed as a complete game. It's not. I know HexEnt says it is, but it isn't. Fine in the world it has been in, not fine, at all, in the Steam community. Towns anyone?

Like most people here, I was on steam from day one. I have followed the review system rather intently (though haven't written any myself, Hex will be a first for me), and this listing seems ripe to be torn apart.

I think all of this would be avoided if listed as an early access game. Do that, it meets the general steam community's expectations, don't do it and you're going to have thumbs down after thumbs down of 'the campaign is too short, there isn't enough content here, their site says raids are coming, but I don't see anything resembling that' etc. etc. This is what the Steam community does.

I had thought if it goes to steam, it would be after all the things promised in the KS were delivered. We are far from that day. Early access games are a staple now, people expect that if core elements of the game are still coming, it is an early access game. If I was introduced to Hex via this listing, I would come out with a bad opinion of it.

I don't think I would have that bad opinion if it was listed as Early Access, if anything, I would be more excited about upcoming features on an already super solid and fun base of play.

I'm going to agree with this.
Whilst the steam page listing doesn't mention stuff that isn't really there, new players would likely reach the end of the campaign and go "huh? What? That's over? What about the rest of my skill tree? There was no mention of a level cap and unfinished content!!" (= negative review).

Early access would avoid this. People love honesty. Be up front about the incoming features and timeline.

Also, mention things on the steam page to attract the hardcore card player scene that don't already know about hex.
Say that it has a fully functional and amazing draft and sealed system for tournament play.
Say that a ladder system is coming soon (because people will likely "WTF there's no ranked play?! Even HS had ranked in beta").
Say that there is a thriving constructed meta. Entice those people tired of mtg and whom somehow don't know about hex.

Manalith
04-05-2016, 04:09 PM
I have been stalking these forums everyday for months now. But my god, I HAD to get a forum account just for this. I admit that Steam will most probably increase the income initially (In reality I have no idea on any aspects of the game economy). However getting 'mixed' or 'negative' reviews on steam usually kills the future of games. I believe concerns in this thread are not about the income aspect of things. However, they are about the future of the game. I believe most of us do like this game a lot. We dream for the days: Hex one day will be huge. However, this early movement on steam will cut out most of the 'future' player base. Hex always tried to move to the 'future'. This is the first time after months (hell,years) of following hex, I feel like hex is going for a 'quick money grab'.

And please make it an 'Early Access' game. Hex is filled with promises and uncomplete features. In the name of Kismet please make it 'Early Access'.

Deathlock
04-05-2016, 04:20 PM
+1 for an "Early Access" mark. So many features aren't in the game yet and so much polishing is needed still.

GobBluth
04-05-2016, 04:28 PM
Hex needs to learn to under promise and over deliver. Claiming its an MMO and not initially putting it on steam as "Early Access" are the latest examples of this.

Chark
04-05-2016, 04:28 PM
Just want to thank everyone who is helping to provide feedback. We are going to make a few tweaks on the store based in part on your feedback.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 04:32 PM
just want to thank everyone who is helping to provide feedback. We are going to make a few tweaks on the store based in part on your feedback.

i will fly down there and kiss you passionately on the mouth if you list this as early access.

Kayas42
04-05-2016, 04:34 PM
One of the things that I'd be worried about is the lack of a rule book.

At some point you have to get serious and publish actual rules for the game instead of telling people that you just need to figure it out for yourself by playing.

It will not only help players who are new to TCGs but it will help bring people from other TCGs to transition better if they understand the game rules.

Zophie
04-05-2016, 04:35 PM
Zophie approves

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 04:37 PM
How do you have rules in a mmo? Not like you can mistime a card

Chark
04-05-2016, 04:41 PM
i will fly down there and kiss you passionately on the mouth if you list this as early access.

Early access is not going to happen, because it works against our goals for going to Steam. Other things like not labeling the game as an MMO and cleaning up bullet points and system requirements are reasonable.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 04:43 PM
Early access is not going to happen, because it defeats our goals for going to steam. Other things like not labeling the game as an MMO and cleaning up bullet points and system requirements are reasonable.

Hrrrmmm. I really worry ya'll will be called out on having a game that isn't complete yet. I hope I'm wrong.

Plus you just missed a passionate kiss!

Mejis
04-05-2016, 04:45 PM
Just want to thank everyone who is helping to provide feedback. We are going to make a few tweaks on the store based in part on your feedback.

Great to hear Chark :)

And of course, I'm sure you all know in the office that the only reason people are posting with passionate pleas is because of how much we adore HEX and want nothing but the best success for it :D

superdax
04-05-2016, 04:47 PM
Great to hear Chark :)

And of course, I'm sure you all know in the office that the only reason people are posting with passionate pleas is because of how much we adore HEX and want nothing but the best success for it :D

110%

Chark
04-05-2016, 04:49 PM
Great to hear Chark :)

And of course, I'm sure you all know in the office that the only reason people are posting with passionate pleas is because of how much we adore HEX and want nothing but the best success for it :D

We know. Someone making an account to make the first post on the forums regarding this topic proves this without a doubt. Most of you are very reasonable and raise reasonable concerns over this. We are lucky to have all of you in our gaming community.

P.S. I talked about giving community access to the game early to put up reviews and guides, but the consensus was that it could damage our reputation as a company that astroturfs their unreleased Steam game. So as soon as it's live, that's when people can post reviews and guides.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 04:52 PM
We know. Someone making an account to make the first post on the forums regarding this topic proves this without a doubt. Most of you are very reasonable and raise reasonable concerns over this. We are lucky to have all of you in our gaming community.

P.S. I talked about giving community access to the game early to put up reviews and guides, but the consensus was that it could damage our reputation as a company that astroturfs their unreleased Steam game. So as soon as it's live, that's when people can post reviews and guides.

Yeah, could well be the case.

I think we have to make sure everyone prefaces their reviews with "this is based on my extensive hours with HEX through the alpha/beta/released client over the last x years/months", or something to that effect.

bootlace
04-05-2016, 04:53 PM
Since it’s a little too late to suggest major overhauls or new systems/parts to the client I think what we could really use at this stage is a well produced 5/10 min or so video explaining exactly what Hex is and how to go about enjoying it for new players. As far as I know since the very outdated KS video, there's no such video like it.

The video IMO should have:

-A top down explanation of how this is the marriage of a TCG and an RPG but that there’s two distinct parts: PvE and PvP. Basically the elevator pitch we've heard a ton but isn't totally clear to new players.

- Explain how PvE is the completely F2P mode in which you have characters you level up and loot you earn and dungeons you tackle down and how there’s a ton of new content that’s going to be added over time just like an MMO. Advise them to play through this mode to learn the game in a stress/cost free environment.

-Explain how the PvP side of the game is for the most part a ‘pay to compete’ mode in which top players play in tournaments and how there’s a big eSports side in which already there was a 100k tournament. Maybe add a small comment how some players have managed to build up huge collections through sheer F2P grind/smart play but just like any eSports CCG you have to spend some money to build the best decks (this manages their expectations somewhat but does give glimmer of hope even for the F2Pers).

