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ceatherly
01-12-2018, 02:49 PM
Clarification, please. With multiverse you are allowed to both confront and purchase in the same turn, but are you allowed to purchase prior to the confrontation? For example, if you were using Aquaman (character) and you wanted to put a card from the lineup on top of your deck in order to draw it and use it with the confrontation.
Thank you!

Matt_Hyra
01-12-2018, 03:31 PM
Yes, you could also buy beforehand, but that might not be a great plan if they have any Block cards.

LRoq617
01-13-2018, 07:55 AM
I'm confused. I thought the whole point of confronting was that you had to commit to it and not be able to purchase cards, but this statement counteracts that.

Matt_Hyra
01-13-2018, 01:37 PM
I'm confused. I thought the whole point of confronting was that you had to commit to it and not be able to purchase cards, but this statement counteracts that.

Bottom of MULTIVERSE Rulebook page 4:
"After generating your Power, you may choose to Confront or not. After Confronting, you may spend additional Power to buy cards as usual. If your Confrontation is unsuccessful, your turn ends and your Power is lost."

So there is an element of commitment, because if you fail, you lose everything.

CushionRide
01-31-2018, 10:02 PM
i thought you had to declare a confrontation before you played your cards??? or is it different for rivals and confrontations? if it is its silly cause its the same mechanic

in fact im gonna contradict Matts ruling here. Rival, Confrontations and Multiverse all have confrontation rules. now i know that rivals and confrontations are different game setups BUT they are based on the core game of DC deckbuilder and have cards that are compatible with standard DC deckbuilder. for example if i wanted to instead of the normal characters i could use the confrontation/Rivals characters and add the confrontation/Block cards as the main deck. then have the multiverse in the game as a sidebar. now because both games use a form of confrontation. the idea is the same. you use your power to either confront your opponents character, or in this case go after the city to your left. either way the rule set should be the same. and since both rule sets use the same exact name "confrontation" the most recent rule for confrontation is in the Confrontations set. so honestly to keep the confusion down, the rivals/confrontations rule should have been amended to the multiverse box set.

. you SHOULD declare your confrontation before you play your cards,
.. when confronting you disable your ability to buy cards except what you are confronting for,
... resolve effects of cards you play,
.... let your opponent play block cards,
..... then resolve the confrontation.

in my opinion if you own all the sets like i do, then the Confrontation Box rules trump the Multiverse rule because it is the most recent rule for confrontation. and it should also be the standing rule because you could potentially pull rivals and confrontaions cards from the multiverse randomize deck.

Matt_Hyra
02-01-2018, 02:28 AM
In Rivals and Confrontations, you do declare it at start of turn. They were asking about Multiverse, where it is not start of turn.

CushionRide
02-01-2018, 07:43 AM
I understand that but what im saying is when you get down to it, this is all DC Deckbuilder. if you are going to have 2 similar mechanics for 2 different sets and they have the same name, then they should have the same rules, it avoids confusion and it simplifies the game.

Tschudy
02-01-2018, 01:53 PM
The difference being that they're two completely different styles of play. Confrontations is built around blocks, assists, and team mechanics. Multiverse is not, and requiring one to commit themselves to a confrontation in that format will make even the smallest case of run-away-winner syndrome even worse.

CushionRide
02-01-2018, 03:32 PM
ok but here in lies the flaw. all the sets contain cards that are compatible with the core games. confontations and rivals is just another version of DC Deckbuilder. if I wanted to be janky I could combine cards from crisis to rivals, or multiverse or whatever. try this, combining multiverse and have your core sets rivals and confrontations. now you have 2 confrontation mechanics. and guess what the cards out of the core set do not differentiate which confrontation you are talking about. so why could you not use block mechanics or confrontation card mechanics. now I know what your going to say, there not going to raise or lower the multiverse champions cost. well yes you are correct, but there are confrontation cards that let you draw, or force discards, or other effects. and since both confrontation mechanics are not differentiated by title, the cards can be played during either type of confrontation. its all in the English in the cards and the rules. this is why if they are both confrontation mechanics they should have similar rules. honestly though we just play tested this last week and it was in believably confusing to keep track of where you were confronting. so using both mechanics in the game is really jank.

but my point is still valid. the fact that this thread started is proof that the confrontation rules should be the same or have different names for their perspective mechanics. it just confuses players. honestly Im in favor of the rivals and confrontations version of the rule. I think it should apply for multiverse as well.

however my group of players are not fans of the multiverse system. it takes way to much time to set up, and the randomizer is kinda a waste of time, then you have to sort all that stuff back. my version uses bits of everything, and I think we have found a nice balance. the newest addition to my master game is the enhanced strength and the assist mechanic. ^_^

Matt_Hyra
02-02-2018, 02:24 AM
The Multiverse rules do say that if you are playing with cards that give you a bonus during a Confrontation, you need to declare it before playing those cards if you want the bonus.

Normally we do not like to have two rules for one effect, but having to pre-declare in Multiverse was terrible. So instead of making lots of Rivals and Confrontations cards worthless in Multiverse, we tried to be inclusive of everything.

