Page 4 of 6 FirstFirst ... 23456 LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 54

Thread: Rules Updates For Primal Dawn regarding Copies

  1. #31
    Quote Originally Posted by YourOpponent View Post
    Then you should go back to playing Hearts or Spades if you have a hard time understanding strategy.
    You talk about understanding strategy, but you should consider understanding balance a little more. If copies are now weaker than they were before, they can become less costly, which could easily mean more playable copy mechanics. Imagine a 4-cost 'Create a copy and put it into play' card before being potentially very powerful, since it can make Wild Growth permanent, but now you could get a 'Create a copy of a troop' for less resources. Balance and power level are maintained.
    In-game: Obsidian || Collector backer || Starting a guild for Newbies -- "The Cerulea Acadamy"
    Quote Originally Posted by Aradon View Post
    Cory is a man of unrelenting promises and optimism!

  2. #32
    Nothing to see here. Apology accepted. <3
    Last edited by hex_colin; 04-09-2016 at 04:45 PM.
    Hex: Shards of Fate KS || Producer

    "The Magi of the Carloth highlands are renowned for their enthusiasm and generosity."
    "Speed is far more important than size when determining the power of a strike."
    "One needs no armor if both your mind and your fist are faster than your enemy's."

  3. #33
    So I just cast scheme on an escalated card but the schemed copy was not escalated, is that a bug or am I misunderstanding how its supposed to work?

  4. #34
    Quote Originally Posted by magic_gazz View Post
    So I just cast scheme on an escalated card but the schemed copy was not escalated, is that a bug or am I misunderstanding how its supposed to work?
    Read scheme. It doesn't copy only make cards with the same name.

    Also I'm happy with the copy changes, they all make logical sense

  5. #35
    I don't presume to know better than who ever moderated this thread. But when you remove every post by someone but keep all replies with quotes you basically didn't remove it and just made the conversation hard to follow.

    If that was the intent or for some reason how you want it either just ignore or remove this i just wanted to point it out.

    PS. Still absolutely love literally every single part of this change and how it interacts with other cards best rule change ever!
    Last edited by wolzarg; 04-09-2016 at 12:51 PM.
    Member of The Unnamed Council - the Hex TCG PvE Guild
    Twice as nice as i seem and ten times as friendly.

  6. #36
    Quote Originally Posted by Biz View Post
    can you explain why using 1 countermagic on a card that gets copied twice only results in 1 activation instead of 2?
    Quote Originally Posted by ossuary View Post
    Activation of what, exactly? You'll need to clarify that statement.
    example:
    Burn has 2x Thunderfield Elder copy effects on it

    Play Burn
    Copy #1 goes onto chain.
    Opponent plays Countermagic on original Burn.
    Countermagic resolves, original Burn goes to crypt.
    Burn copy #1 resolves.

    Burn copy #2 never enters the chain, despite the wording being "when you play this, copy it"

  7. #37
    Like the changes/fixes.
    There definitely was an issue with copies made in Arena by the champ who creates copies of a card of your choice at the start of the match (Wild Root Dancer? -I'm sure you know who I mean anyway). It sounds like that might be the same as the one people mentioned for making copies on the 'stack'.

    I do find it a bit weird that the copy effect happens before you can interrupt -we're definitely into balance issues with changing that though.

    Quote Originally Posted by wolzarg View Post
    I don't presume to know better than who ever moderated this thread. But when you remove every post by someone but keep all replies with quotes you basically didn't remove it and just made the conversation hard to follow.
    Yep I just spent a minute looking for that/those posts too.
    Currently Most Wanted HEX development: AH overhaul

    http://i633.photobucket.com/albums/u...psee8e7213.png

    Our CzE Recruitment Thread: http://forums.cryptozoic.com/showthread.php?t=24252

  8. #38
    Quote Originally Posted by KeplerVerge View Post
    example:
    Burn has 2x Thunderfield Elder copy effects on it

    Play Burn
    Copy #1 goes onto chain.
    Opponent plays Countermagic on original Burn.
    Countermagic resolves, original Burn goes to crypt.
    Burn copy #1 resolves.

    Burn copy #2 never enters the chain, despite the wording being "when you play this, copy it"
    Okay, I see what you're saying now. That interaction has always felt a little strange to me. Rules as written it makes sense if you follow it all through logically, but it is definitely a little cumbersome and confusing.

    What is happening is that since the 2 copies are separate effects on the card, they're attempting to resolve one at a time, and your opponent gets a chance to respond to each event. If they completely interrupt the card before the 2nd trigger generates, it never generates, because the card has been interrupted.