-Quickly list the different PvP games modes but make a special focus on gauntlet sealed which is the best way for new players to get into PvP (aka guide them towards this mode if they’re thinking of spending money).

-Explain how this game is a TCG and you can trade your cards with other players, you can buy sell stuff on the auction house, and you can even sell your cards for real money if you wish. Emphasize that everything they earn in game has potential real world value and is not just virtual dust as in most other games. Touch on how gold is earned in-game while platinum is bought but there is a robust player trade between the two so you can really buy anything off the auction house with either.

-Explain how this game is making great use of the digital space with things like selecting a champion, gems, equipment, and maybe examples of some really fun cards (to somewhat quell the unavoidable "isn't this a clone of MTG" comments).

-End it with something like 'Whether you're a totally F2P single player RPG fan or a skilled TCG eSports pro, this is a game that everyone will able to enjoy and that it's got features and depth like no other game out there.'

Basically this video is not going to teach them everything, not even close. But what it is going to do is first of all explain the gist of what this game is about. The most important thing is it should give the player curiosity/motivation to fight through whatever confusion/annoyances they might have because there’s quite a lot of awesome stuff that this game has to offer. It should make them excited just like that KS video excited most of us initially by throwing a lot of cool ideas/features into our imagination (none of us had any concrete details at that point, but we were certainly intrigued). This video should be on the client download page or if possible in the patcher itself as the game downloads so people enter the game having watched it.

From there on hopefully the community will step up and fill the other gaps through stuff like reddit/forum help, Twitch ‘demos/lessons’ of the PvP modes, and other guides and resources from third party sites. Oh and there's also people in the community who make great videos (Zophie,SeriousBsnsGames, etc) maybe they can get involved. My 2c.

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 04:56 PM
We believe that it will increase our acquisition of players. We are happy with the percentage of players who currently monetize and want to increase the funnel of overall players.

We believe that the alternative methods to acquire players (other marketing efforts) will cost us more than steam's cut on a lifetime value of a paying player.

I'm a bit curious about this response...

Are you happy with the percentage of new players that have monetized since the launch of campaign? I wouldn't surprise me if the total player base percentage was acceptable as nearly all of the pre-campaign base was already vested.

I'm skeptical regarding post campaign monetization as all the feedback I've seen has not pointed towards PvP retention from the f2p on boarding of campaign. Which totally makes sense to me as the game currently does nothing to explain, incentivize, or assist the transition from PvE to PvP for a new player. (I.E. Anything from an explaination of the economy and gold's place in it, to a smooth interface to buy your first pack with gold through the AH, to PvP ladder with rewards, to phantom limited)

If you aren't satisfied with the monetization rate post-campaign, I wouldn't expect much more from steam aside from an over-amplification of perceived feature lack.

GobBluth
04-05-2016, 05:00 PM
Since it’s a little too late to suggest major overhauls or new systems/parts to the client I think what we could really use at this stage is a well produced 5/10 min or so video explaining exactly what Hex is and how to go about enjoying it for new players. As far as I know since the very outdated KS video, there's no such video like it.

I agree that a video would be great. But I also think that there should be text to explain the same things. I don't know if I would want to sit through a 10 min. tutorial with no interaction with the game. I would rather be able to refer back to a webpage that had all of this information organized and presented well. I went on Hex's main page to look for this and, in its current state, its very convoluted.

wolzarg
04-05-2016, 05:02 PM
I agree that a video would be great. But I also think that there should be text to explain the same things. I don't know if I would want to sit through a 10 min. tutorial with no interaction with the game. I would rather be able to refer back to a webpage that had all of this information organized and presented well. I went on Hex's main page to look for this and, in its current state, its very convoluted.
On the bright side as soon as you nail down what is to be said it doesn't take more than one person all that much time to fix the information on the website.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 05:05 PM
Since it’s a little too late to suggest major overhauls or new systems/parts to the client I think what we could really use at this stage is a well produced 5/10 min or so video explaining exactly what Hex is and how to go about enjoying it for new players. As far as I know since the very outdated KS video, there's no such video like it.

The video IMO should have:

-A top down explanation of how this is the marriage of a TCG and an RPG but that there’s two distinct parts: PvE and PvP. Basically the elevator pitch we've heard a ton but isn't totally clear to new players.

- Explain how PvE is the completely F2P mode in which you have characters you level up and loot you earn and dungeons you tackle down and how there’s a ton of new content that’s going to be added over time just like an MMO. Advise them to play through this mode to learn the game in a stress/cost free environment.

-Explain how the PvP side of the game is for the most part a ‘pay to compete’ mode in which top players play in tournaments and how there’s a big eSports side in which already there was a 100k tournament. Maybe add a small comment how some players have managed to build up huge collections through sheer F2P grind/smart play but just like any eSports CCG you have to spend some money to build the best decks (this manages their expectations somewhat but does give glimmer of hope even for the F2Pers).

-Quickly list the different PvP games modes but make a special focus on gauntlet sealed which is the best way for new players to get into PvP (aka guide them towards this mode if they’re thinking of spending money).

-Explain how this game is a TCG and you can trade your cards with other players, you can buy sell stuff on the auction house, and you can even sell your cards for real money if you wish. Emphasize that everything they earn in game has potential real world value and is not just virtual dust as in most other games. Touch on how gold is earned in-game while platinum is bought but there is a robust player trade between the two so you can really buy anything off the auction house with either.

-Explain how this game is making great use of the digital space with things like selecting a champion, gems, equipment, and maybe examples of some really fun cards (to somewhat quell the unavoidable "isn't this a clone of MTG" comments).

-End it with something like 'Whether you're a totally F2P single player RPG fan or a skilled TCG eSports pro, this is a game that everyone will able to enjoy and that it's got features and depth like no other game out there.'

Basically this video is not going to teach them everything, not even close. But what it is going to do is first of all explain the gist of what this game is about. The most important thing is it should give the player curiosity/motivation to fight through whatever confusion/annoyances they might have because there’s quite a lot of awesome stuff that this game has to offer. It should make them excited just like that KS video excited most of us initially by throwing a lot of cool ideas/features into our imagination (none of us had any concrete details at that point, but we were certainly intrigued). This video should be on the client download page or if possible in the patcher itself as the game downloads so people enter the game having watched it.

From there on hopefully the community will step up and fill the other gaps through stuff like reddit/forum help, Twitch ‘demos/lessons’ of the PvP modes, and other guides and resources from third party sites. Oh and there's also people in the community who make great videos (Zophie,SeriousBsnsGames, etc) maybe they can get involved. My 2c.

In this vein, beyond this video, I'd showcase upcoming features, AZ2 and new level caps, ladders, other things on the roadmap HexEnt knows is coming sooner rather than later (as other posters have noted, under-promise, over-deliver seems more important on Steam than anywhere else).

I would stay off double-backs, keeps, raids, etc. until there is surety of when it will hit a patch. Fine to hype things waaaay down the road in this community, but I think there needs to be a ton of thought given to presentation when Steam is factored in.

bofedy
04-05-2016, 05:07 PM
im wanting to say more but bootlace is covering preety much what i think and i hope chark is talking notes as im sure you are :)

GobBluth
04-05-2016, 05:09 PM
On the bright side as soon as you nail down what is to be said it doesn't take more than one person all that much time to fix the information on the website.

They could have copied and pasted from the 1000s of different times this information has been provided to someone on Twitch.

Voormas
04-05-2016, 05:12 PM
I think this will be great overall - might be a few downsides (not all the money going to CZE - you guys deserve every cent!) but I mean just getting more people in and playing can't be bad now that we are approaching a critical mass of content

A few questions about linking accounts;

* It won't affect your in-game name right? Like I imagine integrating Steamworks would be part of this, but I don't know enough about how that works
* By "linking" I take it this is some irreversible decision, or does it just mean when you launch the client through Steam they get a cut?
* Does this maybe affect your eventual plans for the Auction House? The Community Market already has bid/ask...

Anyway thanks for taking the time to read these and be so candid about some of your decision making :) Also don't all get burnt out making this game just because we players are so enthusiastic / demanding; we're in it for the long haul, we don't want you guys getting sacrificed on Kismet's altar :p

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 05:12 PM
I agree don't mention anything till you got a date. Least steam wise

Refugee
04-05-2016, 05:14 PM
We know. Someone making an account to make the first post on the forums regarding this topic proves this without a doubt. Most of you are very reasonable and raise reasonable concerns over this. We are lucky to have all of you in our gaming community.

P.S. I talked about giving community access to the game early to put up reviews and guides, but the consensus was that it could damage our reputation as a company that astroturfs their unreleased Steam game. So as soon as it's live, that's when people can post reviews and guides.

My work around for the guide problem. I'm simply making the guide under another game and will cut/paste it over when Hex releases on steam. The guide doesn't show unless published but it still allows you to get all the formatting and such done properly.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 05:18 PM
I honestly don't know how you would do it as right now the only thing I can think of is a bland tournament page, but all pics and movies are solely PvE, can anyone think of an in-game shot that really gives a PvP feel?

Also, I agree with other peeps here, while I am critical of not having it listed as early access, HexEnt has their reasons which I am sure are sound, and I beat that horse only because I always imagined that if this game were to hit Steam, it could be massive, and I really, really want that to happen.

EDIT: Maybe a pack and platinum tourney fee splash over a busy tournament page to represent some PvP is acceptable at this point? All of the media on the steam page really makes it look like a PvE game only and many people hit images only and skip the description on 'free' games.

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 05:18 PM
I really love bootlace's video post and also agree that some ingame text is needed at a minimum to guide players even with the video. Having a rule set would be pretty sweet too.

Sadly I also agree with bootlace's assertion that sealed gauntlet is currently the best new player first step into Hex PvP... But that is a $14 store - $11 AH cost to initial PvP experience (or 1100plat = ~140k gold + AH savvy = 10-20+ hours arena grind + player skill).

I really wish HXE would get serious about providing a better path to get people involved in spending some money.

Chark
04-05-2016, 05:25 PM
I think this will be great overall - might be a few downsides (not all the money going to CZE - you guys deserve every cent!) but I mean just getting more people in and playing can't be bad now that we are approaching a critical mass of content

A few questions about linking accounts;

* It won't affect your in-game name right? Like I imagine integrating Steamworks would be part of this, but I don't know enough about how that works
* By "linking" I take it this is some irreversible decision, or does it just mean when you launch the client through Steam they get a cut?
* Does this maybe affect your eventual plans for the Auction House? The Community Market already has bid/ask...

Anyway thanks for taking the time to read these and be so candid about some of your decision making :) Also don't all get burnt out making this game just because we players are so enthusiastic / demanding; we're in it for the long haul, we don't want you guys getting sacrificed on Kismet's altar :p

Your in-game names are safe.
It's pseudo-irreversible. I think you would need to contact CS to unlink.
We're investigating the community market, but the game won't interact with it on Steam initial launch.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 05:29 PM
I honestly don't know how you would do it as right now the only thing I can think of is a bland tournament page, but all pics and movies are solely PvE, can anyone think of an in-game shot that really gives a PvP feel?

Also, I agree with other peeps here, while I am critical of not having it listed as early access, HexEnt has their reasons which I am sure are sound, and I beat that horse only because I always imagined that if this game were to hit Steam, it could be massive, and I really, really want that to happen.

EDIT: Maybe a pack and platinum tourney fee splash over a busy tournament page to represent some PvP is acceptable at this point? All of the media on the steam page really makes it look like a PvE game only and many people hit images only and skip the description on 'free' games.

I think show some video and screenshots of drafting and the sealed interface (e.g. gauntlet sealed between matches).
Show a pic or the tournament lobby, highlighting the different draft types.

superdax
04-05-2016, 05:30 PM
I really love bootlace's video post and also agree that some ingame text is needed at a minimum to guide players even with the video. Having a rule set would be pretty sweet too.

Sadly I also agree with bootlace's assertion that sealed gauntlet is currently the best new player first step into Hex PvP... But that is a $14 store - $11 AH cost to initial PvP experience (or 1100plat = ~140k gold + AH savvy = 10-20+ hours arena grind + player skill).

I really wish HXE would get serious about providing a better path to get people involved in spending some money.

How about selling the game for like 10$ (or an option to do so, i don,t know how steam works) and give them a bunch of stuff with it (like a gauthlet ticket, a bunch of PVE packs, 1 VIP ticket) something to let them sink into it.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 05:32 PM
How about selling the game for like 10$ (or an option to do so, i don,t know how steam works) and give them a bunch of stuff with it (like a gauthlet ticket, a bunch of PVE packs, 1 VIP ticket) something to let them sink into it.

Uh.... That be bad idea.

Svenn
04-05-2016, 05:33 PM
Yeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee eees!

superdax
04-05-2016, 05:38 PM
Uh.... That be bad idea.

The other card game does exactly that, but in exchange you get a bunch of tickets and stuff to compensate and lets you try new player experience. Still not bad in my book.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 05:40 PM
Hex isn't going to do that.

hex_colin
04-05-2016, 05:40 PM
I really wish HXE would get serious about providing a better path to get people involved in spending some money.

I'd bet a lot of money that you'll never see "phantom" tournaments of any form, except for maybe the PVE "draft" dungeon that's been discussed in the past.

That being said, there are other ways to reduce the cost of participation. We'll see that soon enough.

Chark
04-05-2016, 05:41 PM
How about selling the game for like 10$ (or an option to do so, i don,t know how steam works) and give them a bunch of stuff with it (like a gauthlet ticket, a bunch of PVE packs, 1 VIP ticket) something to let them sink into it.

We considered this route. I was pitching a version of this idea internally. We collectively decided that positioning ourselves in the free to play section was stronger.

phoix
04-05-2016, 05:42 PM
I'd really like to see Rock league/pauper or some variant of it become an officially supported format some time after the Steam launch. I don't think there are enough players to split constructed queues at the moment, but I think it'd be a great stepping stone once the playerbase is there.

fido_one
04-05-2016, 05:44 PM
Here is a question for Chark and co:

How do you plan on interacting with the steam community, and do you plan on driving that community here or letting it stand on its own with occasional input as you do on the Hex reddit threads?