LexLuthorJr
02-02-2018, 09:00 AM
I don't see why it's that confusing. You need to declare the confrontation first in Rivals and Confrontations. In Multiverse, you do not. In Rivals and Confrontations, you are attacking an over-sized SuperHero. In Multiverse, you are attacking a standard-size SuperVillian.

Attacking Over-Sized = Declare
Attacking Standard-Sized = Do not declare

Seems easy to remember to me.

TanisFrey
02-02-2018, 08:35 PM
If someone chose to do a Confrontations/Multiverse game, it could matter. Are you going to attack their champion or their current Hero Card? This is where declaring the confrontation at the start or during the turn would matter.

BenJazz
02-03-2018, 09:10 AM
I would say you hybrid the rules together. IF you were to use Rivals/Confrontations Over-Sized Characters with Multiverse, then declaring at the start of turn would be necessary to Confront a players Character (so you can't switch targets if you don't think you can defeat your chosen target). Otherwise you can declare against the Champion using the Multiverse Confrontation rules.

I believe though using Rivals/Confrontations Over-Sized Characters is not recommended for use with Multiverse since it is easy to throw off the character balance by not having to confront their character (getting stuck with your Cost 9 is not ideal for most Over-Sized). Plus handling a successful Confrontation on a players Cost-15 is a complicated situation since you should not be able to win Multiverse by defeating that character and could be overpowered depending on how you deal with the "who can Confront who's Character" aspect.

If you want to play with Rivals/Confrontation Over-Sized Characters, then play those game modes. If you want to play Multiverse, leave the Character Confrontation stacks out of it (but feel free to use single Character cards if you feel they are balanced).

CushionRide
02-03-2018, 10:06 PM
when I got my Confrontations boxed set, the first thing I did was combine it with rivals for a fuller game, then I thought, hey what if I add some of the Multiverse Location cities, with some of the core set supervillans for fun. so I picked the cities that didn't deal with multiverse lineups or cards directly, I think that was like 5 of them, and house ruled the game end stipulation. however we kept the rules on attack, unfortunately we were alternating players in the turn order for fairness and it kinda made attacking cities more difficult. it gave us migrains as to who we were supposed to attack.

later I thought maybe we should just employ the same rule as the confrontations characters, only attack the opponents city with the lowest cost. it still seriously skewed the game. I played wonder woman, my teammate played aquaman. our opponents played circe, and joker. my teammate had a city that played off of villains and since aquaman could gain multiple cards from the lineup I sculpted him down with wonderwoman so he was tripping his city and character every turn. I think he had brother blood for a super on his city. not only did It kill our opponents decks, it made the game more irritating the champs I used for each players cities were cost 9, 10, and 11's thinking they would add an interesting twist. nope it totally skewed the game in one direction. of coarse it the fact that all supers with the same cost don't have powers that are equally devastating, our opponents when they tripped their supers, did almost nothing to us.

honestly after buying multiverse, im not really happy with it. it has seriously op cards, its mechanics are tedious, time consuming, and bothersome. and if you construct the standard game correctly with all the additional sets you can literally add all the mechanics of every set without the need for the multiverse randomizer(and by mechanics I mean things like TimeTravel, Teamwork, assist, not the additional missions or events) so far my version has gotten a lot of attention in my area. some are afraid to try it, others after playing it cant stop and are as addicted as I am.

GuruGuru214
02-05-2018, 07:09 AM
My group handled the combination in a somewhat more streamlined way. We kept the Multiverse rule on confronting, and tied our character stacks to our champion stacks. When you lose a champion, you flip to the next character (the player who defeated the champion doesn't also get the character). When you lose your last champion, you remain on your level 3 character. As I recall, it worked well, though we never did try it a second time.

TanisFrey
02-14-2018, 02:32 PM
My group likes to play Confrontations combined with Rivals without removing any cards for large games with more than 4 players.

It works better than running a normal DC deckbuilder game with more than 5 players. Is such large games someone usually blows out the game and several people continue to play despite having no hope of wining or even getting close in the final VP count. If you are behind and start to use attack to try to knock down the front runner, you usually end up hitting the no hope persons also. Confrontations changes by making you a team member.

CushionRide
02-15-2018, 06:43 PM
my group tried that with my game, it was interesting, for city champs I only used villans that cost 9,10,and 11, unfortunately the villains are far from balanced, some of their attacks were crap, the ones my team had were amazing, and I was able to sculpt my teammate down so he would trip his champ every turn. so in my opinion it really can skew a game. after a couple games we decided to go back to my normal brutality version which uses elements from every set. its just a simpler way to play.

FasterTheChase
04-13-2018, 04:54 AM
Hi Matt,

Sorry if you keep having to repeat yourself but when our group read "After confronting you may spend additional power to buy cards as usual" as that you can only buy cards AFTER you have finished your confrontation.

I'm assuming now, from your comment, that this isn't the case. Can you clarify?

Thanks

Matt_Hyra
04-13-2018, 11:23 AM
Hi Matt,

Sorry if you keep having to repeat yourself but when our group read "After confronting you may spend additional power to buy cards as usual" as that you can only buy cards AFTER you have finished your confrontation.

I'm assuming now, from your comment, that this isn't the case. Can you clarify?

Thanks

You can buy cards before and/or after, but it is risky to use up Power before Confronting.