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Thread: Naagaan + new life total = auto-loss for Zared

  1. #11
    Quote Originally Posted by Clawdius View Post
    But that's one of the faster decks, doing 3 damage is pretty easy for an Orc Aggro deck. I've always felt that Paladin of Nagaan's charge power was too cheap.

    He was an obnoxious opponent before the life totals change, and there should have been at least some minor consideration given to the balance of a Paladin of Nagaan starting with 21 health and players starting with potentially less. I've beaten 20hp Paladin of Nagaan down to 1hp and watched him play three Eternal Youth in a row and exceed my life total and bolster his Paladin of the Necropolis for an eventual comeback.
    He can be obnoxious, sure, but it isn't at all hard to turn the tables on him. A few days ago I got into one hell of a grudge match with him - I use Bunoshi, so thats 18 vs 21, and the Inferno challenge was active. Now, I knew that there was a good chance I would not initially be able to outheal the inferno damage, so my gameplan was to go straight for the lethal troops. That was a good move, because he quickly got a very large troop out, that was completely crippled by my lethal wall. After that I simply started dropping lifedrainers and buffing them, and it snowballed from there, with inferno beating us both black and blue in the process. Despite all the large hits off an 8+ counter inferno, I still had over 20 health when I killed him.

    About the only shard that will likely have consistent trouble is mono wild, and that comes down to the lack of hard removal. Ruby would be a close second, on a bad draw.
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  2. #12
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    As an aside, regardless of one's opinions on most of the champion health total changes (including my own), and how and what they were balanced to and for, and the consequences - benevolent and not - that its had...

    Its worth noting that you're correct, in that Zared Venomscorn decks obviously are weaker than they were before (unless you're playing a specific suicide-blood strategy in PvE where low life totals are a godsend), and games against Nagaan are rather more directly affected than most Arena champs by this change.

    However, that's not really an inherent problem, certainly not a game flaw, simply a new strategic consideration. The fact that Zared Venomscorn might be suddenly bad, or another champion might be suddenly better, isn't really a problem to be fixed. Just that you might want to consider building different decks with different champions to have the same success.

    Sure, Bun'Jitsu is usually terrible - even in decks built to exploit it it's usually inferior to alternatives - so people usually didn't play him, so they went and played a different champion instead. So now maybe Venomscorn is terrible, so you can just go and play a different champion if you're having problems.

    TL;DR: Not necessarily disagreeing nor agreeing with your sentiments about "Zared = auto loss here", just saying that there always were 'worse' and 'better' champion choices, and that's still true today. Simply adapt, realize there are new 'junk' champions, and new 'powerful' ones.
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  3. #13
    Did 3 perfect runs in a row with my mono diamond zared a week ago so hes definitely not useless.
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  4. #14
    Quote Originally Posted by wolzarg View Post
    Did 3 perfect runs in a row with my mono diamond zared a week ago so hes definitely not useless.
    In a mono-diamond deck Zared is pretty useless - no champ power with the lowest possible starting health. Can't get much more useless than that.

  5. #15
    Quote Originally Posted by noragar View Post
    In a mono-diamond deck Zared is pretty useless - no champ power with the lowest possible starting health. Can't get much more useless than that.
    With the dual shards and Holy Ascension you could actually make a scary mono diamond deck - if you use the duals, you turn on Zared for spot removal, and with all the lifegain/lifedrainers diamond has, gaining 16 health to activate Ascension is fairly simple. 32 health is entirely within reason.
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  6. #16
    Quote Originally Posted by Xenavire View Post
    With the dual shards and Holy Ascension you could actually make a scary mono diamond deck - if you use the duals, you turn on Zared for spot removal, and with all the lifegain/lifedrainers diamond has, gaining 16 health to activate Ascension is fairly simple. 32 health is entirely within reason.
    Actually i didn't even bother with the split shards i was simply mono diamond lifegain and the only reason i used him was because he had the absolutely lowest starting health. When you have to double every single point you have to double makes it noticeably harder to do so making him the correct choice regardless.
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  7. #17
    I don't like the variable hp now for the current meta. Not in PvP, or PvE. But the variable hp does really open up doors for PvE design and future PvP design that were not currently open. Where having a lower starting Health is a strength, not a disadvantage.

    I haven't played competitively for a while, and it was interesting to see the decisions made by high level players today to run something like Benvolio over something like Urgnock/etc.

  8. #18
    Its actually not that common for games to come down to life the difference between 18 and 21 is rarely a factor. Most of the time the stronger champion power is going to give you the most benefit or everyone would run daughter of the stars.
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  9. #19
    Paladin is easily beaten by:
    - fast aggro
    - removal
    - lethal troops (pref flyers)
    - chump blockers (though you do need to take care of his Paladins of Necropolis or have lifegain of your own)

    It's certainly easier if you can get him down before his charge goes off but that's not the only way.
    You might also think about mulliganning more aggressively against him
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