Mokog
04-05-2016, 05:45 PM
So did anyone notice the account creation screen captures in the new Steam video? Just me? Has it been so long since I made an account I have no idea what making a new one is like? Yeah that's accurate.

4355

knightofeffect
04-05-2016, 05:47 PM
I'd bet a lot of money that you'll never see "phantom" tournaments of any form, except for maybe the PVE "draft" dungeon that's been discussed in the past.

That being said, there are other ways to reduce the cost of participation. We'll see that soon enough.

Yea man, that's cool. Just thinking about it myself, I couldn't come up with something better than phantom limited and couldn't see a lot of downsides, but I'm totally for a new idea.

I by no means have the best option, and if Hex came up with a more effective way to buy people into PvP than phantom limited, it could be the real differentiating factor in making Hex a massive success.

That would be my dream. I'm already firmly bought in myself and don't plan on stopping, so my only dog in this fight is Hex being the biggest it possibly can, and personally I view the cost of initial participation in PvP as the biggest stumbling block in its way.

There are a multitude of options, but I just hope its on the top of the priority list... Aside from timely PvP releases =)

superdax
04-05-2016, 05:49 PM
I'd bet a lot of money that you'll never see "phantom" tournaments of any form, except for maybe the PVE "draft" dungeon that's been discussed in the past.

That being said, there are other ways to reduce the cost of participation. We'll see that soon enough.

How much money would you bet............ i'd turn to Cory and give him 90% of that to make them and keep 10% :) :) :)

superdax
04-05-2016, 05:50 PM
Yea man, that's cool. Just thinking about it myself, I couldn't come up with something better than phantom limited and couldn't see a lot of downsides, but I'm totally for a new idea.

I by no means have the best option, and if Hex came up with a more effective way to buy people into PvP than phantom limited, it could be the real differentiating factor in making Hex a massive success.

That would be my dream. I'm already firmly bought in myself and don't plan on stopping, so my only dog in this fight is Hex being the biggest it possibly can, and personally I view the cost of initial participation in PvP as the biggest stumbling block in its way.

There are a multitude of options, but I just hope its on the top of the priority list... Aside from timely PvP releases =)

They could reduce the cost by adding a second payment option
Ex: 1400 plat or 700 plat and 30,000 gold ? ;)

Chark
04-05-2016, 05:50 PM
I loled at the user-defined tags

4356

wolzarg
04-05-2016, 05:51 PM
How much money would you bet............ i'd turn to Cory and give him 90% of that to make them and keep 10% :) :) :)
Never make a bet you can't cower.

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 05:51 PM
Oh well they can't sue again lol

wolzarg
04-05-2016, 05:52 PM
I loled at the user-defined tags

4356
Seems perfectly fine its both a card game and a trading card game. Its definitely a rpg and a very decent free to play massive multiplayer game i see no issue. :rolleyes:

bofedy
04-05-2016, 06:09 PM
I loled at the user-defined tags

4356

well you do have counterMAGIC card :P

WolfCrypt
04-05-2016, 06:10 PM
well you do have counterMAGIC card :P

Burn!

nicosharp
04-05-2016, 06:39 PM
Steam is a good move.
I don't think it is premature, but you are missing maybe 3 things in total that are really needed in the game:

#1 - Brief overview of short and long-term development plan for both PvE and PvP content, and proposed release structure, including future content plans (yeah, that's kinda big) (This could be in the steam product overview area for sure)

#2 - Some sort of in-game marketing model linchpin - I mentioned a few times an idea of having an in campaign NPC that you can buy Player posted Plat, or Player posted packs, for Player specified Gold (Could have price floor and price ceiling as needed for f2p control - pP(per Plat) or pp(per pack))

#3 - A little more weaving around current content offerings in client - reference material/like rules/marketing model. Removal of relics like notion of KS - it just seems off-putting. Basically, transparency in some places that it's lacking, and lack of transparency in other places it's no longer needed.


Again, I think it's a great move for visibility. I hope people that try it as soon as it pops up don't disappear before AZ3, but at least the temporary in-flux will generate a buzz. If gameforge gets a cut, why not steam?

KingGabriel
04-05-2016, 06:55 PM
Re: all the comments about the new player experience.
Check out this post for example over on the sub reddit.


https://www.reddit.com/r/hextcg/comments/4dgoan/newbie_so_many_questions_help/

This person was good enough to seek help properly, but I worry many steam users won't!

Bad example. They didn't see the sticky linking to my new player guide on the subreddit, which is the first post. Talking of, if anyone has any feedback on that feel free to pm me.

iplayfromwork
04-05-2016, 07:00 PM
This is big news :)

Just about the correct time and direction I would say (HEX has thus far been lacklusterous in the marketing side). More players = More income = More content = More fun!

Mejis
04-05-2016, 07:14 PM
Bad example. They didn't see the sticky linking to my new player guide on the subreddit, which is the first post. Talking of, if anyone has any feedback on that feel free to pm me.

Not really what I was getting at. The point was:

The player played HEX. Got confused. Left the game with a whole load of unanswered questions. How that person goes about getting the answers, be it from reddit, from a sticky, or from these forums, is getting past the point that they shouldn't have to be seeking such questions outside of the game: it should already by there in the form of the new player experience.

essif
04-05-2016, 11:32 PM
Early access is not going to happen, because it works against our goals for going to Steam. Other things like not labeling the game as an MMO and cleaning up bullet points and system requirements are reasonable.

I really wish you would reconsider this. If you are honest towards yourself steam is a perfect example of a good early access game. It's in a very playable state, but you expect the players to fill out the missing dots while finishing the core of the game.

I'm sure HEX wil get a fairly good review score at launch, because a lot of existing players will go in and make a positive review (myself included). But imo. the current state of the game begs for a red "mixed" label on the store which might hunt the game for years.

Unless your goal with the steam launch is to solve short term money problems, I don't see how early access isn't the right answer.

Mejis
04-05-2016, 11:44 PM
Unless your goal with the steam launch is to solve short term money problems, I don't see how early access isn't the right answer.

One certainly hopes this isn't the case. Set 4 release (when is that btw? :P) should provide a tasty boost in revenue.

Cernz
04-05-2016, 11:59 PM
One certainly hopes this isn't the case. Set 4 release (when is that btw? :P) should provide a tasty boost in revenue.

well depends, guess lots of "veteran" players are sitting on a huge amount of plat - so they dont need to invest money i assume.

essif
04-06-2016, 12:05 AM
One certainly hopes this isn't the case. Set 4 release (when is that btw? :P) should provide a tasty boost in revenue.

I would be surprised if it's the case, but I think cory said the team was 50 man big now, so this makes me wonder.

There is of cause also another possible scenario: Set 4 brings along a significantly better new player experience, including better introduction to PvP for non-tcg-veterans. But even if this is the case, why not test this first on the existing player base?

To me it seems they are in a rush, since they want to push this very close to a major and very anticipated set 4 release.

Fateanomaly
04-06-2016, 12:07 AM
Hex just declared they are out of beta and you want them to label itself as early access? That is going to invite so much ridicule.

Lisa89
04-06-2016, 12:41 AM
Please remove the "Free to Play" tag.
I know that technically PvP can be played for free but... no, and when Steam ppl download a F2P game and they found they have to pay (or farm like a maniac) for playing PvP they just gonna put tons of negative reviews without even trying to fully explore the game :(
Not all of them ofc, but i'm kinda scared... :(

ShloobeR
04-06-2016, 12:46 AM
Yes. the 'free to play' tag, while by definition true, may end up causing more issues than it solves

Voormas
04-06-2016, 12:49 AM
That reminds me, I should add a "Pay to Compete" user-defined tag :p

Mejis
04-06-2016, 01:02 AM
Please remove the "Free to Play" tag.
I know that technically PvP can be played for free but... no, and when Steam ppl download a F2P game and they found they have to pay (or farm like a maniac) for playing PvP they just gonna put tons of negative reviews without even trying to fully explore the game :(
Not all of them ofc, but i'm kinda scared... :(

How do steam tags work? Is it the more people tag a term then it'll actually show up? Or is it the devs that tag it?

WolfCrypt
04-06-2016, 01:09 AM
We're just going to have hope this works...

lightreaper
04-06-2016, 01:14 AM
Early Access is a black mark that I actively avoid on Steam, and though I'm not going to be naive enough to extrapolate that out to a sizable portion of the Steam user base, I do feel that there are going to be a lot of people who are the same way when it comes to purchasing decisions on steam.

Assuming that the launch comes with a new player progression that is internally well considered and explained (not reliant on outside of game resources), putting it up on steam as a full release seems like a smart move. I think people are projecting their own misgivings when it comes to long term design goals (as pitched in the kickstarter) onto a new player, who won't even be aware of that stuff unless they actively seek out that information.

It is my hope that this push on steam comes with better integrated social features (no more clicking on chat buttons to see 'coming soon!'), guilds and a better guided experience for new players.

Jemy000
04-06-2016, 01:16 AM
This is exciting, but I'm apprehensive too. in addition to Bootlace's great video idea, AZ1 really needs some editing before the masses get in to tear it down. (Refer here: http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=48494). Changing some text would be a simple fix, right?

P.S. Can we get an update on how the tablet version is coming along?

Enyeez
04-06-2016, 01:25 AM
Sounds like I won't be using Steam for Hex then! ;)

Will Steam change any of the UI or how transactions are processed (ie - through Steam instead of Gameforge)?

I thought of it that way, but the more money Steam makes, the more likely they are to advertise it on the front page, or have offers to draw players in, all which benefits Hex, and it's creators.

Edit:
and when you review the game on Steam it shows you how much time you've spent playing, which in my experience help validate the review if you have many hours logged.

Fateanomaly
04-06-2016, 01:46 AM
Is that how steam works? Do they show the games on their main page based on how profitable the game is? Can they have offers for hex considering hex is only selling plat?

Mejis
04-06-2016, 02:14 AM
Edit:
and when you review the game on Steam it shows you how much time you've spent playing, which in my experience help validate the review if you have many hours logged.

This is very true, which is why it's important that all here that review HEX when it hits steam (hopefully everyone!) will preface their review with the fact their experience is based on non-steam time.

Valnir
04-06-2016, 02:24 AM
Well, this is good new I guess as long as they dont have too much influence on the game/payments.
But for sure Steam->More players->more drafts, bigger events, slightly more AH sales and so on So I alongside the game, the players will benefit from this too!

eimerian
04-06-2016, 02:46 AM
Will the game be updated and downloaded via Steam?
Will Steam effectively replace the Hex launcher?
Don't tell me Steam will "launch the launcher" (like how for Ubisoft games Steam merely opens up Uplay...).

nickon
04-06-2016, 02:58 AM
I don't have any particular side on this other than saying that I think we all share the same vision as CZE. Which is for HEX to stick around and eventually get big :) And I support Cory and the team in their decisions to drive us towards that goal.

I like how they ask for our input and actually will be picking up some of that stuff before the big release on Steam. And how there are alot of passionate people in our community providing constructive feedback! Kudos to all of them! I do feel like a 'trial run' or double check with the community would be a good thing so we're sure HEX will make a good first impression and set the correct expectations to new players on Steam. Keep in mind that it's always difficult to objectively evaluate something you've made yourself without being at least a little bit biased and that outside look on things can make all the difference.

Again I want to emphasize that, as of now, there's no real reason for us existing players to move to Steam. Being able to launch and update the game from Steam is not a benefit you should move accounts for. Maybe there will be incentives to do so in the future, I don't know, but in the best interest of the game do not move your account to Steam to make sure CZE gets the max amount of your money.

Gregangel
04-06-2016, 03:26 AM
Please remove the "Free to Play" tag.
I know that technically PvP can be played for free but... no, and when Steam ppl download a F2P game and they found they have to pay (or farm like a maniac) for playing PvP they just gonna put tons of negative reviews without even trying to fully explore the game :(
Not all of them ofc, but i'm kinda scared... :(

A big part of the game is actually free to play so the tag is ok.
Don't care about players who thinks f2p means they can play all the game with the same easiness without paying for it than the players ready to spend some cash.
These players are not good costumers for Hex anyway

Sixlooter
04-06-2016, 03:36 AM
Again I want to emphasize that, as of now, there's no real reason for us existing players to move to Steam. Being able to launch and update the game from Steam is not a benefit you should move accounts for. Maybe there will be incentives to do so in the future, I don't know, but in the best interest of the game do not move your account to Steam to make sure CZE gets the max amount of your money.

I strongly support that. CZE is in an important state, where every dollar counts and is anyway re-invested in the game and not put our to any investors. I like steam as a big library of alot of games I played, but no real reason atm to switch.

ManofPeace
04-06-2016, 03:49 AM
Don't we get the benefit of steam stats if we launch from steam (do you have to link to count as a "steam" player)? That would help the game move up in the "Most Popular" sorting and be more visible which is the entire point.

publicuser
04-06-2016, 04:24 AM
I think it is a good initiative to list out Hex on steam.

However Newton's Third Law just popped in my mind. "For every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction."

A lot of guys here are focused on the New Player's feedback, but I was thinking what about Hex's competitors & their community. How would they respond? Would they write negative reviews? or Would they just give negative scoring, What else could they do? And how would HexEnt or our community react/respond to it?
I believe this a very likely scenario that will very soon come to pass .

ManofPeace
04-06-2016, 04:38 AM
Sounds like an odd thought. What, if anything is that line of thought based on?

nickon
04-06-2016, 04:40 AM
To come back on my statement, neo just made the good remark on his stream, that linking our account to Steam should not necessarily mean CZE doesn't get the full amount of our money when we purchase platinum, as long as we buy our platinum via non-Steam client.

