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  1. #1

    Is The Flash's ability broken or very underpowered.

    So we've been playing DC deck builder for several months and we still can't understand The Flash's second ability right. The first time we had The Flash in play we had him drawing cards on everything and then found out later that it was very wrong. So the way we ruled it is that the first time a card tells you to draw a card you draw one extra, but if another card tells you to draw a card you don't draw the extra card. ( ex. You have the Watchtower out and you play a supergirl you draw one card due to the Watchtower and one from The Flash's ability. Then you play superspeed you would only draw one card due to the card, but you wouldn't gain one from Flash. Then if you play Lex you only draw three, not four.) Then I started to do some research and saw that a lot of people where in love with The Flash, and I couldn't really see why. I saw that people where playing it that the first time a card tells you to draw a card you draw an extra one (like the ability says). So if you play a kid flash you draw two card, but if you play another one you only draw one. Then if you play superspeed you draw another two cards. If that's true then The Flash becomes every OP, and not a lot of fun to play against cause a lot of cards have drawing powers. (ex. start of you turn, Watchtower already out in play, you play kid flash [draw three cards - one kid flash, one Watchtower, one The Flash's ability], then you play super speed [draw two cards - one superspeed, one The Flash's ability] then you play two face if you guess right then you draw that card [draw two cards - one guessing right for two face, one The Flash's ability], then you play penguin [draw three cards - two for penguin, one The Flash's ability]) So you see it becomes really out of hand with all of the drawing power you have. You drew ten EXTRA cards that weren't in your hand earlier.

    So I guess what my real question is is what is the ruling on The Flash's ability? Does he only draw on extra card a true and become shy of worthless, or Does he draw an extra card for every card that tells him to and become OP?

  2. #2
    Cryptozoic Employee Matt_Hyra's Avatar
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    No matter how many different draw effects you generate during your turn, The Flash will give just give you one extra card.
    So if you play Super Speed, Kid Flash, and trigger the Watchtower you still only draw 1 extra card, not 3 extra.
    Matt Hyra
    Cryptozoic R&D

  3. #3
    I am perplexed with how highly ranked people online place the Flash. We've never once had a winner as Flash and I'm pretty sure we haven't had a second place winner as the Flash when we play with three or more players. Our group for awhile was also making the mistake of using a "stack" when resolving effects, but after further investigation we found out that EVERYTHING from the card you play happens first before anything else happens. So if you are the Flash and you play Penguin, you don't draw three and then discard, you draw two, discard, and then draw from the Flash. We realized this when we'd play Nth Metal as Cyborg; you would look at the top card first, choice if you want to destroy it or not, and then Cyborg lets you draw it.

    His whole theme is drawing cards and drawing cards, at least in a flavorful sense, means to be moving quickly. Kid Flash, Fastest Man Alive, and Super Speed all further that notion. The problem with that is that EVERYONE wants draws. Also, Wonder Woman draws SO much faster than the Flash. I don't think that makes Wonder Woman broken or unbalanced, because she manages to keep up with all the other heroes. The Flash starts off fast, but falls flat on his face after wards.

    Flash was doing so poorly in our group, that we actually created an entire new card for him. Instead of:

    You go first.
    The first time a card tells you to draw one or more cards during each of your turns, draw an additional card.
    We altered him to this:

    You go first.
    For each differently named non-location card that tells you to draw one or more cards during each of your turns, draw an additional card.
    So far, after close to 20 games, we've had no issues and have FINALLY had the Flash win.

    ~Zuty

  4. #4
    My group and I have had the same problem. We did house rule our Flash as well, but a little differently than yours. Since about half of the draw power in the Main Deck are defenses, we decided to let Flash have his normal ability, but also draw one extra card when it's not his turn, that way defenses will proc his ability as well. He's still not as good, as he's the most easily denied still, but it gives him a better chance at winning.

  5. #5
    Baby Yeti
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    Flash is really strong. I thought he was fairly weak when I first started playing the game. Initially reading his power I even commented on the fact they make him go first to compensate the weak second part of the power. However, playing lately competitively, I have found that Flash is one of the top heroes to pick. Especially in 1v1 matches. (Even with a rule to fix first player's advantage if they end the game. After the last super-villain is purchased play continues until first player's turn.)