    The first copy happens no matter what, because it's generated immediately when the card is first played. But that trigger that created the copy goes to the chain and generates an opportunity for the opponent to respond, which supersedes additional triggers until it is processed (due to LIFO), so interrupting the original at that point breaks the chain and prevents any further copies from happening. When the remaining copy triggers attempt to happen, they see that the card is now interrupted, so there is no longer a valid card on the chain TO copy, it's in the crypt.

    I honestly couldn't tell you whether or not this could / should / will be changed. That's a Hex rules guru question. It's not "technically" a bug, but I would say that it feels like an unfortunate side effect of how the chain resolution of multiple triggers happens. Only CZE can tell us whether or not they think it needs to be changed, or if they're going to work on doing so.
    --ossuary

    "Love all, trust a few, do wrong to none."
    - Shakespeare, All's Well That Ends Well

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by ossuary View Post
    Okay, I see what you're saying now. That interaction has always felt a little strange to me. Rules as written it makes sense if you follow it all through logically, but it is definitely a little cumbersome and confusing.

    What is happening is that since the 2 copies are separate effects on the card, they're attempting to resolve one at a time, and your opponent gets a chance to respond to each event. If they completely interrupt the card before the 2nd trigger generates, it never generates, because the card has been interrupted.

    The first copy happens no matter what, because it's generated immediately when the card is first played. But that trigger that created the copy goes to the chain and generates an opportunity for the opponent to respond, which supersedes additional triggers until it is processed (due to LIFO), so interrupting the original at that point breaks the chain and prevents any further copies from happening. When the remaining copy triggers attempt to happen, they see that the card is now interrupted, so there is no longer a valid card on the chain TO copy, it's in the crypt.

    I honestly couldn't tell you whether or not this could / should / will be changed. That's a Hex rules guru question. It's not "technically" a bug, but I would say that it feels like an unfortunate side effect of how the chain resolution of multiple triggers happens. Only CZE can tell us whether or not they think it needs to be changed, or if they're going to work on doing so.
    Just going to clarify this a little more specifically.

    When a copy is created, the power that created it usually has to specify where the copy goes (e.g. "... and put it into play"). There is a special rule for creating copies of cards that are on the chain, however, where those cards are automatically put onto the chain when they are created. This rule also automatically allows for the player to pick new targets for the copy.

    So what's happening is that since the resolution of the first "copy this" power results in priority being passed prior to the resolution of the second "copy this", the original Burn can be interrupted before it is copied. This means that when the second power resolves, it is copying a card in the crypt. But the game doesn't know where to put this second copy, since the copied card is not on the chain and the power doesn't specifically say to put the copy anywhere, so the created copy never enters any zone. It technically still exists, stuck in a special non-zone that the game uses for creation effects.

    And yes, Ossuary is correct that this is not a bug.

    Quote Originally Posted by wolzarg View Post
    I don't presume to know better than who ever moderated this thread. But when you remove every post by someone but keep all replies with quotes you basically didn't remove it and just made the conversation hard to follow.
    The only posts in this thread that were deleted by moderators were those that had been edited by their poster to be empty of content.
    Last edited by HEXahedron; 04-09-2016 at 04:33 PM.

  10. #40
    Devoted Emissary
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    Sweden
    Posts
    121
    Quote Originally Posted by ossuary View Post
    Okay, I see what you're saying now. That interaction has always felt a little strange to me. Rules as written it makes sense if you follow it all through logically, but it is definitely a little cumbersome and confusing.

    What is happening is that since the 2 copies are separate effects on the card, they're attempting to resolve one at a time, and your opponent gets a chance to respond to each event. If they completely interrupt the card before the 2nd trigger generates, it never generates, because the card has been interrupted.

    The first copy happens no matter what, because it's generated immediately when the card is first played. But that trigger that created the copy goes to the chain and generates an opportunity for the opponent to respond, which supersedes additional triggers until it is processed (due to LIFO), so interrupting the original at that point breaks the chain and prevents any further copies from happening. When the remaining copy triggers attempt to happen, they see that the card is now interrupted, so there is no longer a valid card on the chain TO copy, it's in the crypt.

    I honestly couldn't tell you whether or not this could / should / will be changed. That's a Hex rules guru question. It's not "technically" a bug, but I would say that it feels like an unfortunate side effect of how the chain resolution of multiple triggers happens. Only CZE can tell us whether or not they think it needs to be changed, or if they're going to work on doing so.
    Oh, now that makes sense! I've thought about that for a while, but couldn't get my head around it. So if you interrupt copy #1 instead of the original, you get a copy #2 right?
    IGN: Nollfem, warrior backer and former WoW TCG player. Compiling official rule articles and statements for the unofficial rulebook article over at the hex4newbies wiki!

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •