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Thread: The BEST possible change to make before release:

  1. #1

    Lightbulb The BEST possible change to make before release:

    My responses to posts 2-52 are in post 53-54. Further responses in post 59. Further responses in post 71. I edited this post with some of the information from the thread, and moved benefit #2 into the #1 spot.

    The most powerful change you could make to the game is to change the default numbers for health, probably resource points, and possibly other stats. 100 or 1000 health would be far better than 20. 6 or 10 resources for a basic resource card would be far better than 1.

    Advantages are enormous:

    1) Better control over the numbers allows for a much wider variety of cards, and allows for finer balancing of cards.
    - A lightning bold for 3 damage may be too strong, and a bolt for 2 damage may be too weak, but this proposal allows you to create the equivalent of, for example, a 2.6 damage bolt, without using decimals.
    - By reducing the resources provided, you can create dual resource cards that are not overpowered, and can thus be basic themselves; for example 8 resources and 2 colors rather than 10 resources and 1 color.
    - It opens up the possibility of making cards that you expect to play 2 of on turn 1. If there are 10 resources from a basic card, then you could cast 2 5-resource spells on turn 1, should you have them in hand.
    - With overly-simple numbers, a card designer is often forced to over-or under-power a card he envisions; larger numbers alleviate this, combating power creep.

    2) It frees the game from the shadow of MTG. Starting with 20 life, gaining 1 resource per resource card, etc. makes the cards so similar to MTG that all HEX cards will immediately be compared to MTG cards to determine their power. The cards will have to be of similar power to match player expectations. The pace and flow of the game is determined by MTG; not by you.
    - If your cards are not compatible with MTG, you can balance them to set any pace of game you want, without having them immediately judged in comparison with the thousands of MTG cards already in existence.

    3) It makes HEX its own game; not a clone. True, if HEX turns out to be much better than MTG, it will win the battle even though it is an obvious clone... but WoC has money, and they like money. If HEX does poorly, nothing will happen, but if HEX does well, MAGIC 2 will come! Being an obvious clone of the old version is a sure ticket to defeat, and I'd like my investment in this game to provide me many years of entertainment rather than a few months of improvement before the next generation of MTG defeats it.

    Your biggest worry with this is probably that development has already started and there is not time to make such a big change, but until beta you can still change things at will. At the very least, all the numbers could be increased by the same multiple, which would not touch existing balance, but would allow for future variation.

    You may also worry about the difficulty of doing math on cards with larger numbers, but the computer does all the math. Assuming the graphical interface is good, it will be much easier for a player to hover their cursor over their card and see part of their resource bar turn red than it is to keep track of costs in the physical MTG card game. The game will more quickly tell you the expected damage for your attackers against what they have than you can calculate in your head, regardless of number size. I click my creature and theirs, the game can display for example that I overkill their creature by 12 points. Most video games use much larger numbers than what I am proposing. Players have no trouble conceptualizing numbers even in the thousands, as long as they don't have to do the actual math on them.


    In conclusion, the time to improve is now. If you choose to play catch-up with MTG, you are throwing away the advantage of starting from scratch, and a huge opportunity. With a more varied base system, in addition to the cards which only make sense in a digital game, there would be no way MTG could possibly compete with HEX online.
    Last edited by Elfis; 06-06-2013 at 10:40 AM. Reason: Added info from the thread

  2. #2
    Numbers don't scale that way. The card mechanics, in the works for two years, will not play nicely with such a ramping up.
    "A little nonsense now and then, is relished by the wisest men."

    -Willy Wonka

  3. #3
    Gigantisaur
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    Having all numbers multiplied by 100 or 50 is stupid and feels like Yugi Oh.

    It's easier to do maths with lower numbers too (and HEX is a game where thinking helps, not like YugiOh)

    ~

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Fireblast View Post
    Having all numbers multiplied by 100 or 50 is stupid and feels like Yugi Oh.

    It's easier to do maths with lower numbers too (and HEX is a game where thinking helps, not like YugiOh)

    ~
    I mostly agree with this sentiment, despite your inexplicable rage.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Fireblast View Post
    Having all numbers multiplied by 100 or 50 is stupid and feels like Yugi Oh.

    It's easier to do maths with lower numbers too (and HEX is a game where thinking helps, not like YugiOh)

    ~
    I agree with this - Yugioh got very lost over the years, and that is because it had a shaky start. I feel Hex has hit all the right notes, and we know 20 life feels safe - if you want more, play life gain. This is easy to balance, scale, and conceptualise for - imagine trying to balance something that halves someone's life total when you have 50/100 life, compared to 20 life.

  6. #6
    s/best/worst

    /thread
    The Mushwocky is always hungry.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Fireblast View Post
    Having all numbers multiplied by 100 or 50 is stupid and feels like Yugi Oh.

    It's easier to do maths with lower numbers too (and HEX is a game where thinking helps, not like YugiOh)

    ~
    All numbers multiplied? Where does it mention that at all? Increasing base health total, or having resources start at a number other than one is not related to simply multiplying all numbers. The reasons this is advantageous are spelled out in the original post.

    So far, I haven't seen any arguments against point 1 or 2 of the original post except that the current cards in set one would need to be rebalanced, which is true. We have 4 out of 5 responses that have absolutely nothing to do with the original post. Only Madican has stated anything which relates to it.

    Please, before replying, can we at least read the post we're replying to?

  8. #8
    I read it before posting, re-read it just now, and stand by my original post.
    The Mushwocky is always hungry.

  9. #9
    Big numbers are effing stupid. Worst thing to come out of the JRPG tradition. Massive experience totals for levels, health points in the 20 000 range, all just confound the issue. The ONLY advantage to inflating numbers is that you get more divisibility. ie You could start with 200 health points and have something deal 10 damage and another thing deal 12, instead of starting with 20 and having the numbers have to jump from 1 to 2 (10 to 20 if you multiply by 10).

    But that kind of divisibility has no real advantages in this game that I can tell, and would really just make things more confused. It doesn't make them more "epic", just more confused. Look at Mechwarrior, where you pilot 100 ton battlemechs. It feels plenty epic when my dual AC/5s deal 10 damage, and I wouldn't be any more impressed if they were doing 10 000 damage. Just more annoyed at the numbers. Big numbers are just a way of obfuscating and artificially inflating a poorly conceived game.

  10. #10
    So power creep before the game even launches? How about no, that 30/30 does not sound better than 5/5 as its nothing but a gimmick.

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