    It takes a certain style of play and deckbuilding to utilize The Flash. I believe the deck construction of a Flash deck is the strongest build in the game. Focusing on drawing, deletion, and high-power cards. Focus on making your power 'hit' at a consistent level is important. Locations are obvious bombs of this but they are often hard to get. Next up is the cheap drawing cards. Kid Flash, Super-Speed, The Penguin, and Two-Face (his effect is a 'draw' if you 'hit' it) are great early buys. Batmobile can also proc Flash's power. Once you have your deck consistently drawing extra cards, focus on single high-power or deletion cards. It takes a few rounds of shuffling and buying to get the deck going, but it will catch up to the other player's buying potential then outstrip them because they'll be limited to cards the see/have in the their hands compared to the Flash.

  6. #6
    Just got the game & played it for the first time today with 3 other people. I drew & played the Flash & found I easily won the game over the other 3. Even one extra draw a turn can add up to enough power to pick up those big cards. I wound up with 4 of the super-villains by myself.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by vozpit View Post
    Just got the game & played it for the first time today with 3 other people. I drew & played the Flash & found I easily won the game over the other 3. Even one extra draw a turn can add up to enough power to pick up those big cards. I wound up with 4 of the super-villains by myself.
    After a few more games, once everyone learns the best picks for their hero and what not, you'll soon see this outcome change.
    The Flash is very, very underwhelming.

    ~Zuty

  8. #8
    Well, played my second game. My brother got Flash & easily won over the rest of us. Using Kid Flash & the Fastest Man alive, he was pulling so many cards, his power levels were sky-high & he was able to buy a Super-Villain just about every turn, once his deck was built up a bit.

  9. #9
    @Vozpit - And you're playing him correctly where it only works the FIRST time, right? Being the Flash and playing Kid Flash will draw you two cards (one from Kid and one for being the Flash), but if you also had out Watch Tower you draw normally from the location, but you wouldn't draw again for being the Flash. That's the main issue I've noticed for people justifying the Flash being "broken". I'm not saying that the Flash has no chance of winning, but there aren't enough draws to really make him worth while.

    Now that I have time, I'll break it down. Out of the 114 cards from the main deck, 21 cards are let you draw one or more cards and out of the 12 Super Villains, 2 cards let you draw one or more cards and one can draw zero to four cards (The Joker). The main deck has the five location cards which are all unique. There are two heroes (Fastest Man Alive & Kid Flash), two villains (The Penguin & Two-Face), an equipment (Batmobile), and a super power (Super Speed) that are part of the main deck as well that all allow the drawing of cards. Let's take a look at each of these cards.

    The Fastest Man Alive - Great draw, but there is only ONE copy of these in the deck. And it WILL be fought over, since EVERYONE benefits from drawing cards.

    Kid Flash - Usually the first of the cheap costing cards to go. There are four copies of these in the deck.

    The Penguin - Draw two, discard two. Not bad at all, although you won't get the Flash draw until AFTER you have discarded. There are two of these in the deck.

    Two-Face - Call it: Odd or even. If you're right, draw it. Otherwise, discard it. Not very reliable without dumb luck or cards like Nth Metal or Power Ring, but it gives power which no other draw card from the main deck does. There are only two copies of this in the deck.

    Batmobile - You'll need to not only play this as your first card on the turn, but also discard your hand to get the draw from this. You'll go through your deck quickly, which is probably the best thing you can do, but it can end up causing more harm than good. There are three copies of this in the deck.

    Super Speed - Another great card that EVERYONE will be swooping in to grab, but there are four copies of it in the deck. You ONLY benefit from the Flash draw when you play this normally. Defending DOES NOT give you the extra Flash draw.

    That's 16 non-location cards which equates to a 14% chance of seeing one of these flip up in the line-up at the start of the game. If we count the locations, this only only bumps the percentage to ~18%, and even then nabbing a location first turn means you have five Punch cards in hand and will be drawing two Punch cards and three Vulnerabilities on your next turn. Best case possible, you nab either Watch Tower or Titans Tower on your first turn and Kid Flash on your second. It's a pipe dream as the Flash, but even then you'll need to play catch up since you just spent two turns not increasing your power levels. You'd be sitting at 12 cards and 7 power, while everyone else is most likely at 8 to 10 power and just as many cards.

    The only way I could see the Flash working well if by having a very small deck and three or more Suicide Squads, Arkham Asylum, and Clay Face. If you can draw your deck every turn, you can just keep getting off Suicide Squad and just "Time Walk" for as long as possible as you pick up more Suicide Squads and super villains. And my group has had this happen more than twice, but it was with Aquaman, not the Flash.

    ~Zuty

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