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Thread: [Campaing] Shin'hare Starting Deck

  1. #1

    [Campaing] Shin'hare Starting Deck

    Man, is this a bloody train wreck of a starting deck if I've ever seen one. I'm not sure if this is the proper place to post this thread or not, if it needs to be put somewhere else let me know and I'll recreate it or you folks can move it on your own, following Tort's suggestion here. And I frankly am not sure where to even start with this but I'll say ahead of time I don't mean for this to be a thread senselessly bashing it, although it quite frankly deserves a bit of it, but more about criticism / suggestions.

    To start off with, I've only played the Warrior class so far so I have no idea how much the other two deck archetypes differ, but from what I've heard in the chat box they aren't in any better shape than what I got. Everything I've seen of the campaign so far, from the music, to the UI, to the artwork, to the damn performance is stellar really, but all of that means nothing if you wish to use the Campaign as a way to attract more and more players because, quite frankly, everybody with half a mind will instantly be put off of what they receive in this thing. The decks are shit, plain and simple, and while I can understand the reasoning behind such a decision, especially since you folks wish to maintain the value of cards and all, this is simply ridiculous. Everything about it is constructed in such a way to offer the player the least amount of fun, the least amount of agency, and the most frustrating time of their life starting out versus an AI that has, for better or worse, an actually decently constructed deck when compared to your own. Each and every last game is almost entirely decided by RNG in regards to your draws and there's very little one can do to pull ahead unless he obtains specific cards. Simply put, unless the AI is utterly destroyed by RNG, which so far in some 10 games I played to finish the tutorial didn't happen, the player is at a clear, major disadvantage.

    Sure, you can change your deck after the tutorial dungeon is over, but the amount of players one will lose before they even get there is downright staggering. There are simple ways to remedy this and it's all in regards to how the decks themselves are built as well as a few small touch-ups to the dialogue itself to better reflect the deck and more easily immerse the players.

    Alright, enough bashing, let's talk about what can be changed and suggestions to make. To start off, the PC itself arrived alone at the main encampment while the Officers there expected a full-fledged regiment to reinforce them, regardless of what you might say to them. Things happen and you get sent off ahead as a scouting force alongside Sora towards the Castle. Now the first encounter is at the gates with a Coyote and before much dialogue / fluff / exposition can be given, a battle starts, after which Sora notes that Coyote's usually travel in packs and they should be weary of others lurking about. Instead of having it that way, why not introduce some more lines of fluff and exposition, talk about how the PC and Sora fight the Coyote and slowly pull back as they notice more of them approaching, then have Shin'Hare reinforcements rush in from behind. Seeing as the PC came in alone, it's not a stretch to say that the rest of the Regiment is somewhat scattered as well and the Officers back at camp are sending them forward as soon as they come to make sure you're properly reinforced. Then, star the battle and fill in the space afterwards where Sora talks about the Coyote's traveling in packs with something akin to instructing the troops, assessing their numbers, so on and so forth. This would both tie in the various Coyote's summoned by the enemy as well as the Hoppers you summon into play, over all making the player feel more immersed in the whole thing.

    But of course, this would require some deck changes as well. For instance, the Raptors have no business being in the starting deck as far as I'm concerned and I utterly loathe the fact they are you're only viable win condition, Bannerbunnies excluded since they are not nearly as reliable. Same goes for Shadowgrove Witch and Zombie Vulture, there's no proper explanation for their presence there. One can even argue there are too MANY Concubunny's in the deck and that replacing them with more Blossoming Concubunny's would serve a better purpose, plus make more sense from a lore perspective. Uzume is still the Grand Mommy of the whole bunch and one that's not properly initiated in their order, such as the Blossoming is to be assumed, would be more rebellious and end up on the front lines more often than a fully-fledged Concubunny. Instead of the cards mentioned here, you can easily replace them with Militia's, Bucktooth Commanders, Blood Bearer's, or even Shroomshaw's assuming they can be used as pack mules / pulling supplies along instead of just carriages with Nobles. This would make the game more fair, still keep it a fair challenge, and most importantly NOT GIVE NEW PLAYERS THE IMPRESSION THE GAME IS UTTERLY P2W.

    I can't stress that enough, in the current starting decks, everything is so utterly shit most people will just run for the hills before they finish the starting dungeon because they won't know better and because you didn't offer them any reason to doubt that judgement. I mean, you got 11 Blood Shards and the majority of the Blood cards are pretty much useless 9/10 games due to how the rest of the deck is set up. If you introduce Shroomshaw's and Blood Bearers alongside the already existent Milky Eye's you can more easily explain them while also reducing some of the wild shards due to the removal of Tyrannosaurus Hex with more small troops, even Surprise Runt Gang.

    I may be babbling here, tired and exhausted, but you get the point I assume. Everything about this campaign is superb but the starter decks themselves are simply inexcusable and ruin everything else until you get to the point where you can edit the deck, and most players starting out are NOT going to bother sticking around after dealing with a worthless hand, field, and deck for the 12th time while the enemy can actually develop his board until the mid-late game consistently. Discuss and all that good stuff, my plans aren't absolute, criticize the shit out of 'em

  2. #2
    Idk man, I've only played the Elf Mage so I can't really speak to your experience until I create more characters, but I have found the deck perfectly adequate, haven't lost a game yet despite some rudimentary misplays, a couple mulligans, and suboptimal draws. Perhaps the elf mage is just particularly good, although I currently don't feel that is the case.
    1x GK Keep - Dekroma

  3. #3
    From my shin'hare starter experience, it was pretty bad. Not terrible, but still pretty bad. Wins mostly came down to abominating a vulture. I was originally planning on just tweaking the deck, in the end it got a full rebuild.

  4. #4
    Master Theorycrafter
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Parma, OH
    Human deck seems alright as well. I can't speak to the Shin'hare deck, but I played as Human Mage, had some close calls, but haven't lost yet.

  5. #5
    Following the in-game chat, this complaint seems to be specific only to the shin'hare decks. Players using any other races don't seem to have this kind of experience. Obviously the decks are far from optimal, that's normal for a basic starting deck, but they're certainly playable and capable of clearing the starting dungeon without significant problems (shard screw/flood and terrible opening hands aside).
    In-Game Name: Dorthonion

  6. #6
    Good to hear some of the other decks didn't get shafted as badly then. And to more easily explain the issue with the Shin'hare deck, at least the warrior variant, without going on tangents, it's a flood / buff-centered deck as far as the Rabbits are concerned without any real guarantees you can get the buffs rolling in time. No Onslaught or Bucktooh, only Evolve and Bannerbunny, the later of which is simply too slow and offers too little to do much so you're forced to rely on the cards that aren't inherently related to the Shin'Hare such as the Raptor and the Vulture. I dunno, personally I find that a flaw in design when it comes to the deck.

  7. #7
    I can confirm the human deck is great, I'm to the Mesa and haven't had any real troubles.

  8. #8
    I saw Pentachills streaming the Shin'hare deck and it did seem sub-par. I can really only speak to the Vennen deck though and it's... serviceable. I feel the Vennen deck was a little top heavy but it works well enough.

  9. #9
    I can confirm same experience with Necrotic Warriors so far. Clerics seem to be a bit better due to the Vultures instead of the Phantoms in the Warrrior deck. The 3rd encounter (the bridge one) wrecked me as a Necrotic Warrior because of the lack of synergy and scaling where the Outriders ( 0/5 troop which gains attack equal to defence when attacking) were just trampling me in a ridiculous manner. After 3-4 tries with nowhere near victory I immediately deleted the Necrotic Warrior character and started my current Necrotic Cleric.

    I hate the fact that they seem to be very themed as well. I mean why chose a race called Necrotic to just get Buffalos and irrelevant crap like that in your deck? Also, what is the point of that silly spell which makes you sacrifice a troop to give another +3/+3 when there's not many troops to be had anyway. Basically forcing you to have 1 massive troop which opens you up for removal...
    Last edited by IFlip92; 01-26-2016 at 09:59 PM.
    IGN: Lionhearts

  10. #10
    Not all starter decks are equally good.

    Vennen and shin hare starter decks are amongst some of the worst.

    They can win, you just kind of need to draw your cards in a very specific order.

    I think human, dwarf, and orc starters are all very strong, if people are struggling.

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