This way CZE gets to benefit from us being a Steam player (in terms of getting up the ranking and what not) and more importantly cash in on the full amount of money we spend on plat.

Chark, can you confirm? What would CZE like existing players to do?

ThrawnOmega
04-06-2016, 05:08 AM
I may shift payment over to through steam, TBH. Simply because my card is declined and I have to tell Wells Fargo the purchase is legit EVERY SINGLE TIME I buy plat. Easier payment means I'll spend more often, which on net makes more for Hex.

You want to talk about new player experience killer? How many people would put up with multiple calls the the bank explaining a German transaction in the US. That's a huge buzzkill to a new player feeling motivated to make that first cash purchase.

Maybe I'm an extreme fringe case, but I wanted to make the counter argument that using Valves store can be the better option for some people.

Lisa89
04-06-2016, 05:32 AM
A big part of the game is actually free to play so the tag is ok.
Don't care about players who thinks f2p means they can play all the game with the same easiness without paying for it than the players ready to spend some cash.
These players are not good costumers for Hex anyway

Okay, don't care about them, fine, but that's not the problem.
The problem is they can put negative reviews, that mean Steam tagging HEX with a "thumb down", thumb down mean lesser interest from Steam community, lesser interest mean lesser players (and not only "F2P scrubs") trying HEX, and ofc, that mean lesser money income and HEX community growth.
I'm not a prophet Coyotle, I'm not telling this is actually gonna happen... but I'm worried it will happen :(

Sorry for my bad english, I hope you can understand what I mean.

Quantius
04-06-2016, 05:34 AM
I may shift payment over to through steam, TBH. Simply because my card is declined and I have to tell Wells Fargo the purchase is legit EVERY SINGLE TIME I buy plat. Easier payment means I'll spend more often, which on net makes more for Hex.

You want to talk about new player experience killer? How many people would put up with multiple calls the the bank explaining a German transaction in the US. That's a huge buzzkill to a new player feeling motivated to make that first cash purchase.

Maybe I'm an extreme fringe case, but I wanted to make the counter argument that using Valves store can be the better option for some people.

Hey, me too! I have to call my bank every time (Capital One). I even told them to put a flag on the account to let these charges through too, but it continues to happen.

Sixlooter
04-06-2016, 05:37 AM
To come back on my statement, neo just made the good remark on his stream, that linking our account to Steam should not necessarily mean CZE doesn't get the full amount of our money when we purchase platinum, as long as we buy our platinum via non-Steam client.

This way CZE gets to benefit from us being a Steam player (in terms of getting up the ranking and what not) and more importantly cash in on the full amount of money we spend on plat.

Chark, can you confirm? What would CZE like existing players to do?

This would be an important info. I want the game to be popular and that all my dollars directly go into Cory's pocket. Expensive booze and cheap h**kers don't come for free these days... ;)

brighten34
04-06-2016, 06:20 AM
I'd like to chime in and add that I also can't purchase plat without issues (on the bright side - it's saved me from spending a lot of money.)

Daer
04-06-2016, 06:29 AM
Yeah I am 100% linking my account to Steam the second it is available. Having payments be processed through Steam rather than Gameforge is a huge plus.

Warrender
04-06-2016, 06:34 AM
Yeah I am 100% linking my account to Steam the second it is available. Having payments be processed through Steam rather than Gameforge is a huge plus.

Same here. I get why people would not want to. But, I've been invested in Steam far longer than Hex and it's my personal preference when it comes to buying PC games by far.

Koz
04-06-2016, 06:35 AM
To come back on my statement, neo just made the good remark on his stream, that linking our account to Steam should not necessarily mean CZE doesn't get the full amount of our money when we purchase platinum, as long as we buy our platinum via non-Steam client.

This way CZE gets to benefit from us being a Steam player (in terms of getting up the ranking and what not) and more importantly cash in on the full amount of money we spend on plat.

Chark, can you confirm? What would CZE like existing players to do?

If we can buy plat outside of Steam so that CZE get their full cut, then I'll definitely link my game. Will help with making the game more visible

fido_one
04-06-2016, 06:44 AM
If we can buy plat outside of Steam so that CZE get their full cut, then I'll definitely link my game. Will help with making the game more visible

I don't see why this wouldn't be possible; we can currently access the website payment gateway after logging into Gameforge's Hex page by clicking ' top up on platinum '. If they don't take that away, I'm assuming I spend $$$ there and money goes into my Hex account regardless if it is attached to steam or not.

Fred
04-06-2016, 06:47 AM
With Hex coming to Steam soon, is there hopes of having the Hex client run on SteamOS (and thus Linux)?

fido_one
04-06-2016, 07:05 AM
With Hex coming to Steam soon, is there hopes of having the Hex client run on SteamOS (and thus Linux)?

Doubtful, as they have to get the client running in Linux for that to happen. HexEnt hasn't stated they are going to move to Linux, and porting to a tablet will probably take priority.

incitfulmonk21
04-06-2016, 07:38 AM
I may shift payment over to through steam, TBH. Simply because my card is declined and I have to tell Wells Fargo the purchase is legit EVERY SINGLE TIME I buy plat. Easier payment means I'll spend more often, which on net makes more for Hex.

You want to talk about new player experience killer? How many people would put up with multiple calls the the bank explaining a German transaction in the US. That's a huge buzzkill to a new player feeling motivated to make that first cash purchase.

Maybe I'm an extreme fringe case, but I wanted to make the counter argument that using Valves store can be the better option for some people.

I had the same problem. If you tell Wellsfargo you are traveling to Germany they will pre -authorize you for up to a year and it wont get declined anymore.

ThrawnOmega
04-06-2016, 09:09 AM
I had the same problem. If you tell Wellsfargo you are traveling to Germany they will pre -authorize you for up to a year and it wont get declined anymore.

That's good to know. Silly to have to go to such measures though. I get my bank wanting to protect me from fraud, but I've told them at least 5x that Gameforge is legit - still gets flagged every time.

This is the biggest new player experience killer, and it isn't even Hex's fault LOL. Steam will cut out this annoyance for a lot of players.

I understand people's concerns about on boarding as-is. I'm going to be an optimist and hope we're not giving people enough credit that they will make the small effort needed to learn the UI and understand how things work.

Chocmaw
04-06-2016, 09:11 AM
We believe that it will increase our acquisition of players. We are happy with the percentage of players who currently monetize and want to increase the funnel of overall players.

...

I want to talk about this.

To me, it isn't increasing the overall funnel.

It's like adding a new, giant funnel, hooked up to a sea of octane that has the chance to either take you to the next level, or blow up in your face and smash everyone to kingdom come.

The current crop of players, whom you are basing your percentages on, have all largely come in due to some form of interest in TCG's. Hex is the best online TCG out there in terms of feature-richness and thus, the behaviour displayed by these people, paints a picture that might give you some level of comfort.

Taking a an educated gamble is alright, but I fear you haven't applied the right lens to your analysis. This is the sort of stuff that has the potential to kill the game.

You're now proposing to set our baby loose in the frigging jungle without standard protective gear.

