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Thread: Peri into something without getting priority is unfun :(

  1. #21
    They could change it so that the copy happens when the spell resolves instead of when it is cast, would make it a lot less OP. It would also let you counter something that was being copied and not still have the copy exist.

  2. #22
    That only fixes the problem for Periwinkle, all of the other interactions that can still take advantage of this still occur. We already mentioned Storm Cloud, but here are some more: Bottled Vitae, Goblin Cooking Pot, Chaos Key, Fifth Book, Veteran Raider, Timestep Magistrate, Wolsy Wabbit, Elimination Specialist, Mancubus, Hempseed Dryad, and Mecha Filk Ape, and I am sure that I missed some.

    If you're going to change something to enable players to have more interaction, then you need to fix the rules so that it affects everything, not just the effect of a single card. Especially since that card isn't considered highly unbalanced. It might be slightly unbalanced (I don't think it is), but it is definitely not unbalanced enough to be banned, and this game doesn't nerf cards.
    Last edited by loopholist3; 08-21-2015 at 06:20 AM.

  3. #23
    Quote Originally Posted by loopholist3 View Post
    That only fixes the problem for Periwinkle.
    it would fix it for anything that triggers off of spells (just not cards that trigger from resources), which would be a good step.


    "Perfection is the enemy of progress."
    Last edited by malloc31; 08-21-2015 at 06:38 AM.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by malloc31 View Post
    it would fix it for anything that triggers off of spells (just not cards that trigger from resources), which would be a good step.
    Cards this would affect: Kindling Skarn, Syzygy, Gas Troll, Salt Harpy, Periwinkle, Archmage Wrenlocke, Chimes of the Zodiac.

    This still feels like a nerf to a small group of cards to me, instead of a rules change for quality of life. As long as the designers are aware that this wording leaves you no chance to counter a card before they create the card, I am still fine with the way it currently works.
    Last edited by loopholist3; 08-21-2015 at 06:43 AM.

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by loopholist3 View Post
    That only fixes the problem for Periwinkle, all of the other interactions that can still take advantage of this still occur. We already mentioned Storm Cloud, but here are some more: Bottled Vitae, Goblin Cooking Pot, Chaos Key, Fifth Book, Veteran Raider, Timestep Magistrate, Wolsy Wabbit, Elimination Specialist, Mancubus, Hempseed Dryad, and Mecha Filk Ape, and I am sure that I missed some.

    If you're going to change something to enable players to have more interaction, then you need to fix the rules so that it affects everything, not just the effect of a single card. Especially since that card isn't considered highly unbalanced. It might be slightly unbalanced (I don't think it is), but it is definitely not unbalanced enough to be banned, and this game doesn't nerf cards.
    after reading more of your edit I think a lot of the interactions you mention are just based on the fact that removing a card that added an effect to the chain does not remove the effect. I would not be for changing that, I think that is fine. The difference with Copy effects is that while removing the triggering card doesn't work, removing the target also doesn't work (normally you remove the target and it will fizzle, if you remove the target of the copy you still end up with the copy of that target)

  6. #26
    The cards I mentioned all have basic speed abilities on them. As far as I understand, that is the exact speed you are trying to fix with periwinkle, as no solution mentioned so far keeps Periwinkle from copying quick cards.

  7. #27
    Quote Originally Posted by loopholist3 View Post
    The cards I mentioned all have basic speed abilities on them. As far as I understand, that is the exact speed you are trying to fix with periwinkle, as no solution mentioned so far keeps Periwinkle from copying quick cards.
    if creating a copy does not happen till the card that will be copy resolves, and card (quick or basic) will have to resolve before the copy is made. Meaning if Perri is out and you cast a 5 cost quick action I can counter it and no copy is made (it never resolved). Also if you cost a quick action or basic action (or troop) while Perri is out some one can respond and murder Perri and no copy will occur, (when it resolves Perri is already gone). This would be to make "Copy" less OP, whether "Copy" is to OP or not is another subject.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by loopholist3 View Post
    The cards I mentioned all have basic speed abilities on them. As far as I understand, that is the exact speed you are trying to fix with periwinkle, as no solution mentioned so far keeps Periwinkle from copying quick cards.
    To reword slightly. It seems like the complaint is a lack of interaction when you feel like you should deserve one. If you deserve the ability to respond to periwinkle, then you also deserve the ability to respond to chaos key after it has been played, but before it has been activated.
    Last edited by loopholist3; 08-21-2015 at 07:01 AM.

  9. #29
    Quote Originally Posted by loopholist3 View Post
    To reword slightly. It seems like the complaint is a lack of interaction when you feel like you should deserve one. If you deserve the ability to respond to periwinkle, then you also deserve the ability to respond to chaos key after it has been played, but before it has been activated.
    As I stated earlier the difference is you can interact with the target of chaos key to cancel the effect (you can bounce it for example), but with perri even if you destroy the target you still have the copy effect happen. That is why it is different and more unbalance in my opinion.

    (I have no problem with how chaos key and cards like that work, that interaction is fine in my eyes (even if it is a little unintuitive))

  10. #30
    I feel like I slightly misunderstood you earlier, which is my bad.

    My list still leaves the following basic speed effects which you can't interact with the card or the target: Storm Cloud, Bottled Vitae, Goblin Cooking Pot (unless you can play your entire hand), Fifth Book, and Veteran Raider.

    I don't think we are ever going to convince each other, I feel the effect is fine as long as the designers were aware of it when they created the card, but if it is found to be a problem, I can only feel happy with a solution that fixes the interaction with all cards that don't give you a chance to interact with them. I will admit that copy does feels like a bit mean of an effect to not be able to interact with, but "When you play a ..." effects in general feel like something that is nice to have around.
    Last edited by loopholist3; 08-21-2015 at 07:23 AM.

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