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Thread: You can no longer retain priority by holding the Ctrl button

  1. #191
    Quote Originally Posted by noragar View Post
    Player B can still respond to the first action by taking an action of his own, but he can't respond to the first action by having it resolve.
    I don't understand, if they have the first action resolve that's not responding to it. The option player B loses is the option to not do anything??
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  2. #192
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrawn View Post
    I don't understand, if they have the first action resolve that's not responding to it. The option player B loses is the option to not do anything??
    Exactly, it's a strategic choice by Player B. He can choose to take an action, which will in turn allow Player A to take another action in response, or he can choose to take no action which will in turn lock out Player A from doing anything else before the original action resolves. Player B has to weigh the benefits of the action he would be taking against the potential downside of the possible actions Player A could respond with and decide which is the better alternative.

    Under the old system, Player A was making more of the meaningful decisions and Player B was along for the ride. Under the new system, both players have meaningful decisions to make, thus increasing interactivity, not reducing it.

  3. #193
    I get what you're saying, I just think it's so wrong in my mind that I assumed I was confused.

    Taking options out of the game does not increase interactivity no matter how hard you try to spin it that way.
    Soon™
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    One half of the "Frick and Frack of negativity".

  4. #194
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    Quote Originally Posted by noragar View Post
    Exactly, it's a strategic choice by Player B. He can choose to take an action, which will in turn allow Player A to take another action in response, or he can choose to take no action which will in turn lock out Player A from doing anything else before the original action resolves. Player B has to weigh the benefits of the action he would be taking against the potential downside of the possible actions Player A could respond with and decide which is the better alternative.

    Under the old system, Player A was making more of the meaningful decisions and Player B was along for the ride. Under the new system, both players have meaningful decisions to make, thus increasing interactivity, not reducing it.
    I understand what you mean, it's a valid point. I don't personally agree since for me it's very unintuitive to not get a chance to respond to my own actions, and having that choice go over to my opponent devalues deckbuilding skills. But I see where you're coming from.
    IGN: Nollfem, warrior backer and former WoW TCG player. Compiling official rule articles and statements for the unofficial rulebook article over at the hex4newbies wiki!

  5. #195
    Quote Originally Posted by Thrawn View Post
    Taking options out of the game does not increase interactivity no matter how hard you try to spin it that way.
    If that were true, I could use the same quote to argue against taking the options away from Player B that you're using when taking the option away from Player A. It's not taking options away, it's redistributing options in a more equitable manner.
    Last edited by noragar; 11-03-2015 at 02:55 PM.

  6. #196
    Quote Originally Posted by 05K4R View Post
    I don't personally agree since for me it's very unintuitive to not get a chance to respond to my own actions, and having that choice go over to my opponent devalues deckbuilding skills.
    Is it unintuitive because if you were building a game from scratch you think it's clear that being able to respond to your own actions before they resolve is an important part of the game, or is it unintuitive because it's been ingrained through years of playing that other game?

    If the former, then we just have a difference of opinion about which system is better, which is perfectly valid. I can see the points from the other side, I just prefer this one.

    If the latter, I hope that those of that opinion can put aside years of knowing how it is, and do an objective evaluation about how it should be before making their final decision.
    Last edited by noragar; 08-04-2015 at 12:00 PM.

  7. #197
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    Quote Originally Posted by noragar View Post
    Is it unintuitive because if you were building a game from scratch you think it's clear that the being able to respond to your own actions before they resolve is an important part of the game, or is it unintuitive because it's been ingrained through years of playing that other game?

    If the former, then we just have a difference of opinion about which system is better, which is perfectly valid. I can see the points from the other side, I just prefer this one.

    If the latter, I hope that those of that opinion can put aside years of knowing how it is, and do an objective evaluation about how it should be before making their final decision.
    As I've been playing physical card games for years I don't know, but I remember that when I first got the rules for WoW TCG (my first real TCG experience) explained to me it made a lot of sense. The explanation was basically "after something has happened, the turn player gets priority and a chance to respond, if he/she passes without doing anything, the other player gets a chance to respond." This was how Hex worked previously before the Ctrl button was introduced. When Ctrl was introduced, it basically auto-passed after you added a link to the chain, but you could stop the auto-pass by holding Ctrl while adding the link.
    IGN: Nollfem, warrior backer and former WoW TCG player. Compiling official rule articles and statements for the unofficial rulebook article over at the hex4newbies wiki!

  8. #198
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    Quote Originally Posted by 05K4R View Post
    As I've been playing physical card games for years I don't know, but I remember that when I first got the rules for WoW TCG (my first real TCG experience) explained to me it made a lot of sense. The explanation was basically "after something has happened, the turn player gets priority and a chance to respond, if he/she passes without doing anything, the other player gets a chance to respond." This was how Hex worked previously before the Ctrl button was introduced. When Ctrl was introduced, it basically auto-passed after you added a link to the chain, but you could stop the auto-pass by holding Ctrl while adding the link.
    This.

    People need to remember that this is actually the SECOND change to this particular rule/interaction. The original was to default to a pause when anything was added to the chain. The first change was to auto-pass that first priority by default while adding the CTRL hotkey to use the original function. This is the second change, where they've now removed the hotkey but retained the auto-pass that was added in the first change.

    The first change was just a quality of life upgrade to help the game flow faster without sacrificing depth. However, the advertising of the new function was horrific (and so was/is the entire tutorial for this game, this is just one example) so we have some of the confusion in this very thread.

    This second change is not a quality of life upgrade, it's dumbing down the rules to be more like Hearthstone.

  9. #199
    I want to point out that every TCG I have played with a chain has allowed self chaining. It isn't unique to MTG, and it feels bad to not have that option in Hex, which is trying to be the best of the best.
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  10. #200
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xenavire View Post
    I want to point out that every TCG I have played with a chain has allowed self chaining. It isn't unique to MTG, and it feels bad to not have that option in Hex, which is trying to be the best of the best.
    what do you mean with "trying"? :P
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