I'm sorry, but the analogy was trying to say that in my widely-shared opinion, the game is not yet polished enough in terms of UI or new player experience to survive the expectations of a large, fickle audience that have taken the phenomenon of group-think to levels that will fuel textbooks examining the evolution of human society, in years to come.

Questions:
1. Have you done any kind of vox pop exercise via a focus group specific to Steam to understand the perception of the game if it was released in its current state? This is Product Marketing 101 stuff, and if you have done it to help support the decision, at the very least tell us, if you can't share the results.

2. Will there be a major patch that overhauls the UI/New Player experience to make it "Steam" ready before it goes live?

3. Is the release on Steam time-critical to such an extent that it needs to be done asap?

I have faith in the game, but it is just not ready to survive expectations of people who don't know anything about the genre or approach to becoming a successful long-term player in this unique model.

I implore you to revisit these 2 elements before you release the game on Steam:

1. Set the right expectations for people up front. One of the better suggested options from this thread is to use the video idea from Bootlace and add it to the in-game client so that people can watch it before they play.

2. Improve the UI/New Player experience - Use a focus group specific to Steam, to get feedback and postpone the release if needed to incorporate it

Fred
04-06-2016, 09:54 AM
Will it be made clear to new users (which will hopefully come in great numbers from Steam) that the character naming system in Hex is very different than it is in other games? If I remember correctly, it was stated numerous times during the Kickstarter that our names are "Keep names", i.e. the name of a place, and not the name of a person. That fact is also hinted at in the first screen where you create your account (or at least it was last saw someone create an account) and you are prompted with "Lord of ______".

I feel like the distinction between keep name and character name is already very misunderstood within the existing community. If it's not explained to the masses, that will probably mess up the whole naming system once keeps are actually implemented.

Maulet
04-06-2016, 10:14 AM
hello, one question: how will we redeem the key for steam? in our account store?

thanks!

Quantius
04-06-2016, 10:24 AM
Most important questions:

Will there be Steam bundles?
Will there be Steam launch sleeves?
And where the hell is set 4?!

Svenn
04-06-2016, 10:38 AM
Again I want to emphasize that, as of now, there's no real reason for us existing players to move to Steam. Being able to launch and update the game from Steam is not a benefit you should move accounts for. Maybe there will be incentives to do so in the future, I don't know, but in the best interest of the game do not move your account to Steam to make sure CZE gets the max amount of your money.

I will be linking immediately. There are plenty of benefits. Auto-updates. Easy installing/re-installing.

There are benefits to HexEnt as well. When playing on Steam your friends can see it and go "what's that? *click view store page*". It's quick and easy advertising, much better than adding non-steam games. There's lists of number of users playing a specific game on steam. Having Hex be higher up on that list is good. More positive reviews is good. More sales through Steam means more likely to show up in people's discovery queue or on the front page.

So sure, Steam takes a cut, but the amount of exposure from people playing on Steam is massive.

Chark
04-06-2016, 10:39 AM
Chark, can you confirm? What would CZE like existing players to do?

I can't tell players what to do: everyone has to decide for themselves.

If you link your account to steam, when you click the in-game buy plat button, you'll be taken to a steam interface to buy platinum.
If you don't link your account steam, you'll continue to have the same experience as you currently have.

At the end of the day, we are happy that you play our game and of course a little happier if you buy plat/pack. How specifically you buy plat/packs is not as important.

Tazelbain
04-06-2016, 10:40 AM
Most important questions:

Will there be Steam bundles?
Will there be Steam launch sleeves?
And where the hell is set 4?!Already answered. No. No. Soon™

Chark
04-06-2016, 10:44 AM
Most important questions:

Will there be Steam bundles?
Will there be Steam launch sleeves?
And where the hell is set 4?!

No initial steam bundles. I am doing my best to ensure that everything that's in a steam bundle is available to players outside of buying it on steam.
There is no exclusive steam sleeve. We don't want to "force" people to link accounts.
Primal Dawn is coming. I don't have a specific date to share with you.

Chark
04-06-2016, 10:46 AM
hello, one question: how will we redeem the key for steam? in our account store?

thanks!

It's free to play on steam, so there are no keys. You'll download the client through steam and either create a new in-game account, or attach your existing account to steam.

Gregangel
04-06-2016, 10:47 AM
Like winter in GoT ?

MasterN64
04-06-2016, 10:47 AM
I tend to agree with it being worth linking to steam. I always have steam up and running so its just going to be much easier.

I will say that we will totally need a good intro built into the initial startup of the game to introduce the ingame economy of gold vs plat and the AH. The largest issue really is the whole THIS ISNT FREE TO PLAY reviews that will very obviously spam the comments and reviews. As others have noted hes has a living and breathing economy that you have to use to be a genuine free to play player. Most people would take the term free to play as not needing to do those steps.

Gregangel
04-06-2016, 10:50 AM
Question : can we unlink our account if we want ?

WolfCrypt
04-06-2016, 10:53 AM
Frankly I already have Hex downloaded so I see no point in redownloading it from Steam I'll however maybe write a guide and a review.

fido_one
04-06-2016, 10:53 AM
I can't tell players what to do: everyone has to decide for themselves.

If you link your account to steam, when you click the in-game buy plat button, you'll be taken to a steam interface to buy platinum.
If you don't link your account steam, you'll continue to have the same experience as you currently have.

At the end of the day, we are happy that you play our game and of course a little happier if you buy plat/pack. How specifically you buy plat/packs is not as important.

Chark, can we link to Steam and still pay via the gameforge web portal (accessible after authenticating via https://en.hex.gameforge.com/) if we desire? I would like to use that depending on gift cards offered there but do like linking my Hex friends into Steam which would have me porting over my account.

Tazelbain
04-06-2016, 11:12 AM
Like winter in GoT ?Careful, a minotaur always repays their debts.

wolzarg
04-06-2016, 12:03 PM
Question : can we unlink our account if we want ?
This shouldn't be impossible but its tricky and involves support last we heard.

WolfCrypt
04-06-2016, 12:10 PM
If you don't wanna link your account don't download it from steam?

Koz
04-06-2016, 12:27 PM
If you don't wanna link your account don't download it from steam?

If someone wants to write a review for a game they have to have it installed via Steam and have to have played it at least 5 min...

WolfCrypt
04-06-2016, 12:41 PM
Really?

Xenavire
04-06-2016, 12:51 PM
Chark, can we link to Steam and still pay via the gameforge web portal (accessible after authenticating via https://en.hex.gameforge.com/) if we desire? I would like to use that depending on gift cards offered there but do like linking my Hex friends into Steam which would have me porting over my account.

This seems likely, for existing accounts. With no insight into how steam accounts will work without linking to an existing account, I can't be sure if it would be universally possible.

It is certainly something I will keep an eye out for before I make my final decision about linking.

Chark, relevant question: if steam accounts can be unique, do they violate the multiple account rule if you also have a normal account? (Not particularly interested myself, but this is guaranteed to come up eventually.)

magic_gazz
04-06-2016, 12:58 PM
Chark, can we link to Steam and still pay via the gameforge web portal (accessible after authenticating via https://en.hex.gameforge.com/) if we desire? I would like to use that depending on gift cards offered there but do like linking my Hex friends into Steam which would have me porting over my account.

It is possible they are not allowed to answer this question. I would guess that steam would not be happy with them telling users how to avoid giving the a cut.

MaximumSquid
04-06-2016, 01:44 PM
The forum is very dead on the steam page. . .

I'm pretty sure word has gotten around quite a bit for this game (with the older generation obviously)

Steam will bring an absolute flood of younger players to the game so be ready for a lot of whining and confusion in chat

Ben
04-06-2016, 02:28 PM
I don't see how this game cannot be labelled as Early Access on Steam. Once steam users find out how lacking of content the single player RPG side of the game is, Hex wont have any feet to stand on at least for that side of the game. To pile on there's no raids or any way to interact with others in the RPG world making the MMO tag seem very suspect at best.

This way of going about the product will work with the current population because we began playing knowing what Hex was, a work in progress. If I was on the outside looking in, free to play or not the amount of content for a released game is mediocre at best. As long as the game benefits from being on steam, that's all that matters. However a large portion of the players you'll find there will not understand how a released game has such little content.

fido_one
04-06-2016, 02:31 PM
I don't see how this game cannot be labelled as Early Access on Steam. Once steam users find out how lacking of content the single player RPG side of the game is, Hex wont have any feet to stand on at least for that side of the game. To pile on there's no raids or any way to interact with others in the RPG world making the MMO tag seem very suspect at best.

This way of going about the product will work with the current population because we began playing knowing what Hex was, a work in progress. If I was on the outside looking in, free to play or not the amount of content for a released game is mediocre at best. As long as the game benefits from being on steam, that's all that matters. However a large portion of the players you'll find there will not understand how a released game has such little content.

I beat that horse a bit, Chark responded by saying it's against their goals in releasing on Steam as 'Early Access', which, well, fair play, I appreciate the direct response.

They did insinuate that they are re-evaluating the MMO tag because of this thread.

Ben
04-06-2016, 02:56 PM
I beat that horse a bit, Chark responded by saying it's against their goals in releasing on Steam as 'Early Access', which, well, fair play, I appreciate the direct response.

They did insinuate that they are re-evaluating the MMO tag because of this thread.

I don't see how that will fly for most. If you look at the main steam page, it looks like the game is already done. If you announce that there will be more to come in terms of content because right now there isn't enough for a released game, you're essentially admitting the game is early access. I don't see how this endeavour will work as well as it could going down this route.

superdax
04-06-2016, 03:12 PM
I don't see how that will fly for most. If you look at the main steam page, it looks like the game is already done. If you announce that there will be more to come in terms of content because right now there isn't enough for a released game, you're essentially admitting the game is early access. I don't see how this endeavour will work as well as it could going down this route.

The thing is that there will always have more content to be released. AZ2-3-4-5-6 etc.. 7 years actually if you listen to Cory. So might as well launch like this. Its still VERY good for a game that's free and has 0 microtransactions in it.

I can live with all of it, but the MMO part.. this game is an RPG, not an MMO

Biz
04-06-2016, 03:24 PM
I don't see how that will fly for most. If you look at the main steam page, it looks like the game is already done. If you announce that there will be more to come in terms of content because right now there isn't enough for a released game, you're essentially admitting the game is early access. I don't see how this endeavour will work as well as it could going down this route.

there is enough content for a released game. there just isn't enough released content to call it a MMO.

the draft/sealed/constructed all work (with the caveat that there are lots of bugs).

if they were charging $60 for the single player PVE, it would be suspicious, but it's free and just needs to be communicated that it's chapter 1 of X.

Ben
04-06-2016, 03:35 PM
The thing is that there will always have more content to be released. AZ2-3-4-5-6 etc.. 7 years actually if you listen to Cory. So might as well launch like this. Its still VERY good for a game that's free and has 0 microtransactions in it.

I can live with all of it, but the MMO part.. this game is an RPG, not an MMO

That's fair, you wouldn't know that by just playing through steam however.

Saeijou
04-06-2016, 03:41 PM
i really like what is happening, since the lawsuite is over though :) go hex!

spankydonkey
04-06-2016, 03:45 PM
I'm really not to sure what to make of this. fingers crossed it all works out for the best.
Good luck.

Gregangel
04-06-2016, 03:58 PM
The thing is that there will always have more content to be released. AZ2-3-4-5-6 etc.. 7 years actually if you listen to Cory. So might as well launch like this. Its still VERY good for a game that's free and has 0 microtransactions in it.

I can live with all of it, but the MMO part.. this game is an RPG, not an MMO

MMO means Massivly Multiplayer Online. When you play a 100+ tournemant, it's massivly multiplayer, and it's online because we are not around a same table for sure... so MMO it is.
It's just not MMORPG yet

ManofPeace
04-06-2016, 04:25 PM
Why would MMO be one of our main tags though? It's not like any of the online CCGs are advertising themselves are MMOs despite having ladder systems. They typically just describe themselves as an online card game first and foremost. Our focus should be that we're a TCG bought into a digital environment.

The entire reason for the "MMOTCG" thing in the first place was because of promised raids and more unique campaign elements that aren't in the game.

fido_one
04-06-2016, 04:36 PM
Why would MMO be one of our main tags though? It's not like any of the online CCGs are advertising themselves are MMOs despite having ladder systems. They typically just describe themselves as an online card game first and foremost. Our focus should be that we're a TCG bought into a digital environment.

The entire reason for the "MMOTCG" thing in the first place was because of promised raids and more unique campaign elements that aren't in the game.

Agreed.

I think it's disingenuous to call it an MMO at this point. Slap it on there and strut it around when you get a patch in with raids or other elements where there isn't as much room for debate. Right now a large swath of new users into MMOs would download the game under that tag and go 'there is no MMO stuff here, at least in the definition that I consider MMO to be.' Raids as a very big aside, we'd be closer to using the tag if we had two headed giant in (which I am in no rush for, focus on raids and doublebacks and everything else first IMO), which we know there are timing issues they need to figure out before they get to coding that sort of stuff.

Slap the MMO tag on at the right time. Though Gregangel, there is nothing preventing you from slapping that tag onto the game from a steam user perspective. It's like 'magic' that way.

DrVanPorcine
04-06-2016, 05:47 PM
what will come first, set 4 or steam distribution?
for my part, I hope it will be set 4 so people here use their money in the Hex shop and not via steam...
And also because I am done with set 3

Mejis
04-06-2016, 06:00 PM
what will come first, set 4 or steam distribution?
for my part, I hope it will be set 4 so people here use their money in the Hex shop and not via steam...
And also because I am done with set 3

Almost certainly Steam. Didn't someone say Steam is on the 12th. No way we're getting Set 4 before then. Would be nice if they coincide if today's patch is all good and smooth, but I also doubt that (coinciding with Steam I mean; I'm sure this QoL patch will be awesome).
I'm being pessimistic and saying beginning of May, but I'd love to be wrong.